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Old 08-17-2015, 08:01 PM   #31
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The "ownership" is just the beginning of the problem, and from there it filters down. These things are made here in the USA for cryin out loud. We're supposed to be the best. And in some things we are, but it usually is forced upon us to make a better product to compete with a like product made overseas.
Auto industry is the perfect example. Cr-p turned out until the 70's when the imports came into their own, with better quality and workmenship. And they improved every year, until the US makers had to change. Granted, it took em awhile, but they did change and now turn out a fairly decant product.
Unfortunately, there is no competition for US made rv's, no matter the cost, inexpensive trailer or a 200 grand Berk.
As long as there is no outside influence on FR or others, there is no incentive for them to improve.
As long as their not held accountable for the poop that comes off the assembly line, the "ownership" will not change.
Like everything else that is forced upon a big company, it's going to take a high profile case where something unfortunate happens to a lot of people as a result of lack of quality control and shoddy workmenship being the cause.
I'll step off my soapbox now.
Grumpy
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Old 08-17-2015, 08:27 PM   #32
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Who's products would you buy that would be any better?

Rich

Winnebago. I have owned three Forest River products, still have one and a 2014 Winnebago Aspect 30J. The Winnebago has never been back to the shop. Huge difference in quality and not that much more money...especially when you consider down time, added expense for repairs, length of service and how well they hold their value.
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Old 08-17-2015, 08:34 PM   #33
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I'll turn the page a little. I have had very few problems with my Berkshire. Yes I did have a few on the shake down, but for the most part I have been lucky.

Knock on wood.
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Old 08-17-2015, 08:48 PM   #34
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That's just it, you shouldn't have to rely on "luck" or "knock on wood".
Explain how the same workers who build the same units day after day, turn out a rig that is almost trouble free, while the next one comes off the line a rolling lemon? How can slides be installed correctly in one product line while on another it dosen't work right from the start.
Worse yet, why was it not caught by the supposed "quality control" personal?
It's basically a crap shoot as to whether or not the rig you get is a good one or not.
There is another thread in the trailer section about a 6 month old trailer loosing the side panels while running down the road. Both sides, different times.
This is a quality made in the USA product?
This is a fault of the "ownership" not caring about anything but the profit's. If they did care, it would filter down to the workers.
If I as a worker, know that these things get shipped out no matter what short cuts were taken, and I know that mgt. dosen't care, why should I?
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Old 08-17-2015, 09:03 PM   #35
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What's the employee turn over rate at FR?

How long does a certain employee stay at the same position in the line?

Does the same employee do the same rigging each and every day?

How much do these employees get paid?

Can they make more at a McDonald's that pays $15 an hour?

Are these summer jobs for some of them?


These are the questions that need answers. Then we can judge the quality of workers. I'll take luck any day.
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Old 08-17-2015, 09:11 PM   #36
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What's the employee turn over rate at FR?

How long does a certain employee stay at the same position in the line?

Does the same employee do the same rigging each and every day?

How much do these employees get paid?

Can they make more at a McDonald's that pays $15 an hour?

Are these summer jobs for some of them?


These are the questions that need answers. Then we can judge the quality of workers. I'll take luck any day.
I think you forgot the most important question. Was the work done early on Monday or late on Friday?
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Old 08-17-2015, 10:13 PM   #37
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tnbendr I feel your pain! I wont go into my long tale now, but I do see in your signature you have a 2015. That plays in your favor for now. We own a 2012, and recently when I called FR for a service appointment after numerous rounds of phone tag it took Mike 9 days to tell me that FR is no longer working on units unless it is under warranty. He further stated that he could refer me to other shops in the area, but they could only work on warranty issues at this time. Imagine my surprise when he basically told me that FR is turning out too many products with too many issues, go figure!
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Old 08-17-2015, 10:23 PM   #38
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tnbendr I feel your pain! I wont go into my long tale now, but I do see in your signature you have a 2015. That plays in your favor for now. We own a 2012, and recently when I called FR for a service appointment after numerous rounds of phone tag it took Mike 9 days to tell me that FR is no longer working on units unless it is under warranty. He further stated that he could refer me to other shops in the area, but they could only work on warranty issues at this time. Imagine my surprise when he basically told me that FR is turning out too many products with too many issues, go figure!
Thanks wm1964...I'm really sorry to hear that because of too many problems they have to turn you away. I just commented on another post in this forum about how Randy's team does a wonderful job of cleaning up after the sloppy production work, but now they find themselves unable to keep up with the amount of issues? That's becoming pitiful! Maybe Warren Buffet ought to really look at what he bought into...but then I guess the profit is there.
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Old 08-18-2015, 09:11 AM   #39
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Do not forget,,, the faster they can get this Cr@p off the end of the line,,,
The more money they make !!!
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Old 08-18-2015, 09:27 AM   #40
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When I bought my new trailer a couple years ago I was amazed by all the things wrong with it. Some were design errors and some were just sloppy workmanship. I asked my dealer if high end trailers were any better and he said no.

The quality of the trailer reminds me of my local Ford dealer in the early 70's. When he got new cars in the first thing he did was adjust the timing and the carburetor so they would run decent. Then they went to the body shop to get the doors, hood, and trunk aligned.

I retired over a decade ago as a manufacturing efficiency expert and this problem is usually caused by top management striving for cost reduction and higher production rates which can drastically reduce quality. Management does not realize it is a whole lot cheaper to build the product right the first time. Think of the advantage the sales department could have with a truly well built product.

Maybe someday top management will read some books by Dr Deming or others and learn why so many trailers have so many problems.
WOW, finally someone one here that understands manufacturing and QC!!. As a 38 year career Manufacturing and Quality Control manager, I couldn't agree MORE. I really get tired of the casual comments on this, as well as other forums, that "quality costs money". When in the real world of the informed, Quality SAVES money eliminating/reducing line stoppages, reworks, scrap, excessive warranty costs, and loss of customer base. All I can say is your RIGHT ON and welcome, brother, it's great to have you here!
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