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Old 02-15-2013, 11:51 AM   #81
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I think you can say the same thing about the F-150 with ecoboost and Max to package. Of course, most people are probably more interested in the ride of a 1/2 ton.

The article I read suggested it would be a $2K option over the cost of a HEMI. If they hit that price point, I think they will sell more than the 10K trucks they hope to sell.

Honestly, I would think some people would be interested in that engine in a 3/4 ton. Let's face it, none of us truly needs 850 ft lbs of torque that you get in the new Cummins.
Light duty 3/4 ton with a half ton ride?
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Old 02-15-2013, 11:52 AM   #82
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There is a store about the Dodge 1500 diesel on USA todays web site. In the 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee, the diesel is rated 240 horsepower and 420 pounds-feet of torque. This is a Fiat VM 3.0 V6 diesel. That is going to be used in the Jeep and 1500 Ram.
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Old 02-15-2013, 11:58 AM   #83
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Light duty 3/4 ton with a half ton ride?
I think it could fill a certain niche market. I am thinking of all the complaints you get from people who own a 1/2 ton truck, but truly need to step up to a 3/4.

Picture a quad cab or mega cab Dodge 2500, with the 3.0 diesel it would probably get close to 25 highway (which is much higher than the HEMI) and still tow around 12K. Kind of a hybrid just for towing travel trailers. Not going to sell a ton of them, but it would fit for many people on this board.

Now with that said, it is easier to make the business case than the engineering one. Still, could turn the truck segment in a different direction. And I think you need to thank Ford for doing the Ecoboost max tow package. They really started this. A truck that can be driven daily, get respectable MPG and then tow a 30 ft travel trailer on the weekend.

If hey could put that running gear in a Durango that would really get people excited.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:09 PM   #84
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Bunch of co-workers were at the Detroit auto show a few weeks ago, the diesel 1/2 was also their , but they were hush on the mpg figure
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:25 PM   #85
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I think you can say the same thing about the F-150 with ecoboost and Max to package. Of course, most people are probably more interested in the ride of a 1/2 ton.

The article I read suggested it would be a $2K option over the cost of a HEMI. If they hit that price point, I think they will sell more than the 10K trucks they hope to sell.

Honestly, I would think some people would be interested in that engine in a 3/4 ton. Let's face it, none of us truly needs 850 ft lbs of torque that you get in the new Cummins.
If you are towing 9k or less I would agree. I pull 12k now and will probably upgrade the trailer in a few years. Most of the trailers I will be looking at then will be 15k or better. I am thinking I will want that torque.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:27 PM   #86
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If you are towing 9k or less I would agree. I pull 12k now and will probably upgrade the trailer in a few years. Most of the trailers I will be looking at then will be 15k or better. I am thinking I will want that torque.
the dividing line there is probably the fact you are into a 5th wheel already. I still think in terms of TT's and the weights are almost always under 10K. But yes, totally agree, in that size range would really only want the full Cummins package.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:28 PM   #87
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I have heard the nickname tractor for those as well. They do sound kind of like a small tractor when you here them pull into the gas station, however this is really not that noticeable. I drove one (the Liberty was too small for us, but really liked the powerplant) and from the front seat, my wife was hard pressed to notice the difference in noise. Full disclosure: my Excursion 6.0 is 4 inch turbo back, it wakes deaf neighbors.

Anyway - same manufacturer on the engine, VM Motori. So I think ChooChoo besides having a cool screen name, can probably lend the most to this conversation about durability etc.

I would assume they would put together a max tow package with it. Back in the day you could order the Ram with a special service pack, I had a 1997 like this, that raised the rating quite a bit. I would expect a max tow package to come in with a 11K tow rating, but the payload may still not be that great.

One question, how much does that little diesel weigh? That will impact the payload rating too.
Just giving a little insight on the VM as I am a VM owner in my 2006 Jeep. First, I love my Jeep. The previous owner did not take care of her, and I paid dearly. But, I have worked out the major kinks. But here is some of the problems that I hope got solved.

1) ODBII communications - 06 had more issues than 05 with ODB scanners like scangauge just locking up


2) Intercooler Hoses - not silicone lined. Oil vapor from the CCV ate the hoses inside out. Jeep came out with upgraded hoses.

3) Fuel Filter head would start leaking from the heater plug. Jeep designed an upgraded version

4) Torque converter designed too weak. Jeeps cheap fix was to change the shift points and derate the engine. They also designed a beefier Torque Converter and an aftermarket is available from Suncoast and ATS.

5) The 428 engine uses a timing belt and is a 0 clearance engine. But, they designed the rockers to be the weakest link. If a belt breaks, it trashes rockers and doesn't bend valves. But those rockers being weak also wear fast when oil changes are not performed and the wrong oil is used, as well as aggressive EGR here in the states. Supposedly the euro engines don't see this issue. Also remember the V6 uses a timing chain.

6) Thermostat is a complete housing for $100 or so, and they fail open open or open prematurely and the engine runs cold. No fix from Jeep, but others in the CRD community have mods to fix this.

As I said, I love my little Jeep Tractor. I wish I got it sooner. And I would get another one for the DGF, too, as she loves it also.

I just hope Ram and Jeep has the issues fixed with this newest engine in these vehicles.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:57 PM   #88
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the dividing line there is probably the fact you are into a 5th wheel already. I still think in terms of TT's and the weights are almost always under 10K. But yes, totally agree, in that size range would really only want the full Cummins package.
The funny thing is...and I see them all the time. Folks with the ecoboosts pulling 12k trailers. You know we are going to be seeing the same things with these 1500 diesels. Maybe even worse.
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Old 02-15-2013, 11:37 PM   #89
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The funny thing is...and I see them all the time. Folks with the ecoboosts pulling 12k trailers. You know we are going to be seeing the same things with these 1500 diesels. Maybe even worse.
There will always be stupid people. You may think I am for towing close to my US rating. But for me, I would love to tow a 25RS Roo and have a bed to put things in if I got one.
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Old 02-15-2013, 11:51 PM   #90
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There will always be stupid people. You may think I am for towing close to my US rating. But for me, I would love to tow a 25RS Roo and have a bed to put things in if I got one.
I wouldn't say you're are stupid.

In my youth I towed a 24' trailer with a Bronco II. I was on the edge of the weight limits myself (possibly a lil over a few times). Where I had issues was in the skinny and short wheelbase. The slightest movement of the wheel translated into larger movements to the trailer.

So if you get into a 1500 and the trailer was within limits then I would applaud you as it would IMO be a better choice than your "tractor".

Now if you got that same 1500 and put a 12k 5er on the back. I also wouldn't call you stupid. However ... I would call you on the phone to know when and where you were going to be on the road and try to avoid you!
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