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Old 10-23-2015, 08:12 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by aceinspp View Post
I like theses threads that start out gas and go full blowen diesel Anybody got more popcorn? Later RJD


Diesel always wins.........

Have a good weekend, all.
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Old 10-23-2015, 09:12 AM   #62
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True enough...

Don't forget the SRW/DRW argument, too!

I have realized that a 250/2500 won't have enough payload for the trailer and stuff... So I'll buy into that one - looking at actual door stickers, compared to the reported numbers, has been a bit of an eye opener.

Still not sold on a diesel, but a 350/3500 gasser seems to be a rare beast; and hearing that the 6.4 isn't a well liked engine by service people, does carry some weight, steering me away from Dodge.
The Ford 6.2 is used a lot out here by the oil/power/utility companies. Nabors, now C&J Energy, used to run PSD in all crew trucks. Issues with the 6.0 and 6.4 PSD made them switch to gas. (The local foed service has ctlrates of PSD on hand and usually a SD with the cab off every week) Still use ford's exclusively. Continental uses chevy. Gassers. Baker Hughes uses ford and Ram gassers. MDU fords.

The 6.4 in 2014 had a bad batch of wrist pins. There is a range of build dates they have it narrowed down to. Not all built In the range have the issue, but the ones that do get the engine replaced on Ma Mopar's dime.

Over on the Ram forum there are a number of 6.4 owners using theirs to pull 15k 5ers. I pull a 36' toy hauler with a max weight of 13,600. Pulled 10 miles of up to 8% over 8,000' at 18,500lbs gcwr. I didn't set any land speed records, but all the 25mph hairpins made sure of that.

If you plan on towing often and in the mountains, defiantly spring for the diesel. Definitely go 3500.

If you go ford or ram, make sure not to get DEF in the fuel tank. The DEF filler is in the fuel door on those brands. If the DEF makes it to the injectors before it is caught, the entire fuel system will have to be replaced. It will begin to crystallize and plug the injectors open and can hydrolock the motor. No bueno. People are saying $13-15k repair bill. GM fills the DEF under the hood.
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Old 10-23-2015, 09:47 AM   #63
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Called a guy from the car club that was a Ford tech until last year. He said the 6.7 was having a lot less warranty work than the 6.0 and 6.4. The main problems they are having with it is from poor maintenance and dusty/dirty environments. He feels the 6.7 will last a long time if properly maintained.
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Old 10-23-2015, 10:06 AM   #64
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Also, if you get a diesel and think you might want to mod it with chip, cai, exhaust etc... talk with the service dept manager about how they treat mods. Some places look the other way, some will refuse warranty work if it's been modified. I know Ford is a real stickler on this. They can tell when the ecm has been accessed even if you return it to stock. My ecoboost has the intercooler stumble and when I took it in they wouldn't touch it until I put the stock air filter in (I had a performance drop in) and took of the bug screen from the radiator, but they had no issue with my 4" cat back.
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Old 10-23-2015, 01:09 PM   #65
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I hardly believe the 6mpg unless your doing some heavy mountains. I tow with a 6.0 gas and get 9.4mpg. Just remember diesel guys fuel is not going to stay at $2.30 for ever. What I posted earlier will tell the tale of having to drive 250,00 miles to recoup the cost of diesel and that is if it stays in one piece.

As they say to each his own I'll never own a diesel and as I've said can not justify the high cost and recouping that expense. I trade to often. I like you diesel folks spending other folks money tho. Cool. Later RJD
good points and it is always up to each individual to decide however a 6.0 gas engine is a chevy, not a dodge and better imo as well as yours. plenty of tq with the 6.0 especially after adding twin turbo's! when you buy a diesel you can never base that decision on how to re-coupe the added expense but rather how hard do you want the truck to struggle on the open road. not 20 to 40 miles from home but open road on long trips if you take them. if you only do short trips and use the truck for daily driving then the diesel prob isn't a good choice but if you routinely cross three state lines, one way, loaded pretty good and run innerstate 50% or more in mod to large hills then diesel is the only way to go. i am a ford fan through and through but i will never own another ford gas engine! the cummins diesel is a great engine but just never been and am not a dodge fan myself. worked on toooooo many of them i guess. prob why they are offering the best deals btw a 1 ton dually or larger like the f450 are the most stable for towing, driving empty not a lot of fun imo, when we head into town i don't ever take my dually if i absolutely don't have too. towing my fiver caught in a side wind......nothing beats a dually.
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Old 10-23-2015, 01:43 PM   #66
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Also, if you get a diesel and think you might want to mod it with chip, cai, exhaust etc... talk with the service dept manager about how they treat mods. Some places look the other way, some will refuse warranty work if it's been modified. I know Ford is a real stickler on this. They can tell when the ecm has been accessed even if you return it to stock. My ecoboost has the intercooler stumble and when I took it in they wouldn't touch it until I put the stock air filter in (I had a performance drop in) and took of the bug screen from the radiator, but they had no issue with my 4" cat back.

