Allison 2500 filter change on Berk 38A?

[planopat]

Have heard its required to change transmission filter at 6000 miles but can't find verification in Op Manual or Op Manual schedules. The prognostics thing is gibberish to me. Is prognostics enabled on FR/Freightliner?

[Oscarvan]

I do not believe prognostics is enabled on our units.

It's in your transmission manual. (Download from WEB if your coach did not come with one....)

https://www.rvtechlibrary.com/transm..._operators.pdf

You have the 2500MH

Best I can tell there are TWO filters on ours. One is the internal main filter.... It is NOT replaced unless the tranny is rebuilt. (Page 56)

Then the book mentions the Auxiliary Lube, which appears to be optional, and not installed on ours.... There's what appears to be a decent discussion on that here:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f125/lube...ere-60021.html

Here's an official Allison pub, and although it also LISTS the auxiliary lube filter (interval but not part #) for the 1000/2500 it doesn't talk any further about it there, but it DOES show it's location for the 3000/4000 series.

http://beamalarm.com/foretravel-link...e-sa5429EN.pdf

The other (the one you're talking about) is the external control filter. First at 5000 then every 50K/24months

https://dragonship.blog/external-tra...ontrol-filter/

[planopat]

Yup, there it was, right there on page 56. "….initial filter change... during the first 8000 (5000 miles)…" Thanks Oscar.

[Oscarvan]

My pleasure..... Yeah, that ones hiding. I knew about it from Camp Freightliner.

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by planopat

Yup, there it was, right there on page 56. "….initial filter change... during the first 8000 (5000 miles)…" Thanks Oscar.

You have to drop the pan to change the Internal Filter. If it were me Id also change the fluid since yo have to drain it to drop the pan, or at lease replace the fluid I drained out with fresh fluid.

Id also change the Spin On filter as well.

Fluid/Filters are cheap, transmissions............ not so much.

[Oscarvan]

Originally Posted by DouglasReid

You have to drop the pan to change the Internal Filter. If it were me Id also change the fluid since yo have to drain it to drop the pan, or at lease replace the fluid I drained out with fresh fluid.

Id also change the Spin On filter as well.

Fluid/Filters are cheap, transmissions............ not so much.

BAD INFO ALERT.

What model BERK do YOU have?

There is on this model (Allison 2500) ONE internal filter and it is not changed unless rebuild.

There is ONE external filter, the one we're talking about and it is replaced once at 5000 and then with every fluid change 50K/24 months.

[DouglasReid]

[QUOTE=Oscarvan;2010810]BAD INFO ALERT.

What model BERK do YOU have?

I have an Allison 1000, but their maintenance is very similar. I guess that unless you own the Precise Same RV or vehicle nobody should attempt to be helpful, is that your point

There is on this model (Allison 2500) ONE internal filter and it is not changed unless rebuild.

That was old Allison info, as far as the 1000 went. Now they recommend to change the internal filter with every fluid change. This happened went they went from a simple screen to an actual filter. Small additional expense actually, but a bit of a PITA to have to drop the pan instead of using the drain valve only.

There is ONE external filter, the one we're talking about and it is replaced once at 5000 and then with every fluid change 50K/24 months.

The reply I posted two stated his internal filter needed to be changed. This CANNOT be done unless you drain the pan and drop it. It seemed to be excessive to me to do so this early. Your referencing the external filter makes much more sense.

ALL that said.............Kindly take your sarcasm and wit elsewhere, it is neither wanted nor appreciated.

[planopat]

Turns out that Oscar's info is 100% correct for the 2500 in a Berk. Don't know about the 1000. No need to be snarky. Peace.

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by planopat

Turns out that Oscar's info is 100% correct for the 2500 in a Berk. Don't know about the 1000. No need to be snarky. Peace.

I agree just giving back what was given, in a nice manner

[Oscarvan]

[QUOTE=DouglasReid;2010871]

Originally Posted by Oscarvan

BAD INFO ALERT.

I have an Allison 1000, but their maintenance is very similar. I guess that unless you own the Precise Same RV or vehicle nobody should attempt to be helpful, is that your point

No they are not very similar. There are considerable differences in operation and maintenance. This is a brand specific page where people try to get information on various model Berkshires. The operation, maintenance and improvement of. And we have our hands full trying to keep it straight. People walking in and telling us non-specifically how to do things because that's what they do on their XYZ is not helpful at best, and potentially harmful at worst. And it doesn't matter wether you have a Prevost or a Popup. No sarcasm or wit in there.

That said, this caught my eye: "This happened went they went from a simple screen to an actual filter." So to make 1000% sure that we have our stuff straight I'll see if I can get someone at Allison on the horn to ask if they didn't do something similar to the 2500MH. (See, it's not just a 2500, it's a 2500MH) especially since the book is somewhat ambiguous.

I will report back. At the end of the day its' about what's right, not who's right.

[Oscarvan]

And the epilogue..... Just got off the phone with Allison, there is NO internal filter in the 2500MH that needs replacing. Just the screen and that stays put unless rebuilding.

So like we said earlier: 5000 for the spin on, then every 50K/24M spin on and fluid.

[oldkeywest91]

[gordonsick]

Originally Posted by Oscarvan

And the epilogue..... Just got off the phone with Allison, there is NO internal filter in the 2500MH that needs replacing. Just the screen and that stays put unless rebuilding.

So like we said earlier: 5000 for the spin on, then every 50K/24M spin on and fluid.

