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09-11-2019, 11:38 AM
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#21
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Dayton Ohio
Posts: 3,591
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The SAE test of trailer towing is specifically to judge ability to tow, stop etc their trailer, not yours.
That trailer in no way resembles yours!
I saw a picture of it. About 20’ long shaped like a Porsche 911 with lots of weight.
Wind resistance is not involved.
Thus with a 32’ long 8’ wide 10’ tall box your results will be somewhat different.
You may not be able to pull it to 60. Wind resistance! The first 20 mph crosswind might be an adventure. Trucks will suck you up, maybe. That’s a dandy sail. Like a 30’ sailboat with the rail in the water?
Going downhill in the rain could be interesting.
Ask questions.
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09-11-2019, 11:47 AM
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#22
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Bellbrook, OH
Posts: 403
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So for information I've been confused with this weight thing, so if I add up driver, wife, fuel, potato chips, stuff in the bed of truck plus my hitch, that number should be less than the posted door stick cargo carrying capacity that makes it safe
Quote:
Originally Posted by bikendan
What's the payload capacity of your truck?
It's on the driver's door yellow sticker. It'll say something like "Occupants and cargo should not exceed xxxxlbs".
No matter what they say is the towing capacity, you'll run out of payload capacity WAY before getting close to that towing capacity number.
That's why payload capacity is more important than towing capacity, especially for 5th wheels.
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__________________
2019 FR Vibe 28RL
2018 Silverado 1500, Husky Centerline TS
3 Great Danes, 1 Weimaraner
Wonderful co-pilot
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09-11-2019, 12:19 PM
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#23
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Yellowknife
Posts: 1,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatme
So for information I've been confused with this weight thing, so if I add up driver, wife, fuel, potato chips, stuff in the bed of truck plus my hitch, that number should be less than the posted door stick cargo carrying capacity that makes it safe
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I can't remember when they include a 150lb driver and fuel in the equation, but otherwise yes. I'm sure someone will chime in to clarify.
__________________
2007 Rockwood 2701SS
2017 Ram 2500 Granite Crystal SAP Laramie 6.7L
2014 Triumph Bonneville. NH Togas, tuned
1953 GMC 9314
1982 GoldWing Interstate
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09-11-2019, 12:50 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: North Port Florida
Posts: 2,050
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomkatb
The SAE test of trailer towing is specifically to judge ability to tow, stop etc their trailer, not yours.
That trailer in no way resembles yours!
I saw a picture of it. About 20’ long shaped like a Porsche 911 with lots of weight.
Wind resistance is not involved.
Thus with a 32’ long 8’ wide 10’ tall box your results will be somewhat different.
You may not be able to pull it to 60. Wind resistance! The first 20 mph crosswind might be an adventure. Trucks will suck you up, maybe. That’s a dandy sail. Like a 30’ sailboat with the rail in the water?
Going downhill in the rain could be interesting.
Ask questions.
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Tom you are so correct on this .... so much more goes into towing your camper .... the #'s ... HP ... Torque ...Transmission... gear ratio ..height and length of camper ... is it loaded properly ... correct hitch correctly set up ... weather/rain/wind all factors and one more most important driver and his/her experience ... I am getting my rig weighted tomorrow after new Goodyear Endurance are installed I will be over payload a little and I will be my best guess 1800lbs under max towing and 1000lbs under GCWR.... really want to see my axle weights hooked up ... as far as able to pull to 60 would be scary to push the Hemi even a little and trucks do not move me even a little and I am 13' ... any wind over 25 I stay home ... Thanks Frank
__________________
Frank & Cindy--- (SOB) 5th Wheel ---2019 Ram 3500 Cummins 6.7 SRW 4x4 8' bed--- Payload 4394------Remi & Sage camping pups---TST 507 TPMS ... B&W Patriot 18K---3.73 axle ... Predator 3500---2019 48 days ---2020 28 days Camping
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09-11-2019, 01:04 PM
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#25
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Sham183
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 626
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Payload payload payload! So manufacturers test their trucks with a certain trim level and options to get their highest number possible for towing. Got to love marketing. And then it goes downhill from there. Different configurations will give you different tow numbers. More options usually means less payload. So look at that little yellow sticker on your door jamb and see what it says. Let’s just say If you have a 1800 lbs payload and 1000# TW you only got 800# of payload left for a fully loaded up truck with cargo, fuel, family and anything else In the truck. So it adds up fast. Good luck.
