Tongue Broke Off

[throttleroller277]

I own a 2005 Forest River, Work & Play that I use as a race trailer for motorcycles. The only thing that I haul up in the front floor space is a couple sets of tires. Everything else that I haul (bikes, tools, gear, etc) is in the back over the axles.

Last weekend as I am headed out of town, the tongue broke off my trailer at the front of the box, where the A-frame tubes are welded to the frame. Obviously with the trailer rubbing along the ground on its belly, the propane lines and wire lume got trashed also. Fortunatley no other cars where involved.

After looking at the rectangular tubing to see what happened it is clear that when they welded the bottom side of the tube to the trailer frame they "blew through" the metal (which is only 1/16" wall thickness!!) causing a weak point. Both sides of the A-frame were this way. Over time it developed a crack starting at these holes, and once the cracked worked its way across, and out to the side walls, it just snapped off.

I called Forest River and talked to the Warranty and Repairs department about it, and they stated that the manufacturer of the frames at that time was Lippert Components (spelling?), and Forest River no longer uses them to build their frames. I called Lippert and left a message and haven't heard back.

This seems to be obvious that this is a manufacturing defect/problem, but yet I can't seem to get any support. Does anyone have any advise as to where I should go with this from here?

Also note: One of my buddies has the exact same trailer, and upon inspection of the A-frame on his trailer, it too has holes on the tubing where they blew through it when welding.

Inspect your trailer tongues everyone...before someone gets killed.

[KyDan]

Man, this stinks!!
Since you have on 05 you are well out of warranty.
I'm guessing your only recourse is to have a good truck,
frame shop weld it back.
They can use some "scabs" to beef it up at the area in question
and should be able to make it stronger than new for not a whole
lot of money.

You can always file a complaint to the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/

Good luck!!

[Bama Rambler]

I echo Dan's suggestion about getting a good welding shop to repair it. I'd also report it to the NHTSA. You never know, it may save someones life.

[Radio]

Originally Posted by KyDan

You can always file a complaint to the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/

YES ABSOLUTELY!! Report this to the NHTSA. There may be hundreds of frames just like this one out there waiting to fail with disastrous results. If the owners are all notified then they can have (relatively) simple repairs made, even if at their own expense, that could save lives and thousands of dollars in repairs.

Not to mention this isn't a warranty issue IMHO. This is just bad workmanship or material that goes beyond warranty. The manufacturers have an obligation to provide a safe product.

[rockwood06]

I post some questions about Lippert frames not too long ago because of some things I heard. I was just checking the internet about the frame under my camper. Checked some other forums and Lippert is a very big topic. One thread that I was reading, the member said that the extrior walls to his TT were sagging and the cabinets had pull away from the ceiling about 1/2", his rig is a 2007 Springdale and it's in the shop. It was mentioned that Lippert builds the frames to manufactures spec so all Lippert frames do not have the same design, some people may have problems and some may not. At this time I can not find out what frame is supporting mine because the camper is two hours away. Most concerns have always been Carlisle tires, now it's the frames...what next? It's a shame that we pay for poor eingineering and sloppy workmanship.

[LadyWindrider]

From last post "It's a shame that we pay for poor engineering and sloppy workmanship. " Not a shame, it's what we have done to ourselves. During the gas shortage in the 70's we showed that we would accept poor engineering and sloppy workmanship by buying Japanese junk cars, just to save a few cents on gasoline. We put up with lack of parts, ridiculous pricing, and long waits for repairs, just to make Honda and Toyota Major players in the auto industry. They have even passed our own GM, Ford, and Chrysler. What next? We spend our money at Walmart on Chinese stuff made by child labor, whiles Sears and J.C. Penny's suffer trying to sell American products to a consumer that is more concerned over a few dollars saved immediately rather than the long-term cost of buying a cheap product that needs replacing 3 times before one good one would wear out. We throw stuff away like candy wrappers, televisions, microwaves, washing machines, and now with the help of own government even cars. We have forced the manufacturer to give us what we demand, CHEAP! Now when it breaks we want to complain. Go to the mirror and let the person you see there have it, because he/she is mostly at fault. It's not poor engineering and sloppy workmanship, it's little engineering and lack of proper training for the worker because this takes MONEY and we, as Americans have proven we're NOT willing to pay for it. I'll step down now. I am sorry to hear about this and any other problems I read on here, and have my own with my trailer. We shouldn't have any problems, but we do, and the only one I can blame is ourselves. We made our bed, now it's time to sleep in it, and I'm afraid it will be a long winter's night.

