Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-09-2016, 09:29 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 466
Help with understanding 5th wheel

Weight numbers to determine a tow vehicle. I thought I had a basic understanding of this stuff, and the more we look into 5th wheels the more I realize I have no idea what I am doing. LOL Currently we have a 2013 Surveyor Sport SP260 that has fit our family well for the past three years. It is towed with a Ram 1500 5.9L with factory tow package. We know we have to upgrade to a newer TV when we make the jump to a 5th wheel.

Case in point, we looked at a Dutchman Voltage 3605 that has the dry weight of 13,555 and 2,992 hitch (is this also called pin?) weight. With a total max weight of 16,800. I have seen slightly different numbers depending on which site have looked at. I have trolled the Ford, Chevy and Ram site playing around building a truck to pull weight such as these. Again my 5th wheel knowledge is very slim, but I have seen many "large" 5th wheels being pulled by HD 250/2500 non dually trucks. Are all these people thumbing their nose at the Weight Police? Could someone help break this info down to a beginner lever and layman speak?
__________________
2017 Keystone Cougar 28RDB
Buck1032 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 09:49 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Iwannacamp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,916
I have no advice...but 17,000lbs. is a lot of weight. 3/4 Ram diesel 4dr 4wd only has 2300# of cargo if I am not mistaken...so if it's a Ram prolly need 1T.


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums
__________________
2017 Puma 297RLSS
2005 Ram 2500 4X4 diesel SMOKER!!
I love puns, irony and tasteless jokes...
born in Texas.... live in Arkansas
Iwannacamp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 09:50 PM   #3
Phat Phrog Stunt Team
 
TURBS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 34,507
Help with understanding 5th wheel

Imo you need a dually to pull that unit.
The 2992 hitch "pin" weight will go up as you load the trailer.
Dry weight means nothing "loose" that number.
Base your truck on the 16,800 lbs.

You'll run out of cargo carrying capacity on your truck "pin weight any cargo in bed and passengers " long before your run out of towing capacity.


2015 Columbus 320RS
2008 2500HD Duramax
2015 nights camped "34"
TURBS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 09:53 PM   #4
Who Dares, Wins
 
doc73's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Chester County, PA
Posts: 7,063
Yeah, 3000lbs( which is code for real world of probably 4000lbs real weight ) is 500 over my 2015 Chevy 2500 duramax's payload of 2500... With no one in the vehicle their stuff or anything in the rv...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk
__________________

Pat, Jen, Heather & Sapphire, the head mouser.
2015 Chevy HD D-Max
2022 Impression 315MB
doc73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:03 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
davel1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Seaford, De
Posts: 2,377
you'll need 5000 lbs of payload. 4000 for loaded trailer. 1000 for weight of hitch, people and other stuff in truck cab and bed. Dually for sure
__________________
David & Lynn
2014 Coachmen Chaparral Signature 327 RLKS
2016 Ford F350 Lariat CC Dually
davel1971 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:05 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 496
Go 1 ton. You could do a SRW and just add air bags to assist in leveling if needed. If that was my unit, I'd most likely go with a dually.
__________________
Doc
____________________________________
2014 V-Cross Platinum 365VTSB (Bought Labor Day 2014)
TV: 2016 GMC 3500 Denali - Motor Ops Tuned
Days Camped 2016: 28
Days Camped 2017: 25 so far
DocGTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:06 PM   #7
Who Dares, Wins
 
doc73's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Chester County, PA
Posts: 7,063
I think it's even too much for a srw 1 ton.. Prob 3500 to 4000 payload.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk
__________________

Pat, Jen, Heather & Sapphire, the head mouser.
2015 Chevy HD D-Max
2022 Impression 315MB
doc73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:09 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Space Coast of Florida
Posts: 3,954
Payload, payload, payload... Pin weight, 5th wheel hitch, passengers, fuel, cargo...

