Any tips on the tankless water heater

[I-RV]

Originally Posted by tmmar

Hank,
So basically I should set the controls to heat the water to a temperature so that it can be used 'straight' without mixing in cold water to make it comfortable. Is that correct?
Tom

Tom
You got it! When I use the shower, I start the water flow full on at the hot setting. Wait two minutes and test; if too cool, slow the flow or up the temp setting. If too hot, lower the temp setting and for those with Gen 1, go to the lower setting. If still too hot, push the shower control off and quickly move ever so slightly to a cooler setting and pull open. This generally isn't easy, but that's how the Girard operates. Basically, you control the temperature by playing with flow. The higher pressure that you have coming in, the better.
Hank

[tmmar]

Stephen,
You should not be pulling water from your tank unless the water pump is running. I would check to make sure that the water pump is not on.
As for getting the air out, turn on all of the taps (one at a time) and let the water run until you get a steady stream without any 'sputtering'.
Tom

[stephencamiolo]

Worked great! I had the pump on
Thanks Tom


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[tmmar]

Originally Posted by I-RV

Tom
Whether you have the Gen 1 or 2 Girard Tankless, it will be very cantankerous. You need to understand how it works if you want to come close to mastering it. The basics of its operation are:

1. Turn on water, the Girard senses flow and fires the burner at the BTU setting (High/Lo for Gen 1 and variable for gen 2).

2. If the water is set very low by you, the water in the heater will reach 122 degrees very fast and shut down for a moment. You will then get very hot water at the slow flow followed by cold and then hot again - not good!

3. So it is too hot, so you set the faucet flow higher and you get continuous very hot water without cold spurts. Problem is that you can't get higher flow, which is dictated by your water source pressure.

4. To reduce the high temperature, you then need to vary the BTU setting (say to low for Gen 1 or lower temp with Gen2). This may or may not work.

5. To reduce too high temps, you might think about mixing some cold water. Girard frowns upon this, because you will lessen the flow through the heater and it will then even get hotter and shut down. Another problem is that the shower valve in the Berkshires doesn't mix hot and cold water very good.

6. Basically, the Girard water heater has absolutely no output temperature control. With a hot water faucet open, all the Girard knows is fire the burner at your setting and shut down if the temperature reaches 122 degrees. This leaves you to try to control temperature with water flow setting which isn't always easy and is compounded by having different pressures at different parks.

The Girard Tankless would be an excellent heater if it had a variable flow gas valve with a controller that compared your desired temperature (set on your wall) with the actual output temperature. The controller would constantly adjust the burner's gas flow to achieve the desired temperature. Water flow would be of hardly an issue. Unfortunately, the Girard does not work that way, but I believe the Precision Temp RV-500 does.

Are there any Berkshire owners with an after-market Precision Temp installed, Like to hear from you.

Hank

Is it just me or does it seem that a rocket science degree needed just to get some continuous hot water with this tankless water heater? With the old propane/electric water heater you just turned it on and you had a steady flow of hot water. OK, you may not be able to take a 15 minute continuous shower and may have to wait a few minutes between showers, but it was a lot easier than the Girard system. Now you need to make sure that the temp is set on the control knob, that your water pressure coming in is sufficient, that you take into account the ambient temperature of water coming in, that you make sure that there is no air in the system, and on and on.
Seems like Girard, or someone, should be able to come up with a system that is easier to use and provide the same level of continuous hot water without all the adjustments and refinements that need to be made continuous trial and error tests.
I guess I am just getting very frustrated with this 'better' system.
Tom

[Phil57]

Tom their is it's called Aqua Hot and comes on most DP now. Well most that cost 300,000 and up.
In the mean time I think you will get the hang if the Garrard It's a little temperaments but I find it worth while.


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[I-RV]

Tom
I totally agree with you. As I stated, I believe that the Precision Temp RV 500 is better. It monitors the output temperature and controls the gas automatically. That is the way it should be. See the Specification section and Controls paragraph of....

http://www.precisiontemp.com/rv-500-...-water-heater/

The Precison Temp is almost the same size as the Girard; if it wasn't for the price I would probably change. I wish that FR would awake up. I guess that because the Girard is about half the cost of the Precision Temp, FR is trying to save a nickle when compar to the cost of the MH, IMHO!

Hank

[hbjoe3]

My Garrard must be stuck on full temp, I have it set as low as I can and the cold water in cool enough. When the hot comes on full it is scolding, and then it goes cold. The little flap valve is clean. DW is not happy.