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09-11-2019, 02:12 PM
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#26
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Site Team
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 33,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatme
So for information I've been confused with this weight thing, so if I add up driver, wife, fuel, potato chips, stuff in the bed of truck plus my hitch, that number should be less than the posted door stick cargo carrying capacity that makes it safe
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If you add the loaded tongue weight and delete fuel weight, to your list, then YES.
You don't add fuel to your list. Full fuel tank is already factored in.
__________________
Dan-Retired California Firefighter/EMT
Shawn-Musician/Entrepreneur/Wine Expert
and Zoe the Wonder Dog(R.I.P.)
2016 PrimeTime TracerAIR 255, pushing a 2014 Ford F150 SCREW XTR 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost w/Max Tow Package
4pt Equal-i-zer WDH and 1828lbs of payload capacity
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09-11-2019, 02:14 PM
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#27
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Site Team
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 33,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lins
I can't remember when they include a 150lb driver and fuel in the equation, but otherwise yes. I'm sure someone will chime in to clarify.
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150lb driver and full fuel tank is factored in, for the TOWING capacity.
Full fuel tank is the only thing factored in PAYLOAD capacity.
__________________
Dan-Retired California Firefighter/EMT
Shawn-Musician/Entrepreneur/Wine Expert
and Zoe the Wonder Dog(R.I.P.)
2016 PrimeTime TracerAIR 255, pushing a 2014 Ford F150 SCREW XTR 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost w/Max Tow Package
4pt Equal-i-zer WDH and 1828lbs of payload capacity
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09-11-2019, 02:18 PM
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#28
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Site Team
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 33,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry0071
The 2020 Silverado 1500:
2020 Chevrolet Silverado 1500
Pickup truck
Towing capacity: 6,600 to 9,800 lbs
Payload: 1,660 to 2,280 lbs
MPG: Up to 20 city / 23 highway
Engine: 2.7 L 4-cylinder, 3.0 L 6-cylinder diesel, 4.3 L V6, 5.3 L V8, 6.2 L V8
6.2L EcoTec3 V8 WITH DYNAMIC FUEL MANAGEMENT
- 420 horsepower and 460 lb.-ft. of torque
- 10-speed automatic transmission
- Best-in-class V8 horsepower and torque†(5)
- Best-in-class 13,400-lb. maximum towing capability†(13)
- Available on LTZ and High Country. Late availability on Custom Trail Boss, RST and LT Trail Boss
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Larry, this list still doesn't specify the actual payload capacity for each truck.
I'll bet there are some of these with less than the 1660lbs low end of the listed payload range.
__________________
Dan-Retired California Firefighter/EMT
Shawn-Musician/Entrepreneur/Wine Expert
and Zoe the Wonder Dog(R.I.P.)
2016 PrimeTime TracerAIR 255, pushing a 2014 Ford F150 SCREW XTR 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost w/Max Tow Package
4pt Equal-i-zer WDH and 1828lbs of payload capacity
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09-11-2019, 02:42 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: North Port Florida
Posts: 2,050
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bikendan
150lb driver and full fuel tank is factored in, for the TOWING capacity.
Full fuel tank is the only thing factored in PAYLOAD capacity.
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x + y x r =x/r easy got it
__________________
Frank & Cindy--- (SOB) 5th Wheel ---2019 Ram 3500 Cummins 6.7 SRW 4x4 8' bed--- Payload 4394------Remi & Sage camping pups---TST 507 TPMS ... B&W Patriot 18K---3.73 axle ... Predator 3500---2019 48 days ---2020 28 days Camping
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09-11-2019, 03:11 PM
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#30
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: ALASKA (World's Biggest Campground)
Posts: 6,725
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You can load that rig up however you want and nobody will bother you, however keep in mind that axles have max capacities, and you have ascertain if you have enough brake to manage a steep descent and stop it. Newton's 1st Law Of Motion applies here.