[rockwood06]

Originally Posted by windrider

From last post "It's a shame that we pay for poor engineering and sloppy workmanship. " Not a shame, it's what we have done to ourselves. During the gas shortage in the 70's we showed that we would accept poor engineering and sloppy workmanship by buying Japanese junk cars, just to save a few cents on gasoline. We put up with lack of parts, ridiculous pricing, and long waits for repairs, just to make Honda and Toyota Major players in the auto industry. They have even passed our own GM, Ford, and Chrysler. What next? We spend our money at Walmart on Chinese stuff made by child labor, whiles Sears and J.C. Penny's suffer trying to sell American products to a consumer that is more concerned over a few dollars saved immediately rather than the long-term cost of buying a cheap product that needs replacing 3 times before one good one would wear out. We throw stuff away like candy wrappers, televisions, microwaves, washing machines, and now with the help of own government even cars. We have forced the manufacturer to give us what we demand, CHEAP! Now when it breaks we want to complain. Go to the mirror and let the person you see there have it, because he/she is mostly at fault. It's not poor engineering and sloppy workmanship, it's little engineering and lack of proper training for the worker because this takes MONEY and we, as Americans have proven we're NOT willing to pay for it. I'll step down now. I am sorry to hear about this and any other problems I read on here, and have my own with my trailer. We shouldn't have any problems, but we do, and the only one I can blame is ourselves. We made our bed, now it's time to sleep in it, and I'm afraid it will be a long winter's night.

Your statements in your post is completely true,"WE THE PEOPLE" have allow this to happen. I do not have a problem paying a good money for a good product, but where can one buy a good product. As far as engineering, if it's little engineering then it's poor engineering, as far as sloppy workmanship, if it is lack of training then those whom are doing the training can only pass on what they know so there training was limited therefore it becames sloppy workmanship....One thing that was not mentioned is quality control, this step is to over see the final product, to catch engineering, workmanship and tooling problems. Is this a step that was taken out to make a product cheaper or a lack of training. When one makes $2.00 an hour, then why should they care, it's all about how much money a company can make without a lot of over head. As long as we pay good money for products that last a short time we will be back to buy them over and over again now that's "good engineering".

[cfsoistman]

As for the statement of spending our money at Walmart, well thanks to the geniuses over in DC along with living in Maryland "THE TAX STATE" what we have left in our paychecks limits what we need to buy and where we can afford to buy it. It's not always what we want to do but what we're forced to do to get by. Wait until this Federal Health Insurance Bill kicks in, we'll all have less in our pockets but we'll be taking care of, the too many that never got off their butts to do anything with their lives, or snuck across the border. At the rate we're getting taxed and soon to be more, What are we supposed to live off of?

I guess the old IRS joke is becoming reality. "HOW MUCH DID YOU MAKE LAST YEAR?" SEND IT IN!!!!!!!

[08flagvlite]

I agree with the quality issues of the products made today. And, I have yet to see a Jap produced 2500, or 3500 truck! If you need that to pull your rig, you gotta go with the big 3!! That shows who has the truck world by the towing/hauling capacities. No Jap dualies, or diesels,for that matter. Something to think about...... Randy

[KyDan]

Wow, how did we get from an American built broken frame to
Jap bashing......
And while you've got me here--- My last truck,
a Chevy S10 Blazer with the big V6 was blowing smoke
at 95000 and I took good care of it.
My previous car was a Ford Taurus.
It blew head gaskets at 65000 miles exactly 1 year after
the "free extended head gasket" warranty had expired.
We traded it in on a Nissan Maxima.
Absolutely no problems with that one.
Detroit brought a LOT of their problems on themsleves.

This opinion from a guy who just retired from 37 years
as a union member and employee of GE.

If you want to get all political then please move to the
political soap box er I mean forum!

If you've got suggestions on how to fix a broken frame
this is the place.

[rockwood06]

Originally Posted by KyDan

Wow, how did we get from an American built broken frame to
Jap bashing......
And while you've got me here--- My last truck,
a Chevy S10 Blazer with the big V6 was blowing smoke
at 95000 and I took good care of it.
My previous car was a Ford Taurus.
It blew head gaskets at 65000 miles exactly 1 year after
the "free extended head gasket" warranty had expired.
We traded it in on a Nissan Maxima.
Absolutely no problems with that one.
Detroit brought a LOT of their problems on themsleves.

This opinion from a guy who just retired from 37 years
as a union member and employee of GE.

If you want to get all political then please move to the
political soap box er I mean forum!

If you've got suggestions on how to fix a broken frame
this is the place.

