Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-11-2016, 04:27 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
thebrakeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Canton, Michigan
Posts: 1,105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Vibe View Post
I have a 2013 1500 with it. Tow a Vibe 6501. I have had no issues with it. Controls the trailer better than the prodigy P2 controller I had. In slow traffic I would find the prodigy would grab but the OEM is smother.
Off topic:
Did you have the boost turned on with the Prodigy (b1, b2, or b3)? That sends voltage to the trailer brakes as soon as you touch the brakes. Personally, I like to feel the trailer leading the braking event, so I leave it on b1.
__________________

__________________
thebrakeman ('70), DW ('71), DD ('99), DD ('01), DD ('05)
2004 Surveyor SV261T (UltraLite Bunkhouse Hybrid)
2006 Mercury Mountaineer V8 AWD Premier
Equal-i-zer WDH (10k), Prodigy Brake Controller
thebrakeman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2016, 05:30 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
thebrakeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Canton, Michigan
Posts: 1,105
I agree that if you have the option of using an integrated controller, it's as good or better than the best aftermarket solution. It will cost you significantly more (about double), compared to the Tekonsha-Prodigy P2 or P3.

However:
1. These integrated systems must us a lot more than just pressure. I know for certain that the "Trailer Sway Control" systems have been tied into the stability control for many years now, which uses wheel speed sensors, accelerometers, yaw sensors, etc. With all of those sensors available to the engineers, it would be foolish not to use them. it is very likely that deceleration data is the primary input (just like a good aftermarket unit), with pressure and other inputs being analyzed concurrently, to inform the CPU of special situations (like an ABS event, etc).

2. The performance (measured in stopping distance) will not be far superior to a good, aftermarket, accelerometer-based controller, like the Tekonsha-Prodigy P2 or P3. Again, it will be as good or better. But if both systems are set up with equal care, you will not see significant differences in stopping distance.
__________________

__________________
thebrakeman ('70), DW ('71), DD ('99), DD ('01), DD ('05)
2004 Surveyor SV261T (UltraLite Bunkhouse Hybrid)
2006 Mercury Mountaineer V8 AWD Premier
Equal-i-zer WDH (10k), Prodigy Brake Controller
thebrakeman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2016, 06:21 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,101
It was not 100% apples to apples as the prodigy was in a minivan and the OEM is in the ram. But I did have to change the setting more on the prodigy than I have with the OEM.
__________________
Ontario

Vibe 6501
1 Prospector Canoe
2 Mtn. Bikes
4 Hiking Boots
Happy Vibe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2016, 07:19 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Wisconsin/Florida
Posts: 793
Emm-dee said it all.

We have a '13 Silverado with integrated brake controller and won't buy another TV without it. We will be adding one to our 2500TS on a Ford E-450 chassis. This is one of the best bargains available for a TV.
__________________
PenJoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2016, 07:29 PM   #15
Usually Confused Member
 
emm-dee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,610
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebrakeman View Post
I agree that if you have the option of using an integrated controller, it's as good or better than the best aftermarket solution. It will cost you significantly more (about double), compared to the Tekonsha-Prodigy P2 or P3.

However:
1. These integrated systems must us a lot more than just pressure. I know for certain that the "Trailer Sway Control" systems have been tied into the stability control for many years now, which uses wheel speed sensors, accelerometers, yaw sensors, etc. With all of those sensors available to the engineers, it would be foolish not to use them. it is very likely that deceleration data is the primary input (just like a good aftermarket unit), with pressure and other inputs being analyzed concurrently, to inform the CPU of special situations (like an ABS event, etc).

2. The performance (measured in stopping distance) will not be far superior to a good, aftermarket, accelerometer-based controller, like the Tekonsha-Prodigy P2 or P3. Again, it will be as good or better. But if both systems are set up with equal care, you will not see significant differences in stopping distance.
Good post, but I'm not sure about primary input being deceleration data. Watch the "slider" display and it is directly proportional to the amount of brake pedal movement and pressure being applied. Whether sitting still or moving down the road when you barely touch the brake pedal (just enough to activate the brake lights, meaning not much) there will be a small amount of voltage sent to the brakes. However, that same pressure will not be adequate to activate any of the vehicle hydraulic brake cylinders.

I had the Prodigy in my previous Ram and it was a great unit. Worked smooth and accurately all the time. If one does a really fast (panic?) stop then both systems are going to send all the power they can to the trailer brakes. The trailer brakes don't care how the power is getting there. They only see full power and do their best to lock up the wheels. We don't do panic stops very often. However, the integrated controller, under normal driving conditions, shines because of its smoothness. That feature was very noticeable to me when I went from the prodigy to the integrated.

I have developed the habit with both controllers to set the brake power setting very high when traveling at interstate speeds. I rarely need brakes under that condition except when I exit, and it's just automatic for me to reduce the power just prior to exiting. But, if I need aggressive braking then I prefer the trailer brakes lead the truck so they pull it. Much less chance of a jack knife. Pretty sure the Prodigy is just as effective at that.
__________________
At some point during every day you suddenly realize nothing else productive is going to happen the rest of that day. For me, it usually occurs around 9 am.