yes ford is sticky about that but..........if you buy a 2015 or newer ford 6.7 diesel and find yourself needing to increase power ( tuner, chip, efi live or programmer) then you had seriously start looking at class 8 semi's lol
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Old 10-23-2015, 02:13 PM   #67
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I think it depends a lot on the dealer. Ford is especially gun shy about tuners since the 6.0. However, the Dodge dealer in town here is real particular as well. My old boss' cummins started goofing up one weekend he had a local diesel shop that is open saturdays to check codes. Diesel shop told him he should take it in. Dealer scans and finds the computer has been accessed (by the diesel shop) and tells him he was running a tune and he is responsible for repairs. No ifs or buts. Takes it to nearest other dealer and they end up replacing all the injectors because there was a bulletin on them. Paid $0.

Two weeks later he gets a bill from the first dealer, where he purchased his 2 cummins, for diagnostics.

Needless to say, he is a blue oval guy now.
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Old 10-23-2015, 05:04 PM   #68
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Weight is an issue for Ram 2500, gas or diesel.

I have the 2015 Ram 2500 Laramie with 6.4l. gas and 3.73 rear, 5th wheel hitch package. We tow a FR Columbus 320RS, with a published dry weight of 11,117#. Well loaded, but with black, gray, and fresh water tanks near empty we exceed GCWR (which no one talks about) by about 760#. GCWR for the gas 2500 is 19500#, and the truck (with my toolbox, full fuel, and DW) weighs 7700 (Ram customer service says my Ram weighs only 6856 empty), leaving only 11,800# regardless of how or where it's attached. The truck GVWR is 10,000. With the loaded trailer attached, it weighs in at 10,220#, or 220# over. Since we took this data (on truck scales), we constantly are thinking how to limit the weight we carry. Takes away some of the fun. The truck handles it well (down to 40mph on steep grades, but no complaints). We don't exceed 60mph. It works for us. BUT if you want some degrees of freedom, do the 3500 at least. BTW, we use a Reese Goose Box, so hitch weight in the trailer box is not part of the equation (just a ball). If you do a Diesel 2500, it raises the GCWR by 500#, but the engine swap adds that much weight anyhow - no gain there. I wanted to park in our residential garage, and that works just fine (watch your height).
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Old 10-23-2015, 07:16 PM   #69
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good points and it is always up to each individual to decide however a 6.0 gas engine is a chevy, not a dodge and better imo as well as yours. plenty of tq with the 6.0 especially after adding twin turbo's! when you buy a diesel you can never base that decision on how to re-coupe the added expense but rather how hard do you want the truck to struggle on the open road. not 20 to 40 miles from home but open road on long trips if you take them. if you only do short trips and use the truck for daily driving then the diesel prob isn't a good choice but if you routinely cross three state lines, one way, loaded pretty good and run innerstate 50% or more in mod to large hills then diesel is the only way to go. i am a ford fan through and through but i will never own another ford gas engine! the cummins diesel is a great engine but just never been and am not a dodge fan myself. worked on toooooo many of them i guess. prob why they are offering the best deals btw a 1 ton dually or larger like the f450 are the most stable for towing, driving empty not a lot of fun imo, when we head into town i don't ever take my dually if i absolutely don't have too. towing my fiver caught in a side wind......nothing beats a dually.
Not necessary true with the new improved engines. My 6.0 is just the ticket for my needs. So the rpm goes to 4500 but I can set the cruise control and walk up a 4.5% grade at 65mph. and I travel more than 900 miles to some of my destinations crossing more than 3 state lines. All my trips are interstate 85% of the time. I travel between 5 to 6,000 miles a year so it would take a long time to recoup that $8500 especially when fuel starts to rise as it will. Then I can at the diesel prices. Yes I had 6 duallys and loved them but non where diesels either. Towed like a dream I buy my campers to match my vehicles. I've never required a hugh camper as just two of us and one 4 legged furry puppy friend