Guesstimate for above 3360lbs ( pin wt., 20% max weight) + 200lbs ( hitch, min) + 300lbs (passengers, being nice) + 200 lbs (26 gallons diesel, could be more) + 100lbs cargo. These items alone add up to 4160 lbs of payload. No way a 250/2500 series truck can even come close to handling this. You will need a 350/3500 DRW at a min to haul that baby....
__________________


2016 Siverback 33IK, Towed 50K+ mile
2018 Ford F-350 Lariat 6.7L V8 Diesel 4WD Crew Cab

"If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there."
dalford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:18 PM   #9
Moderator Emeritus
 
asquared's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,069
This exact topic recently hashed out this issue with a similar weight trailer in This thread.
__________________
<a href=https://i62.tinypic.com/28rp645.jpg target=_blank>https://i62.tinypic.com/28rp645.jpg</a>
2014 Crew Cab Chevy Silverado 3500 4wd Duramax/Allison
2014 Sabre 34REQS-6
asquared is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:23 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
CWSWine's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,016
Use this site and play with numbers and you soon see what it takes. This written by a forum member on these forums...

Towing Planner - towing capability calculators
__________________
2017 Fleetwood Discovery LXE 40D Diesel Pusher 41 foot. CC 5740
2017 Solitude 310GK-R Pick Up Oct 24th.
2016 GMC Denali 1 ton Cargo Capacity 3722 lbs
Sold 2016 Keystone Montana 3711FL
Sold - 2015 Crusader 315RST 5th Wheel -
2015 Ford F350 SRW Cargo Capacity 3744
CWSWine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:38 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 466
Asquared, thanks for that link. I saw that thread yesterday but it wasn't as in depth then. When I read it it was still more about the OP looking for the sticker. I will study that thread again. Thank you everyone.
__________________
2017 Keystone Cougar 28RDB
Buck1032 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 10:08 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 466
I have read completely the thread ASQ linked and I am thankful for the info and education I have received on this subject. There are many things we will have to consider before we make the jump up to a 5th wheel. Secondly I am glad my plea for help didn't follow the path that thread took. Thanks everyone.
__________________
2017 Keystone Cougar 28RDB
Buck1032 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 10:39 AM   #13
Senior Member
 
CWSWine's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,016
I think everyone should weight the RV and get correct weights at least once, many people that stubby pencil their weights might be in for a surprise. My current 5th wheel jump for a 19.6 dry pin weight percentage to 24.1 when loaded ready to camp. My personnel feelings that you should stay with in the GVWR and all of the manufacture specs of your truck but many believe that heaviest you should every be is you max axle weights. Going over the GVWR a lot times will exceed you rear tire weight ratings also and that another important safety factor. I feel you can't make a educated guess unless you have the proper verified information but the problem is you won't have those verified numbers till after you purchase the truck and the 5er and load them ready to camp and put it on the scales. Good luck and have fun with your search for the right combo of truck and camper that you can put your love ones and keep them safe and error on the safe side.
__________________
2017 Fleetwood Discovery LXE 40D Diesel Pusher 41 foot. CC 5740
2017 Solitude 310GK-R Pick Up Oct 24th.
2016 GMC Denali 1 ton Cargo Capacity 3722 lbs
Sold 2016 Keystone Montana 3711FL
Sold - 2015 Crusader 315RST 5th Wheel -
2015 Ford F350 SRW Cargo Capacity 3744
CWSWine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 10:49 AM   #14
Senior Member
 
CWSWine's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck1032 View Post
I have read completely the thread ASQ linked and I am thankful for the info and education I have received on this subject. There are many things we will have to consider before we make the jump up to a 5th wheel. Secondly I am glad my plea for help didn't follow the path that thread took. Thanks everyone.
What sent that thread south was someone saying you fine and within specs when the OP posted his payload on the truck was under 2300 lbs and the dry pin on the 5er was over 2500 lbs so over 200 pounds over GVWR before he put any weight in the truck or the 5th wheel.
__________________
2017 Fleetwood Discovery LXE 40D Diesel Pusher 41 foot. CC 5740
2017 Solitude 310GK-R Pick Up Oct 24th.
2016 GMC Denali 1 ton Cargo Capacity 3722 lbs
Sold 2016 Keystone Montana 3711FL
Sold - 2015 Crusader 315RST 5th Wheel -
2015 Ford F350 SRW Cargo Capacity 3744
CWSWine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 10:54 AM   #15
Gold Miner At Heart
 
Papa-t's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: N.C. Blue Ridge Mtns.
Posts: 293
Going from a 26 to 36 is a big jump. 5ers will tow so much easier then a TT and you may need a 1ton to pull that thing depending on weight of the trailer and what you need to cover that. I have owned several in the past 18 years. My largest has been a 36 with 4 slides. Finally decided that I didn't need that large of a unit anymore. I'm now back to a 24.7 5er. So much less stress for me. Everyone is different and I certainly wouldn't discourage anyone that wants to go bigger with more comfort. Good luck with your decision and happy camping.
__________________
“I have tried to live my life so that my family would love me and my friends would respect me. The others can do whatever the Hell they please!” —John Wayne
Papa-t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 11:32 AM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 820
If I were getting that unit and if all the numbers were correct, I would get a 350/3500 SRW. But that's just me.

