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Old 05-30-2016, 03:58 PM   #21
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Which Brand

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryandamy View Post
There is no doubt that diesel gets better mileage than gas and the bigger the load, the bigger the benefit. But let's do an ROI (Return On Investment)

I am driving from San Diego to Alaska in 5 days and will be on the road for 7 weeks logging more than 10,000 miles. Pulling my 27' Stealth toy hauler with fully loaded at about 7000 lbs I will get 8 MPG from my 2008 Toyota Sequoia 5.7L V8 that is rated to tow 9600lbs.

Engine Miles GPM Gallons Cost/gal Total cost
Gas 10000 8 1250 $2.30 $2,875.00
Diesel 10000 14 714 $2.35 $1,678.57

Diesel fuel saving = $1,196.43

So for this very long trip I would save $1200 in fuel costs if I sold my Sequoia for $20,000 and bought a 2 to 4 year old Ford F250 diesel for about $35,000.
So my ROI would be that I would break even after 125,000 towing miles.
(12.5 Alaska trips)
And I would have to live with the noise and smell of diesel and the very different power curves between gas and diesel.

But if I was starting from scratch and planned to tow a real lot, I would by diesel.

Please forgive me and don't jump down my throat if you don't agree with this next part... It is just my opinion as a reliability engineer...

I wouldn't buy Dodge even though the Cummings diesel is the best diesel engine you can buy except for the Mercedes truck diesel which costs a fortune.
I would buy a Ford F250 because they are much more reliable overall than Dodge.

My 2 cents...
It sounds like the OP has already made up his mind, the only question now is which brand. I agree both diesel and gas have their advantages and disadvantages. If I were to haul a heavy camper a long distance, often, diesel would be my choice. For what we pull, and where we pull it, the Tundra does just fine for us. The added price, maintenance, and other factors make gas over diesel our choice.
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Old 05-30-2016, 04:03 PM   #22
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When you are doing your ROI you need to figure trade value also. MSRP of diesel option is 8200.00 and with discounts i got on the entire truck I paid around 7200 for diesel. Diesel adds 8150.00 to three year old F350 over a gas F350 to retail sale price. Some people call it a wash but if I paid 7200 for diesel option and when I trade it in I get 7700 additional dollars to the trade in price for diesel engine option I will take that wash any day. I bet you won't get that much added on with your heated seats LOL.
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Old 05-30-2016, 04:49 PM   #23
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Agree with virtually all comments. Replaced our Ford 350 van, 460 cu. in. gas engine with a 2008 Chevy Silverado 2500 diesel. More than doubled our fuel mileage with the diesel, towing or not. Also, love the Onstar feature. Never without phone service anywhere in the US.
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Old 05-30-2016, 05:13 PM   #24
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Gas or Diesel?

I pull a 12k loaded 2016 wildcat with a 2014 Ram 2500 mega cab cummins diesel. Get 23 mpg hwy & 13-14 w/5er. Diesel pulls great, huge difference over my Ram 1/2 ton hemi pulling a30'TT.
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Old 05-30-2016, 06:17 PM   #25
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Gas vs Diesel

Hello

I cannot honestly speak about diesel, however I can relate to you a recent trip I took .
Last Oct. we took a 2,000 mile trip from Oxnard, Ca. To New Mexico for the ballon festival, then to Moab, UT. Then to the Zion Natioanl Park, on to Las Vegas then back to Oxnard.
We where driving in a caravan of 7 couples, I was the only one who pulled a 5th wheel with a gas engine ( 2013 Dodge Big Horn ).
To my surprise I got 11 miles to the gallon. The other folks either had Chevy and or Fords and they also got 11 miles per gallon. On the mountains and the hills it kept up with the rest of the group with no issues at all.
I was pulling a 28ft. 2015 Wildcat Maxx.


This was my test trip for my Dodge to see if I was going to purchase a Diesel. Not no more........

Anyway that's my experience .........
What ever you decide I wish you Happy Camping and safe Travels.
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:09 PM   #26
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Thanks everyone for all the replies. Still very much on the fence especially after more research. Diesel would definitely help but not sure if I want to go with that big of a truck simce the DW would probably not feel comfortable driving it. Also have been looking at possibly going with a Ford Ecoboost which might solve my issues without having to go diesel.
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Old 05-30-2016, 11:18 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by LJS1211 View Post
Thanks everyone for all the replies. Still very much on the fence especially after more research. Diesel would definitely help but not sure if I want to go with that big of a truck simce the DW would probably not feel comfortable driving it. Also have been looking at possibly going with a Ford Ecoboost which might solve my issues without having to go diesel.
My wife found herself required to drive the TV one day ~ no option, had to go. Found it not much different than the F150 but more fun to drive. Have her try it, she may like it.
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Old 05-30-2016, 11:42 PM   #28
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Gas vs Diesel for towing.

Diesel, no question about it!

The dodge 1500 has the new eco-diesel which I have in my Grand Cherokee and I love it. The engine has no problem pulling the same camper but it does feel the wind on that light chassis. I was getting 17mpg towing my 6000lb camper around Florida.
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Old 05-31-2016, 12:05 AM   #29
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Big myth that a 3/4 ton or 1 ton is bigger than a 1/2 ton. Go to Fords fleet site and look up the specs for an F150 and F250. They're almost identical in size. In fact if you get the tow mirrors on an F150, they make the truck wider than an F250. IIRC there's only about 1' difference in width. Length wise yes an F250 CAN be longer but it all depends on what WB you get.
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Old 05-31-2016, 01:38 AM   #30
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As DEA49 suggested, the 3L Ecodiesel made by VM Motori and used in the Ram 1500 and Grand Cherokee is a strong puller and efficient. I am only pulling 2500 lb Palomini right now, but my 2015 Grand Cherokee does fine, up and down hills. With 8 speed automatic, I switched to 'paddle control' and kept it in 7th and 8th. I got average of 22 MPG today going 70 miles. Before, I was pulling with a Tacoma with the original V6, and it struggled and gulped fuel at about 10 mpg.
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Old 05-31-2016, 06:12 AM   #31
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2007 Chevy Duramax and 36' Sabre 5th wheel