Reason now to drop duallys is to hard to maneuver when sight seeing in quaint towns hard to park and now no longer required for tt I pull now. I've been up and down the trailer size and now this one is probably my last. Camped for 40 years and never needed a diesel as we say not everybody needs one. Later RJD
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Old 10-23-2015, 07:51 PM   #70
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correct , not everyone needs a diesel but a damn nice engine to have for pulling. the 6.0 chevy gasser is a good engine but then again so it the 8.1 for power just not mpg. i really don't care about mpg's as long as i am not having to down shift for hills but that's just me. the diesels are definitely more expensive to fix and maintain even if you work on them yourself but worth the trade off imo. i don't do any site seeing on my trips since i am on my way to the sand dunes with my sand rail. my truck is only used for pulling the th'er 90% of the time and i only put 7k miles a year or so on it because of that. as far as 3/4 ton and 1 ton......get the 1 ton , it doesn't ride any rougher than than the 3/4 but a better at handling the weight. make sure and check there diff gear ratio's and get the pulling gears if your towing any hills and forget the mpg's. i have 3.73's and have been considering changing to 4.10's but for what they cost front and rear i can step up to stage 2 inj's and gain more. my fiver th'er weighs in roughly 11k lbs loaded and i do run 75 mph on the interstate ( not stock tires or suspension) and when the wind hits i have to slow down. that drives me crazy cause i am not retired and only get so much time off. i have actaully been considering a volvo 780 with a d12 pre emmision class 8 for a tv just for the extra gears and superior grunt but overall the stability as well as added comfort for longer distance driving. there are several used ones in good shape for $29 to $33k and you can't buy a new diesel for that price lol
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Old 10-23-2015, 07:57 PM   #71
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correct , not everyone needs a diesel but a damn nice engine to have for pulling. the 6.0 chevy gasser is a good engine but then again so it the 8.1 for power just not mpg. i really don't care about mpg's as long as i am not having to down shift for hills but that's just me. the diesels are definitely more expensive to fix and maintain even if you work on them yourself but worth the trade off imo. i don't do any site seeing on my trips since i am on my way to the sand dunes with my sand rail. my truck is only used for pulling the th'er 90% of the time and i only put 7k miles a year or so on it because of that. as far as 3/4 ton and 1 ton......get the 1 ton , it doesn't ride any rougher than than the 3/4 but a better handling the weight. make sure and check there diff gear ratio's and get the pulling gears if your towing any hills and forget the mpg's. i have 3.73's and have been considering changing to 4.10's but for what they cost front and rear i can step up to stage 2 inj's and gain more.
Yep had the 8.1 and it would out pull anything I ever had had 4.10 gear milage about 15 non towing but towing bad about 6. My 6.0 had 4.10 gear gets 19mpg non tow and 9.4 towing. I like wise not concerned with mpg that much.

I considered the 1 ton gas but opted out as not needed for my tt needs and cost more than a dully. Later RJD

Later RJD
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Old 10-23-2015, 08:40 PM   #72
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Why is everybody afraid of spinning a V8 to 5k but have no qualms about spinning their turbo to 140k? Both are designed to operate at those speeds. A naturally aspirated motor needs to rev to make power. It's designed to spin at those rpms and is safe to do so.
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Old 10-23-2015, 08:46 PM   #73
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Why is everybody afraid of spinning a V8 to 5k but have no qualms about spinning their turbo to 140k? Both are designed to operate at those speeds. A naturally aspirated motor needs to rev to make power. It's designed to spin at those rpms and is safe to do so.
Right on. Of course I have never had my gaser to 5 grand yet. Later RJD
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Old 10-23-2015, 10:37 PM   #74
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Right on. Of course I have never had my gaser to 5 grand yet. Later RJD

That's about where the V10 shifts in tow mode, and foot down near the floor.


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Old 10-24-2015, 12:59 PM   #75
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For closure - just looked at a '15 F350 lariat diesel SRW...

Dressed up nicer then I was looking for, but has a 3322 lbs payload, rated to tow 15,700; and is an absolutely beautiful truck to boot.

And it's on sale at an insane price; to clear it off the lot. Payment will actually go down from what I was paying for my F150...

Thanks for advice and discussion!
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Old 10-24-2015, 01:53 PM   #76
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For closure - just looked at a '15 F350 lariat diesel SRW...

Dressed up nicer then I was looking for, but has a 3322 lbs payload, rated to tow 15,700; and is an absolutely beautiful truck to boot.

And it's on sale at an insane price; to clear it off the lot. Payment will actually go down from what I was paying for my F150...

Thanks for advice and discussion!
Hope you enjoy your new truck and give us a review after your first tow.
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Old 10-24-2015, 02:06 PM   #77
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Glade you found your truck. Enjoy. Later RJD
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Old 10-26-2015, 06:21 PM   #78
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Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByForest River Forums1445901620.718555.jpg
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That's the baby... Bronze Flame, Lariat, Leather, 5th wheel prep.
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Old 10-26-2015, 07:04 PM   #79
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Nice lookin ride
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Old 10-26-2015, 09:28 PM   #80
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Attachment 92956

That's the baby... Bronze Flame, Lariat, Leather, 5th wheel prep.
Unlike you, I am NOT a FORD guy, but that is one sexy truck!!! The 5th wheel prep that FORD and RAM use is awesome! Go buy a B&W 5th wheel for the FORD puck system and you will have it installed in about 5 minutes!

Be DAMN sure to install the 5th wheel BEFORE you drop a truck box in the bed. LOL Most truck boxes will cover the front 2 latches of the B&W system. Ask me how I know.............................................. ..................

I have to admit when I see the new F250 and F350 trucks at the local fuel station I often wonder how they drive, tow, and so on because they sure are sharp as a tack!!!

Congrats on making a MUCH better decision than you were about to.
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