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Old 02-08-2015, 02:26 PM   #41
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I've never understood the difference's of Ford compared to Chevy/Ram in trucks. Ford has minimum difference until you jump three sizes bigger. Wow.
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Old 02-08-2015, 07:17 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by tackle_man View Post
We were at a ram dealer the other day and they had both the 3500 and 4500 side by side, and even the tires on the 450 were so much bigger made the 3500 look like a 1500, not to mention the rear end and the breaks , every thing was just so much bigger built. We also need the quad cab 4X4 i do know that adds extra weight to the truck and in turn takes away from the amount you can tow / carry
You are correct that a 4500 is built heavier than the 3500 but you also have to remember that the 4500 is a MDT the 3500 is a LDT. The MDT is designed and rated to do it's max capacity 100% of the time. The LDT is designed to do it some of the time. Will you be hooked to the trailer loaded to 24000 20,50,90% of the time? If 50% or 90% then yes you are going to want at least the 4500. If it were me, I would skip the 4500 and go directly to the 5500.

If it's 10% or 20% them I would probably go with the 3500 personally.

Have you driven a 4500 or 5500 yet? They are very stiff in the rear. If your trailer has 5000# of pin weight then it will start to soften a little but it won't much.
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Old 02-08-2015, 07:46 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by tackle_man View Post
We were at a ram dealer the other day and they had both the 3500 and 4500 side by side, and even the tires on the 450 were so much bigger made the 3500 look like a 1500, not to mention the rear end and the breaks , every thing was just so much bigger built. We also need the quad cab 4X4 i do know that adds extra weight to the truck and in turn takes away from the amount you can tow / carry
Let me give a little example:

Like I said, the CC trucks are designed to be use at their rating all the time. Towing and or hauling it's payload. Go look at a 3500 CC truck. The rear axle is the same size (although narrower) but there is way more spring than a 3500 pick-up.

They have all the springs because they are designed to run around loaded all the time and they need to handle like an unloaded truck. Check out the towing rating for identical equipped trucks CC vs pick-up.

Crew cab 4X4 diesel pick-up with 4:10 gears and Aisin trans has a 37,800# GCVWR

Crew cab 4X4 diesel CC with 4:10 gears and Aisin trans only has a 30,000# GCVWR

The CC has more payload until you add the bed to it then it could be less depending on how heavy the bed is you put on it.

Again, compare the two trucks rear spring pack. The Pick-up will look like a 1500 spring pack with an overload spring on top. The CC truck will look like the 4500 spring pack with probably 8-9 leaves with an overload spring on top.

IMO you can add air bags to the pick-up and handle the load just as good if you are only going to be loaded very heavy every so often. It will be a much better ride when not loaded.

I had a 2010 CC with a flat and it would beat you to death when running around empty.
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Old 02-09-2015, 04:48 AM   #44
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we are looking at getting a 2015 dodge 4500 but have been told we can only order it as a cab and chassis . When I am not using the truck to tow the camper i use it as a regular truck, so my question is where can i look to get a regular looking truck bed/box for that truck. (it is 60" from cab to center axle) stretch bed, 9' bed, etc.
any info would be great.
thank you in advance
Why do you want to limit your self with a 4500? The 2014 and newer Dodge 3500 Pickup has a much higher tow rating then the C&C 3500, 4500, and 5500. Not to mention the C&C is a horrible ride empty. As C&C are designed to carry payload vs heavy towing. The main deciding factor between a C&C and a Pickup is the amount weight you will be carrying the life of the vehicle. Are you going to add a 5,000lb Utility bed, Wrecker Roll Back bed, or not? If all you need is a pickup bed with a 5th Wheel hitch. Then stay away from a C&C and get a 3500 pickup. So to say a 3500 Pickup should only be bought if you are going to tow 30% of the time or less is incorrect. IF you tow 100% of the time the 3500 pickup would still be the right choice.


The 2011 to 2014 Ford F450 are not a F450 class pickup by any means. They are just a glorified F350 with slightly bigger brakes and 3klb more towing capacity. These year models of F450 where a joke if you ask me, all they did was screw the customer into thinking they actually had a F450.