I had a 2011 F450 for two years before my current 2015 F350 SRW now. I just like the SRW better. My F350 loaded up with fuel, the hitch, and us leaves about 3500 lbs. of payload for the rear axle. I am in the process of finding my next toy hauler and our preferred unit so far has a pin weight of approximately 3250 lbs..

I bought a Sherline scale which can handle 5000 lbs. so before we do anything, the pin will be weighed in the back of the truck to confirm whether or not we can sign the papers. Pin weight is all I'm really concerned about.
KFX450RXC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 11:46 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 466
Our plan is to gather as much info, learn as much as we can, then make our best educated purchases. I feel that the TV needs to exceed the max weights of what ever 5th wheel we get. Right now my gasser 1500 Ram meets and exceeds our TT weights, by almost 1k pounds. I prefer to have a good margin of error and not push the limits of the truck or 5th wheel. We are still happy with our TT for now. And are just starting our process to figure out what we want next. Prior to actually getting a new truck we want to have the best possible idea of the size and weight of the 5th wheel we desire. So we can match the vehicle size to the camper size. I am pretty sure I could tow that 16,995 tow hauler with my little 1500 Ram on a flat level road. I am also pretty sure that 1500 wouldn't be able to stop it and would break before we got to a campground. Situations we are looking to avoid. Thanks every one for the constructive advice and help. We have a lot of reading and research to do before we even start kicking tires.


I should have stated that my Dodge 1500 could tow it once.
__________________
2017 Keystone Cougar 28RDB
Buck1032 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 12:03 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
dieselguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,272
I'm a seasonal camper ... not a full nor long timer. I've found many responders on any RV site when it comes to weight opinions beat the tambourine real heavy about what you call total max weight of the RV. We load food and drink, clothes, kitchenware, water skis, chairs, hammock, camping essentials, ice maker, and other stuff and never come near max weight of my fiver nor any of the 3 previous units. Gauge your personal RV life for a real world weight of what normally hooks to your truck. Weigh what you already have loaded and empty for something to go on. You may come to realize you really don't haul around everything including the "kitchen sink".
dieselguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 12:19 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
B and B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 10,833
Send a message via AIM to B and B
Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselguy View Post
I'm a seasonal camper ... not a full nor long timer. I've found many responders on any RV site when it comes to weight opinions beat the tambourine real heavy about what you call total max weight of the RV. We load food and drink, clothes, kitchenware, water skis, chairs, hammock, camping essentials, ice maker, and other stuff and never come near max weight of my fiver nor any of the 3 previous units. Gauge your personal RV life for a real world weight of what normally hooks to your truck. Weigh what you already have loaded and empty for something to go on. You may come to realize you really don't haul around everything including the "kitchen sink".
I have to agree. We have a Rockwood loaded near capacity when we carry a full tank of water. The upgrade we are looking at is 14,500 and we will just transfer our contents we have over to the new trailer. Will never be maximum weight. Looking at what you do vs what the max load might be is a one way to size the truck.
That being said a 1 ton is minimum for the OP trailer.
__________________
B and B
2022 Venture RV SportTrek STT 302 VRB Travel Trailer
2018 Heartland Landmark 365 Louisville 5th Wheel
2015 Heartland Bighorn 5th Wheel
2013 FR Rockwood 8289WS 5th Wheel
2012 FR Rockwood 2703 SS Travel Trailer
B and B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 12:22 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Corpus Christi
Posts: 342
Consider a F450 if you are considering an F350. The pricing is so close that it just makes sense to have the larger axle, commercial tires, and far higher tow capacity.
__________________
Corpus Christi, Texas

TT: 2016 40' Chaparral 360IBL at 14000lbs
TV: 2016 F450 Platinum 6.7 CC LWB FX4, B&W Companion Hitch
IronCobra is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
5th wheel, wheel

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Forest River, Inc. or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:44 AM.