If an accident happens (God forbid), and an investigation ensues, there may be some questions asked.
All I can say is that you are in charge of your own safety.
__________________
'07 K3500 Silverado LT Crew Duramax (LBZ)
2016 Salem 27RKSS
1984 CHEV SCOTTSDALE K20 2GCGK24J0E1XXXXXX (Chevrolet Legends-Class of 2019)
"...exhaust fluid? We don't need no stinkin' exhaust fluid"
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09-11-2019, 03:24 PM
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#31
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 432
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This stuff on towing capacity comes up about once a month or so when new folks appear. Towing capacity is based on structural design(including max tow packages) and power of the vehicle. And you are almost always limited by cargo capacity for the quarter ton truck(which of course isn't really a quarter ton truck anymore with cargo capacities approaching 2000lb). This typical limit by cargo appears to be because they move engine hp up faster than they redesign the vehicles when they seem to improve structural support.
My 2016 F-150 has listed about a 12000 lb towing capacity and 1600 cargo capacity. Realistically it would be hard to get more than a 7000-8000 lb trailer on and meet the cargo capacity.
Based on experience and what I have heard from others the 2016 F-150 I have should be limited to maybe a 8000-9000 lb trailer because it starts to feel really limited in the braking area. Perhaps you can go higher if you only use it in Florida, but I drive through the Rockies. And yet they give it 12000 lb tow rating, not a useful practical number as far as I can tell.
My brother has a similar truck and 7000 lb trailer(loaded) and he loads everything to the max ratings. He has already replaced his brakes before 40000 miles, maybe half with the trailer. My trailer is around 6000 lb loaded and I feel comfortable in the Rocky Mtns but am still careful on the those long steep hills. Brakes are still ok at 50k, 30k with the trailer.
The new F-150s seem to have higher cargo capacities and hitch capacity so maybe you can go a little higher, but I'm not sure of the brakes.
So if the 1500 has an 1800 cargo capacity you are probably limited to about an 8000lb trailer (total weight after loading), depends on how many people, what stuff you want in the truck, etc. You would also need to take everything to a scale to make sure the trailer is balanced right for optimum hitch weight, etc., to get there.
__________________
Jeff
2016 APEX 215rbk
2016 F-150 4WD 3.55 3.5l ecoboost
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09-11-2019, 03:33 PM
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#32
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Posts: 349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deepseadan
The tow capacity doesn’t mean anything. Like another post said payload capacity is everything. “Most” 1500’s or 150’s I’ve seen have around 1400 - 1800lbs payload and 2500 and 3500’s jump up and can almost double the payload of the 1500’s. Payload includes people, cargo, and tongue or pin weight. I used to go by tow rating as well so don’t feel bad. If you go over the payload capacity you are breaking the law and as I’ve found out, your entire rig usually doesn’t handle very well.
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I was just dealing with a guy that has a 2012 Ram 3500 diesel with a payload of 2740lbs. A full 300lbs more than my F150 which is at 2440.
__________________
2017 F150 XLT 3.5l Eco Boost, SC, 8' Box, 4X4
Max Tow (10 speed, 3:73, 11,700lbs), HD Payload (2440lbs)
2015 Puma 253 FBS
2013 Hyundai Santa Fe
2000 Honda EX 400, Rad Rover 6 Plus
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09-11-2019, 03:57 PM
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#33
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Always Learning
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Four Corners, FL
Posts: 21,891
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palinduff
I was just dealing with a guy that has a 2012 Ram 3500 diesel with a payload of 2740lbs. A full 300lbs more than my F150 which is at 2440.
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The 2012 and early Mega Cabs had incredibly low payload numbers like that. Even in a dually.