Oscar,
This isn't the information I get when I read the Allison service bulletin at http://www.rvmobilelube.com/1099c.pdf

Go to Page 5 and you'll see the recommendations for the 1000 and 2000 Product Families Transmissions.

Under Filter, you will see that there in an internal filter that is changed when the transmission is overhauled. I'm pretty sure I've read about this internal filter in other documents that they have.

For filters, the initial change filter and fluid change is at 50,000 miles or 2000 hours, and subsequent filter changes are at 50,000 miles, 2000 hours or 24 months, whichever comes first.

And, if you are using the full synthetic fluid meeting the TES 295 spec, the subsequent fluid change is at 100,000 miles or 4000 hours or 48 months, whichever comes first.

My Allison tranny came with TranSynd, which meets the TES 295 spec, so I can use the longer service periods. And, a fluid change only changes half of the fluid, so you can't switch from a non-295 spec to a 295 spec easily.

–Gordon

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by gordonsick

My Allison tranny came with TranSynd, which meets the TES 295 spec, so I can use the longer service periods. And, a fluid change only changes half of the fluid, so you can't switch from a non-295 spec to a 295 spec easily.

That is because there is no way to drain the Torque Converter. You can use a Double Drain method and get a 90% fluid change to Transynd or other TES-295 fluid.

There is a retired Allison Fluids Engineer who developed Transynd and posts occasionally on some of the forums under the name of MrTransynd who recommends this method

[gordonsick]

Douglas,
I've seen that recommendation for switching from 395 to 295 spec, and I've seen Allison specifically recommending against it.

–Gordon

[Oscarvan]

Originally Posted by gordonsick

Oscar,
This isn't the information I get when I read the Allison service bulletin at http://www.rvmobilelube.com/1099c.pdf

Go to Page 5 and you'll see the recommendations for the 1000 and 2000 Product Families Transmissions.

Under Filter, you will see that there in an internal filter that is changed when the transmission is overhauled. I'm pretty sure I've read about this internal filter in other documents that they have.

For filters, the initial change filter and fluid change is at 50,000 miles or 2000 hours, and subsequent filter changes are at 50,000 miles, 2000 hours or 24 months, whichever comes first.

And, if you are using the full synthetic fluid meeting the TES 295 spec, the subsequent fluid change is at 100,000 miles or 4000 hours or 48 months, whichever comes first.

My Allison tranny came with TranSynd, which meets the TES 295 spec, so I can use the longer service periods. And, a fluid change only changes half of the fluid, so you can't switch from a non-295 spec to a 295 spec easily.

–Gordon

So you want to go 100,000 miles on the fluid. It appears that is what it says. Guess the tech at Allison did not remember the details of this memo....

Do we agree the spin on is 50,000 and that there is no auxiliary/lube on the 2500M? Also the manual that came with my coach CLEARLY states that the spin on (not the fluid) shall be changed at 5000 and THEN the interval as we are discussing.

All that said..... The "severe" duty is still 50,000 for the 100% TES295 fluid. Since the 2500MH is limited to a 5K trailer weight on my coach and I pull close to that or a skosh over that on a regular basis it won't hurt for me to stick to the tighter schedule. There is an argument to be made that it's working pretty hard. Reason they went to the 3000 after my model year.....

Then again, most of the wear and tear on the fluid is from heat and I have the transmission temp up on the top 3 on my LBCU favorites so I'm looking at it all day and I have never seen it above 195ºF, while it sits around 175º in summer (barely above the "hot" measuring min temp) and 140º in winter.....

[gordonsick]

Oscar,
I've downloaded several Allison documents, and they seem to provide slightly different views. I just chose that one because it was easy to find on the web. I don't think the 100,000 miles appears in all of their documents. In practice, with a motorhome it is trumped by the 48 months and the filter usually hits 24 months first.

I'm working on the 24 filter and 48 fluid cycle, since I've done my first cycle.

Like you, I've never found my Allison tranny run over 190° F, and that includes a lot of full throttle on long steep 7% hills. My fluid never has the burnt look of prior overheating.

Allison says that "Severe service" is stop and go service like a school bus, garbage truck, etc. Our driving is usually in 5th or 6th gear with the torque converter locked out. They classify that as not severe.

Cummins also rates our motorhome driving as not severe, so they rate my ISB 6.7 engine oil and filter as good for 15,000 miles or 1 year, whichever comes first.

–Gordon

[Oscarvan]

Originally Posted by gordonsick

Oscar,
I've downloaded several Allison documents, and they seem to provide slightly different views. I just chose that one because it was easy to find on the web. I don't think the 100,000 miles appears in all of their documents. In practice, with a motorhome it is trumped by the 48 months and the filter usually hits 24 months first.

I'm working on the 24 filter and 48 fluid cycle, since I've done my first cycle.

Like you, I've never found my Allison tranny run over 190° F, and that includes a lot of full throttle on long steep 7% hills. My fluid never has the burnt look of prior overheating.

Allison says that "Severe service" is stop and go service like a school bus, garbage truck, etc. Our driving is usually in 5th or 6th gear with the torque converter locked out. They classify that as not severe.

Cummins also rates our motorhome driving as not severe, so they rate my ISB 6.7 engine oil and filter as good for 15,000 miles or 1 year, whichever comes first.

–Gordon

I am not disagreeing with you. And yes, the time limits come into play for 90% of us well before any mileage limits. Still, it certainly won't hurt to change the fluid more often.

I guess I'm a little shell shocked as I am currently replacing the transmission on my wife's Denali which cratered with normal use at 128,000 miles after I changed the fluid and filter at 100,000 per the book.....