2015 F450 are built on the C&C F450 frame. S110 rear end, 19" wheels, heavier Chassis, and so on. SO the 2015 models are legit. which the 2015 F450 is the only pickup with a slightly more tow rating then the Dodge 3500.

For me the cats meow would be a 2015 Dodge 3500 with the factory rear air ride and 4.10 gears and the 850ftlb engine / Aisin.
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Old 02-09-2015, 05:10 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by tackle_man View Post
We were at a ram dealer the other day and they had both the 3500 and 4500 side by side, and even the tires on the 450 were so much bigger made the 3500 look like a 1500, not to mention the rear end and the breaks , every thing was just so much bigger built. We also need the quad cab 4X4 i do know that adds extra weight to the truck and in turn takes away from the amount you can tow / carry
You are getting lost by the difference of the two primary uses of these pickups. The reason everything is bigger on a C&C is because they are built to carry weight as its main purpose. To be set up as a utility vehicle/wreck. That is why they do not come with a pickup bed.

C&C are not designed for heavy towing. The pickup version 3500 is designed and tested for heavy towing. If brakes are a concern then it is not the pickup you should worry about. You should be upgrading the ele drums on the trailer to Ele/Hyd Disc brakes.
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Old 02-09-2015, 11:41 AM   #46
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The 2011 to 2014 Ford F450 are not a F450 class pickup by any means. They are just a glorified F350 with slightly bigger brakes and 3klb more towing capacity. These year models of F450 where a joke if you ask me, all they did was screw the customer into thinking they actually had a F450.

2015 F450 are built on the C&C F450 frame. S110 rear end, 19" wheels, heavier Chassis, and so on. SO the 2015 models are legit. which the 2015 F450 is the only pickup with a slightly more tow rating then the Dodge 3500.

For me the cats meow would be a 2015 Dodge 3500 with the factory rear air ride and 4.10 gears and the 850ftlb engine / Aisin.
True. before the 2015 Ford F450, the last real F450 was the 2008-2010 but they only came with 4.30 or 4.88 rears and were not the greatest for long highway travel. More in town heavy towing. Mostly farm/horse/hay, ect.
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Old 02-09-2015, 11:43 AM   #47
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If brakes are a concern, which I dont think will be, there are nice aftermarket rotors and better then stock pads that you can install. Hawk makes a great extremem duty truck pad that is fantastic.
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Old 02-09-2015, 12:04 PM   #48
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Doc, What makes the 2008-2010 stand out so much. IRT towing my stats show


2010 F450 6.4L 4X4/Auto Crew Cab
4:30 @ 16.7k GVWR 4:88 @ 18.7k GVWR


With only .3L engine size, they have come a long way to todays 30k GVWR.
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Old 02-09-2015, 01:32 PM   #49
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Doc, What makes the 2008-2010 stand out so much. IRT towing my stats show


2010 F450 6.4L 4X4/Auto Crew Cab
4:30 @ 16.7k GVWR 4:88 @ 18.7k GVWR


With only .3L engine size, they have come a long way to todays 30k GVWR.
In terms of actually having different parts, beefier axles, 19.5 wheels, and not just a rebadged F350.

All the specs just a few years ago are miles away from todays trucks and ratings. That 2008-2010 F450 can tow a lot more then rated but they down graded it for taxes and not to step on the F550 CC back then.

The GCWR I found was 33K with max 5th wheel towing at 24,600 4x2 and 24,200 4x4 for the 2010 F450 w/ 4.30 rear with the available with High-Capacity Trailer Towing Package
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Old 02-10-2015, 11:24 AM   #50
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In terms of actually having different parts, beefier axles, 19.5 wheels, and not just a rebadged F350.

All the specs just a few years ago are miles away from todays trucks and ratings. That 2008-2010 F450 can tow a lot more then rated but they down graded it for taxes and not to step on the F550 CC back then.

The GCWR I found was 33K with max 5th wheel towing at 24,600 4x2 and 24,200 4x4 for the 2010 F450 w/ 4.30 rear with the available with High-Capacity Trailer Towing Package
2008-2010, 2015 the F450 is a Class 4
2011-2014 the F450 is a Class 3 (These years just a rebadged F350 but with some upgrades to meet the higher GCWR)

But my understanding the 2008 to 2010 F450 towing was not derated but that was what it could meet under the NHTSA guidelines
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