A Question To PA Residents And Drivers

[rockwood06]

I was born and raised in Maryland (Baltimore) and live just 11 miles from PA line and may be a resident of PA very soon and for the past 14 years I have work in Washington DC and in Northern VA. We spend most of our camping time in the Hershey PA area and travel as far as Williamsport PA for the past 4 years because my daughter attends college there, this will end after the next three weeks or so because she graduates. The reason for the info above is to show how much driving I do......Now to get to the question....I have noticed that when we travel North into PA we come across PA driver that make right hand turns from the travel lanes, is there a law that will not allow drivers that make right hand turns by pulling off of the travel lane and make there turns from the shoulder? Rt 11/15 is a perfect example of this, a 55 mile an hour speed zone and most people doing 70 and now you have people making right hand turns from the right hand lane instead of the shoulder, this can be dangerous while we are towing campers and 18 wheelers and in this area there are signs, big bright and yellow that have info on them about "High Crash Area", Target Enforcement Area", and "High DUI Area" I think I would pull off of the travel lane and make my turn from the shoulder. Will I need to take a drivers test to get a PA drivers licences after drive in Maryland for the past 40 years?

[rlocicero]

The right hand lane is the turning lane. I usually move over a little, but not onto the shoulder unless it is lined and paved. Too much junk and debris. And as for the idiots traveling 70 or 75 in a 55 zone, There should be more code inforcement to fine these people into their senses. Start getting tough on them and they will slow down... Fine the dickins out of them and revoke their licenses after the first offense ant they will start to think twice. Anything that is over 15 mph over the speed limit should warrant immediate revocation of their license.

[MtnGuy]

Wade, I am going to have to agree with rlocicero on this 1. If there is a paved deceleration lane, then of course I use that. But I don't hit a gravel shoulder to turn right. That might even be illegal in Virginia, as the road shoulder is supposed to only be used in case of an emergency.

[cfsoistman]

I sometimes wonder if PA has a totally different approach to driving than other states. This is not to bash anyone from PA but just an observation on my part every work day of the week. My observations are as follows:90% of the time there are PA Tags on the vehicle.

1. Passing on double yellow marked roadways. This includes going up a hill where the on-coming traffic isn't visible.
2. Following so closely that I can't see their headlights in my rear view mirror. What happened to 1 car length per 10 mph? I'm going 65-70 on a 60 MPH roadway and have these individuals right up my tail pipe. I especially love it when they flash their high beams. Doesn't that mean slow down?
3. BLINKERS????? Multiple lane changes, never see a blinker and the wonderful feeling when they dive-bomb across the front of your car without any regards of safety. Quite often had I not slammed my brakes I would have taken one of them out.
4. Headlights??? It's 5:30 AM, still dark outside, it's raining and foggy, it never fails that Einstein is out there in a silver car, no lights and not visible until the last second but changing lanes with no signals like they're giving away $100 bills and he wants to be first in line!

[MtnGuy]

cfsoistman, I will give you a big amen to all of those observations, but not just from PA.

Some people seem to think that a yellow line is only a suggestion.

About these idiots following to close.....the closer they get, the slower I go.

[mschaef114]

To answer your question, it is illegal to drive on the shoulder in PA. You must make all turns from the right lane. It may not be the safest at times but it is the law. As far as driving on the shoulder, I don't recommend it because of the unknowns, IE: debris, glass, potholes, and rumble strips.

I am a police officer in PA and deal with stupidity on a daily basis. People forget that driving in PA is a privilege and not a God given right. As a side note, my sister is a professor at Lycoming College if that is where you daughter attends.

[mschaef114]

Almost forgot. My brother lives in Norther VA. and drivers on the beltway are insane. 11/15 should be a cake walk for you. haha

[rockwood06]

I am talking about normal road conditions, paved and of course I would not jump onto a gravel shoulder to make a right hand turn either and to drive on the shoulder is against the law, however as I approach the turn I move to the far right as I can as I am slowing down to keep from #1 getting hit from the driver behind me and #2 to try not to impede traffic. In Maryland you can get a ticket for impeding traffic as well, but most likely not under these circumstances.
There too many people with cell phones glued to there head and hands and other distractions ,so by moving to the far right and to the shoulder to make the turn, I would consider this as defencive driving.....So I guess the answer to my question is, it is against the law in the state of PA to use the shoulder for anything other then emergency use.....One other thing I heard of is that in the State of PA is that it is strictly enforced about driving in the left hand lane, the left hand lane is for passing ONLY otherwise everyone is supposed to stay to the right......

[MightyMike]

Well, I'll comment on the last post. Heard a state trooper on the radio one day, and he said a lot of the traffic laws are just an excuse for them to pull you over. Find a lot of drunks and dealers that way. The law about traveling in the left lane, if I remember correctly is, if you travel over there for more than 1 mile and do not pass another vehicle they can give you a citation for obstructing traffic. (Rte 13 thru DE is wonderful for this- they could definetly use a law like that!!). It isn't enforced a lot, although I did see a cop chase some one down for that once. Another one is the driving with your wipers on- you must have your lights on, or they can cite you for that, too. Some individual towns have now passed ordinances banning cell phones while driving, with a hefty fine. State law so far over rules this, so if you want to fight them in court, you will probably win, but then have to pay a lawyer.As far as using the shoulder, some roadways restrict travel over there even if you are trying to go around a car that is making a left turn.

[Carol1]

You need to drive in Ontario in the GTA (Greater Toronto Area) - the rule of thumb is if there is a 12 foot space between you and the car in front of you - any car can jump between you and the car in front of you. This supreme tailgating at 100 - 120 km/h. I wish I was kidding! Rush hour a nightmare. One of the reasons we moved to the country in Southwestern Ontario. I have always found American drivers more polite and careful.

[Herk7769]

This is a plan by the "secret government of PA" to reduce the population of the state through attrition. By cutting Driver's Education Classes from the curriculum and no "on road" program AT ALL, the state has assured that every new crop of drivers is WORSE than the last one.

To prove my point Penn-DOT did a poll of drivers under the age of 25 and found that 28% thought that STOP signs with white borders were optional.

Apparently there was a viral email that was floating around in the ether that stated that the above was true. Even though all the manuals and common sense would dictate otherwise (have you ever seen a stop sign without a white border?) this keeps showing up.

[revrnd]

Originally Posted by MightyMike

The law about traveling in the left lane, if I remember correctly is, if you travel over there for more than 1 mile and do not pass another vehicle they can give you a citation for obstructing traffic.

That should be enforced in Ontario.

[revrnd]

Originally Posted by Carol1

You need to drive in Ontario in the GTA (Greater Toronto Area) - the rule of thumb is if there is a 12 foot space between you and the car in front of you - any car can jump between you and the car in front of you. This supreme tailgating at 100 - 120 km/h. I wish I was kidding! Rush hour a nightmare. One of the reasons we moved to the country in Southwestern Ontario. I have always found American drivers more polite and careful.

If the 2 vehicles are trucks, the space between them can be less than the 12 feet you mention.

One thing I've noticed is that some drivers on the 401 have a spotter like the NASCAR drivers have. How else do you explain going from the slow lane (cutting in front of a tractor trailer in the middle lane) into a "hole" between the faster moving vehicles in the LH passing lane. How do they know the hole is there when the tractor trailer is blocking the view of the overtaking vehicles?