Vengeance 25V (the Harley needed a home)
emm-dee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 01:41 AM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Oregon
Posts: 511
My 2012 Ram 2500 OEM TBC was faulty right out of the gate. Truck was less than a week old and the TBC didn't work. Got a new one under warranty and it's no better. I've towed two trailers with the Ram. A TT and a 5th wheel. The TT worked great with the prior truck, a 2010 F150. Smooth as silk. Then I bought the Ram and couldn't get the TT brakes to work right. Bought a Tekonsha IQ. Now the TT brakes worked great. Sold the TT and bought our current 5th wheel. Same thing. The OEM TBC doesn't work as well as the Tekonsha.
Go over to the Cummins diesel forum and read about the guys having trouble with their TBCs. Not that many but enough that it seems to be an issue for some.
I even tried going from the Light to Heavy setting and no change.

The biggest issue is in town. It feels like the trailer brakes aren't even their. The truck has to do most of the stopping. I recently read that under a certain speed Ram has dialed in the voltage to be low. That seems to be what's causing the TBC to not work right in town.
__________________
goduc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 10:28 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
thebrakeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Canton, Michigan
Posts: 1,105
emm-dee,
I work in the braking industry, and I don't agree with a few of your statements. But I won't continue arguing.

Would I check the integrated option on my next tow vehicle, if available? Yes. It looks better in the cab, and will work at least as well as the Prodigy.

Would I spend $250 to update my existing vehicle, if it were available? No way. That's how well my Prodigy has functioned on 2 trailers and 3 tow vehicles since 2003.
__________________
thebrakeman ('70), DW ('71), DD ('99), DD ('01), DD ('05)
2004 Surveyor SV261T (UltraLite Bunkhouse Hybrid)
2006 Mercury Mountaineer V8 AWD Premier
Equal-i-zer WDH (10k), Prodigy Brake Controller
thebrakeman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 09:11 PM   #18
Usually Confused Member
 
emm-dee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,610
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebrakeman View Post
emm-dee,
I work in the braking industry, and I don't agree with a few of your statements. But I won't continue arguing.

Would I check the integrated option on my next tow vehicle, if available? Yes. It looks better in the cab, and will work at least as well as the Prodigy.

Would I spend $250 to update my existing vehicle, if it were available? No way. That's how well my Prodigy has functioned on 2 trailers and 3 tow vehicles since 2003.
Oh, it's not an argument. The best thing about this forum for me is all the information I've been able to get.

My original information about the integrated controller came from a Ram factory service rep. When I originally purchased the truck it did not have the controller, even though it had the so-called tow package. I intended to install the Prodigy and while I was asking a service manager about how to locate the wiring needed to connect it the factory rep told me about the IBC. That's where I learned from him about the brake pedal pressure activation rather than deceleration activation.

The only reason I purchased the Ram system and later sold the Prodigy for $100 was the clean installation, meaning nothing showing except the +/- and slider controls below the U-connect. I just don't like anything attached to the the interior. That's why I use a WiFi observation camera with viewing via the iPhone sitting in front of the tachometer---nothing restricting the view out the windshield. I have another Prodigy in my '03 Cummins Ram and definitely notice it's just not as smooth as the IBC in the '14, although it works very, very well. I might add that compared to the Reese brake controllers I was using ten years ago the Prodigy is heaven in an electronic box.

In a related matter, in your unedited post you mentioned that if the anti-skid started working on the truck and the trailer had more braking power than the truck there could be a jack-knife situation. That confuses me because I've always heard that a jack-knife situation occurs when the trailer is pushing the truck. Even with anti-skid in operation wouldn't it be better if the trailer was pulling back on the truck? Coming from an aviation background where we intentionally used anti skid on a regular basis I am not impressed at all with the operation of the systems used on our cars and trucks. Please enlighten me on how or why the trailer should have less braking in that situation because I just don't understand it.
__________________
At some point during every day you suddenly realize nothing else productive is going to happen the rest of that day. For me, it usually occurs around 9 am.

Vengeance 25V (the Harley needed a home)
emm-dee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 09:33 PM   #19
Georgia Frog Rally 2018
 
aceinspp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: GA
Posts: 10,666
Don't care what truck you have as long as the newer type with the available brake controller installed they can't be beat they are great. Later RJD
__________________
2015 35 FT V-Lite 30WRLIKS Diamond Package
2015 Chevy 2500 6.0 4:10 gearing.
Days camped in 2016 58
Days camped so far 2017 62
aceinspp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2016, 07:04 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Homebrew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 498
The built in controller is great, I'm able to program each of my trailers in the control and select the trailer we are using without reprogramming the weight from light to heavy.
Also having the dash display makes it easy to see your adjustments.



Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums
__________________

__________________
XLR Thunderbolt 300X12HP
2014 Ram 3500 DRW
Homebrew is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
brake control, controller, trailer, brakes

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




ForestRiverForums.com is not in any way associated with Forest River, Inc. or its associated RV manufacturing divisions.


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:16 AM.