Cat scale combined weight of 18,250

12 mpg on my trip up to Traverse City this weekend. (Haven't left back for home yet)

Used to get about 8-9 mpg pulling my 6,000 TT

Love by Duramax! Regular maintenance isn't that bad if you DIY...costs me about $40 for an oil change if I watch for Rotella on sale. (10 qts - 12 on Fords and 15 on Dodge) Tranny filters and fuel filter changes are pretty easy on the Duramax as well. (Unlike my brother-in-laws F250)

That's my 2 cents
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Old 05-31-2016, 06:18 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptnJohn View Post
My wife found herself required to drive the TV one day ~ no option, had to go. Found it not much different than the F150 but more fun to drive. Have her try it, she may like it.
NOOO
NOOOOOOOOO
I can't. I can't do it.

NOooooooooo. Don't make me do that!

Maybe someday. Maybe. I dunno........maybe not. But maybe.

Nah.

I can't. Sorry. Just can't.
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:18 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by BandJCarm View Post
NOOO
NOOOOOOOOO
I can't. I can't do it.

NOooooooooo. Don't make me do that!

Maybe someday. Maybe. I dunno........maybe not. But maybe.

Nah.

I can't. Sorry. Just can't.
Too funny,

My wife jumped into our Super Duty with a horse trailer on the back and drove around all over the place no issues. She still likes the Escape better but is not afraid of the truck.
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:31 AM   #34
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:34 AM   #35
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Having owned both a 2013 F150 Ecoboost and now a 2015 F250 6.7 PSD, I recommend NOT getting the diesel unless you NEED a diesel. There is nothing about the diesel I like better than the Ecoboost I had other than the ability to tow heavier loads. My driving is mostly short trips of 3-7 miles or so and I tow maybe 4K miles per year on average. Over the 30K miles I had the EB, my mileage was just slightly higher than what my almost 8K mile average is on the 6.7. I attribute this to slightly better unloaded mileage with the EB, the tendency of the diesel to get poorer mileage until reaching full operating temp (hence the short trips) and the extra use of fuel during regens. The only time I get better mileage with the PSD is when I'm towing. But I now have a 26 gallon tank as opposed to the 36 on the EB, so mileage for a tank is actually lower. Towing the load you are, I would honestly look at an F150 with the 2.7L EB. I was on the Ford website yesterday and it claims there are almost $10K in FORD incentives on them right now. With dealer discount you should be able to get one at $14-$17K OFF MSRP depending on trim level. You'll get much better unloaded mileage and it will considerably out-tow the 5.0L.
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:38 AM   #36
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Some folks don't like humor...........

ok, later.......
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:39 AM   #37
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A F150 Crew Cab has 145" wheelbase my F350 SuperCab has 143.5 wheelbase.
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Old 05-31-2016, 08:41 AM   #38
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ljs1211

what kind of trips do you plan pulling that trailer?..........if you dont venture many miles from home and dont spend that many days in your trailer, if it were me.....considering the cost of changing tv to diesel, i would just stick with the 150. ...........but if you are doing long trips and spending many days camping...and your pocket can handle what its gonna cost, i would definately
switch to diesel.....you just cant beat a diesel truck for hauling.
someone mention noisy and smelly....you have to buy a truck 10 yrs old to get that......these newer trucks have come a long way.
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Old 05-31-2016, 09:39 AM   #39
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I towed 7000 # TT with a 2.7 eb and it did fine except terrible milage towing that light weight. The 6.7 diesel pulls a 11,500 5er with ease and much better milage. It is almost 7 months old with 17,000 ~~~ 4000 towing. Mountains turn into little knolls and the engine brake coming down is a dream. Made it my daily driver and the suv stays in the garage.
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Old 05-31-2016, 05:59 PM   #40
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I've had 6 Chevy Duramax's from 2003 to 2012...
We used 5 of them to pull 5th-wheel flatbed trailers with manufactured stair products my company builds... for local deliveries (100 miles round trip)
One of them (2008) is a truck we'll use to pull a pontoon boat or a 18 foot Desert Fox toy hauler to hunting camp once a year or an occasional trip somewhere.
The only truck that has not had catastrophic failures is the 2003...


If you added up all the mileage from all 6 trucks, you can't get to 300,000 miles combined.


You can talk mileage all you want, but when you pay $7000 or more for a diesel truck and the constant upkeep... Then have to replace the turbos, the injectors, the glow plugs, the many sensors... it starts to add cost to the "cost of ownership"....
I did a quick estimate not long ago that says when you average all the problems we've had with diesel trucks and the associated costs, you won't break even until you reach closer to 175,000 miles vs a gas rig.

There is no question the diesel out pulls the gas.... especially in the mountains but the miles per gallon are about the same.... the only time any of my duramax got anywhere close to 12mpg is when they were getting towed to the repair shop...
All of the trucks are serviced according to the manual by certified Chevrolet Techs, so we can save the argument that neglect is the reason for all (6) diesels going bad.

I work with some LTL freight companies to haul light loads up and down the west coast, and they have had their share of issues too... but it is their jobs to haul every day. After 3 or 4 hundred miles their trucks are used up and have been in the shop time after time...

I think it just depends on how much the truck will be used...how heavy the load you'll be pulling and how deep your pockets are...

Whatever your decision, have fun and enjoy camping!
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