[Gottawonder]

Originally Posted by hbjoe3

My Garrard must be stuck on full temp, I have it set as low as I can and the cold water in cool enough. When the hot comes on full it is scolding, and then it goes cold. The little flap valve is clean. DW is not happy.

Do you have the model with the temp control in the bathroom cabinet? Looks like you have a new coach so I'm guessing so.

The #1 solution in most cases is to be sure you don't have air in the lines. Run both the hot water and cold water on each tap until they're not sputtering. When I hook up city water the first thing i do is run the outside shower to bleed any air that was in the hose. Once you've run all the faucets and have the air out of the lines, turn the hot water on and wait 60-90 seconds...it should be stable at that point. I've found it very hard to convince DW not to try to manage water temp using hot and cold water. Hot on all the way in the shower then adjust the temperature knob for a comfortable but not hot shower. If hotter water wanted, turn DOWN the hot water a little. that slows the flow thorough the tankless and heats the water more before it sends it on to the shower.

Once my lines were bled, we had stable temps. If shower on full blast was too cool then we'd bump the temperature control and wait 60 seconds. Smooth sailing.


Gotttawonder

[hbjoe3]

Thanks, I have no sputtering at all at any of the outlets. Yes ours in the one with the knob in the bathroom cabinet. The knob is currently set to low.

[Gottawonder]

Originally Posted by hbjoe3

Thanks, I have no sputtering at all at any of the outlets. Yes ours in the one with the knob in the bathroom cabinet. The knob is currently set to low.

I understand your frustration. I realize I was restating things you may have read here before, but often air in the system is the culprit. Mine was all over the map until I ran the washing machine through part of a cycle (tip I got here.)

[Phil57]

Originally Posted by hbjoe3

My Garrard must be stuck on full temp, I have it set as low as I can and the cold water in cool enough. When the hot comes on full it is scolding, and then it goes cold. The little flap valve is clean. DW is not happy.

I can only make a guess but it sounds like your WP is to low. It works best at 50# and over up to 60#. If you have a WP regulator with a gage it is helpful.


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[hbjoe3]

I think the pressure regulator is fixed at 40#, so I will get an adjustable one, thanks for the tip.

I will also check with the dealer, again, to make sure that the heater is not tripping the high temp thermostat due to some malfunction.

Dealer said they could not replicate, could be their WP is higher.

Thanks,
Joe

[Phil57]

Joe try it with out the regulator. As long as the WP isn't to high it won't hurt for a day or so. At 40# mine will do the same thing. Also not sure if you have the shower head that mixes in air but that helps also.
Good luck and let us know how it works.


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[Gottawonder]

I think I have a 40psi on mine but a bump to 50 is probably in the cards.

[Phil57]

Originally Posted by Gottawonder

I think I have a 40psi on mine but a bump to 50 is probably in the cards.

Dave how does the windshield shade work?



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[Gottawonder]

Originally Posted by Phil57

Dave how does the windshield shade work?



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Beats me. I was waiting on you to come down and show me how to install it

[Phil57]

I'll be there in early March.


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[I-RV]

Just wondering what a Window Shade has to do with a water heater? Question: has anyone replaced their shower control with another type? It seems to me that the factory valve cannot easily mix hot with cold and in essence I feel a major culprit with trying to get good showers. I am aware that the way the Girard works that you should not mix cold, but adjust the flow. But, probably a little mix of cold could sometimes help.

[psw757]

Originally Posted by I-RV

Just wondering what a Window Shade has to do with a water heater? Question: has anyone replaced their shower control with another type? It seems to me that the factory valve cannot easily mix hot with cold and in essence I feel a major culprit with trying to get good showers. I am aware that the way the Girard works that you should not mix cold, but adjust the flow. But, probably a little mix of cold could sometimes help.

I have found that rather than constantly adjusting the thermostat in our medicine cabinet we have it set slightly past 12'oclock position. If water is still a little too hot with max flow on hot, if cold is just cracked open a hair it works perfectly. No cycling from hot to cold etc....

Forest River told me there were a bunch of thermostats recently that had screws through or damaged/crimped wires which essentially grounded the thermostat to default high setting regardless of the setting. This causes the water to over temp shutoff burner and you get the cold blast and then cycle repeats itself.

Not always simply a water pressure/flow issue. They ran a new wire on mine and it works like a champ now.

[duradiesel]

We had all the same troubles with our water heater. Took out the water

filter & installed a 55 to 60 pressure regulator & solved all our problems.

Still don't have real hot water for the kitchen sink.




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2006 GMC 2500 Durmax