Starting with the frames from Lippert, my under standing is that Lippert frames are made in China and are imported in, so to me that means not American made. (Broken Frames)

As far as vehicles go, I have 6 GM vehicles in my driveway, three trucks/SUV and three cars, three were bought new and three were bought used no major problems other then normal wear and tear. I drive 45,000 miles a year just back and forth to work. Just not too long ago I retired a 1995 Chevy Astro Van with 300,016 miles on it, the reason I got read of it is because the electrical system was failing, it had a 4.3 V-6 from the factory, the same trans and rear and I bought this van used and it had 45,000 miles on it. The only other vehicle I had was a Ford F-150 small block engine and it used almost as much gas as my 1994 GMC Suburban did with a 454 in it, I put 1,500 miles on it and then sold it.

I am an active member out of Local #99 Operator Engineers Union in Washington DC of 15 years.

The Political side of this Country is why we are having so many problems with poor quality imports, little or no regulations and what regulations there are they are not cought until someone is effected, and to make thing worst the RV industry here in the U.S. has little or no regulations. If there was then we would be paying a higher price for our rigs, but we want a cheaper price, so lets but saftey a side...Who needs it......This is a poor out look on life.

As far as fixing things and try to re-engineer you rig after one has paid for it, this is a Great forum to be a part of, the people here are great and always trying to help one another.....This is my opinion as an active union member.

Yes, we may be getting out of hand with this thread, I can fell tension starting to build, Just trying to clear up facts from fiction. The quality of a product is ones opinion but facts are the end result...

[NWJeeper]

First off KYdan, you hit things right on the head when it comes to the auto industry, they brought it on themselves.

As for the trailer tongue issue, I agree totally with Radio that it should be reported to DOT and NHTSA, pronto!

Ouside of that it sounds like this isn't an isolated case and therefore I am sensing a possible class action lawsuit???? I'm no lawyer and don't believe in suing someone because you spilt hot coffee on yourself but this is a very serious matter that could mean the loss of life and it shouldn't be up to you to have to pay for the repairs.

[KyDan]

Originally Posted by rockwood06

Starting with the frames from Lippert, my under standing is that Lippert frames are made in China and are imported in, so to me that means not American made. (Broken Frames).

http://www.lippertcomponents.com/

Read their website. They say nothing about importing.
They brag about being a multi state company.
It would take more research than I am willing to do but
it sounds to me like they are a US company.

[rockwood06]

Originally Posted by KyDan

http://www.lippertcomponents.com/

Read their website. They say nothing about importing.
They brag about being a multi state company.
It would take more research than I am willing to do but
it sounds to me like they are a US company.

KyDan good morning, Some of the info I have been getting did not say that Lippert was an overseas company, it's just that there frames are made overseas just like other American companies. This info came from another RV Forum....escapeesrv.com. When I first heard of this I just ask a question here on Forest River Forum to see if anyone else knew of an Imported frame. On escapeesrv.com someone else must have done the reserach. In a few years my wife and I plan on retiring and sell everthing then hit the road with an RV, so she has been getting alot of good info from this site on what to do and what to buy, so this was something that she had brought to my attenion and then I wanted to pass this info on to the members here. It odd that another member posted about his frame breaking apart right around the time I recieved this info about Lippert frames.

[KyDan]

I don't really care enough to do the research.
I'm stuck with the trailer in my driveway anyway!

OTOH, I would not want to go around telling folks Lippert frames
were imported from China unless I was sure.
Just because someone said so on another forum is not good
enough. I'm not saying the frames aren't imported but I am not
ready to go telling folks that unless I'm pretty sure.
I'm not pretty sure at this point.

To your query-- I hope this doesn't scare you away.
The broken frames were both toy haulers. Those type trailers
are subject to somewhat different stresses than normal
trailers. There have not been a lot of folks complaining here
about frame problems.

We get folks with water leaks and other problems but frames-
thankfully- have been pretty low on the radar.
I hope it stays that way!!

Good luck!

[rockwood06]

Originally Posted by KyDan

I don't really care enough to do the research.
I'm stuck with the trailer in my driveway anyway!

OTOH, I would not want to go around telling folks Lippert frames
were imported from China unless I was sure.
Just because someone said so on another forum is not good
enough. I'm not saying the frames aren't imported but I am not
ready to go telling folks that unless I'm pretty sure.
I'm not pretty sure at this point.

To your query-- I hope this doesn't scare you away.
The broken frames were both toy haulers. Those type trailers
are subject to somewhat different stresses than normal
trailers. There have not been a lot of folks complaining here
about frame problems.

We get folks with water leaks and other problems but frames-
thankfully- have been pretty low on the radar.
I hope it stays that way!!

Good luck!

I am sorry if everyone has taken my info the wrong way. No where in this thread did I tell folks Quote; "that Lippert frames were made is China" I explained this in post #14, I just ask the question if any has heard of it based on the info I received, to determine facts form fiction. So please give me more credit then that. I am not here to pass on incorrect info.