I had a 2012 Mega Cab (longer cab, shorter bed) side by side with a 2012 Crew Cab (shorter cab, longer bed). There was more than 1,000 lbs difference in payload.
It was the craziest thing. Only thing I can guess is the springs they used on the Mega Cab were soft and cushy to give it more of a comfortable unloaded ride.
__________________
Officially a SOB with a 2022 Jayco Precept 36C
Checkout my site for RVing tips, tricks, and info | Was a Fulltime Family for 5 years, now we're part-timing on long trips
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09-11-2019, 06:26 PM
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#34
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 68
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Wow I feel like I stirred up a hornets nest. So if I frustrated anyone by bringing up a sore subject I apologize. I spent so much time trying my best to read up on this and understand all of it but it just makes my brain swell. So this is what I ended up with. Mind you when I bought the TT they told me my truck didn’t need a WDH. I told them I didn’t care I wanted one anyway because it made me feel safer. Not sure if I needed it or not.
[ATTACH ]214724[/ATTACH]
__________________
TV 2017 Chevy Silverado 6.2
TT 2018 Forest River 261 BHS
Be safe and Happy Camping.
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09-11-2019, 06:30 PM
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#35
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 68
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Ok only one pic posted, I posted one of the TT as well.
__________________
TV 2017 Chevy Silverado 6.2
TT 2018 Forest River 261 BHS
Be safe and Happy Camping.
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09-11-2019, 07:13 PM
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#36
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Near Pittsburgh Pa
Posts: 518
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Mud, you need to show the yellow sticker in the door jam. That shows the payload. Nothing here shows that.
__________________
2019 Ram Bighorn, CC/SB 2500 4x4 6.4L/8 Speed, Max Tow 14,460 lb/2,940 lb payload.
2019 F-150 King Ranch 3.5 Eco, 12,800 lb/1,546 payload.
2020 Coachmen Apex UL 289TBSS
2019 Quality Trailers 16'x7' 7K GVWR Utility Trailer
2019 IronBull 22'x102" 14K GVWR Equipment Trailer
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09-11-2019, 07:27 PM
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#37
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 68
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Sorry I thought I had the right one.
__________________
TV 2017 Chevy Silverado 6.2
TT 2018 Forest River 261 BHS
Be safe and Happy Camping.
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09-11-2019, 07:32 PM
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#38
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Site Team
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 33,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudbug
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That's a decent payload for a 1/2 ton.
That's almost 120lbs more than my 2014 F150 SCREW 4x4 3.5 EcoBoost with Max Tow package. Certainly not even close to a F150 XLT with HDPP package though.
__________________
Dan-Retired California Firefighter/EMT
Shawn-Musician/Entrepreneur/Wine Expert
and Zoe the Wonder Dog(R.I.P.)
2016 PrimeTime TracerAIR 255, pushing a 2014 Ford F150 SCREW XTR 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost w/Max Tow Package
4pt Equal-i-zer WDH and 1828lbs of payload capacity
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09-11-2019, 07:37 PM
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#39
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 68
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Ok so how do I use that to determine what is the heaviest TT I can tow and if I need a WDH or not.
__________________
TV 2017 Chevy Silverado 6.2
TT 2018 Forest River 261 BHS
Be safe and Happy Camping.
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09-11-2019, 08:04 PM
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#40
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Site Team
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 33,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudbug
Ok so how do I use that to determine what is the heaviest TT I can tow and if I need a WDH or not.
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Your truck's owners manual will have WDH information, in the Towing section. Have you read it yet?
If you're going over 5000lbs loaded, YES you need a WDH.
Your hitch receiver will also have a max tongue weight, even with a WDH. Somewhere around 1300lbs.
__________________
Dan-Retired California Firefighter/EMT
Shawn-Musician/Entrepreneur/Wine Expert
and Zoe the Wonder Dog(R.I.P.)
2016 PrimeTime TracerAIR 255, pushing a 2014 Ford F150 SCREW XTR 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost w/Max Tow Package
4pt Equal-i-zer WDH and 1828lbs of payload capacity
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