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05-10-2015, 10:52 AM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 25
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Noisy NEW Diff Gears 4.56
Any gear experts out there?
Got new 4.56 gears Early Late July. Picked it up after they were closed. immediately noticed the howl @45 is called the next day I was told it was normal i just need to drive it and break it in.
100 miles go buy I had to drop it off. They looked at the pattern etc and said you just need to drive it. "sometimes they are just noisy..." they put new oil in and said com back after 1k for fluid dump. They did say they will stand by it however I called to make an appt and mentioned fluid dump and talk about the noise issue...never got a call back.
Dumped my oil on my own, took some pics before I cleaned them up take a look. I have more pics too.
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05-10-2015, 11:14 AM
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#2
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Left Coast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: vancouver,washington
Posts: 15,649
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Wrong pattern... pinion needs to go deeper in ( toward back of truck) which will change the the side shims.....how much backlash is there now? What brand of gears?
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05-10-2015, 11:24 AM
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#3
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Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 25
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I'm not sure where the backlash is set. The shop set them up..
I'm wondering what would cause them to say they are set correctly, and have pics to back it up, (I have not seen them)and to have them turn out like this.
I have not spoken to them since the second visit and missed return call. Mostly because I feel like my concerns are falling on def ears.
Shop purchased all parts invoice says Yukon gears.
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05-10-2015, 11:24 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 442
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Looks like a bad set up on the gears.
__________________
haven a blast
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05-10-2015, 11:39 AM
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#5
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Mod free 5er
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 24,702
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob caldwell
Wrong pattern... pinion needs to go deeper in ( toward back of truck) which will change the the side shims.....how much backlash is there now? What brand of gears?
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Agree, need to clean and blue the teeth rotate to check pattern, but it looks like they need to add a shim in front of the pinion.
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05-10-2015, 11:46 AM
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#6
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Left Coast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: vancouver,washington
Posts: 15,649
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeeguy57
I'm not sure where the backlash is set. The shop set them up..
I'm wondering what would cause them to say they are set correctly, and have pics to back it up, (I have not seen them)and to have them turn out like this.
I have not spoken to them since the second visit and missed return call. Mostly because I feel like my concerns are falling on def ears.
Shop purchased all parts invoice says Yukon gears.
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Backlash is ...without moving the pinion, take hold of ring gear and move back and forth. Should be around , by feel, under .010 of an inch... on the ring gear, on the od, the part of the gear that the teeth end at, there should be a ecteched number and on the back face of pinion there is a pinion depth marking....unless whom ever set these up has had alot of experience doing it without proper gauges ( dial calipers, and pinion depth tools) it's going to be a crap shoot to do a proper job. I can see by these pics it's wrong..... noise more noticeable under power or coasting down ? HAVE ALSO HAD GEAR SETS THAT WOULD NOT SET UP , mostly off brand names...
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05-10-2015, 11:55 AM
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#7
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Left Coast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: vancouver,washington
Posts: 15,649
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Back before it was outlawed, I was able to get a large can of white lead which is perfect for pattern checking.... now, there isn't as much to choose from ... although in a pinch, toothpaste will work! Purshun (spell) blueing is to hard for old eyes to see these days.
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05-10-2015, 12:20 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 140
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I agree with bob, the pinion depth is totally wrong. It looks like a Dana axle. When they changed the gear set , they have to adjust the pinion depth. The new pinion will have a engraving of +/- with a number. Compare to the old gear set. Plus bearing pre load and a new pinion nut is critical. The back lash and side bearing preload should be 50 inch pounds rotational load, with 5-9 thousands of inch. Gear pattern should be checked with a marking compound. With axles and parking brake set, and with engine turn ring gear. Both directions, read pattern. Should be in the middle of gear and center of tooth. Good luck
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05-10-2015, 12:43 PM
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#9
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Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 25
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Noise is mostly @ 35 and 50-60 @ cruise, nice howl. Some noise very slight on decel form 40 on down..
I do not have the tools to do this, I'm very sure the shop does. I really need to show up and talk this over with the shop. But wanted to take a look for myself and get some opinions needed to change the oil anyway.
This is a Chrysler 9.25 rear end, If the sop changes the setup will it wear in good and quiet them down or does it need to be a new set..
FYI - They were put in at the end of Jan.. not July They have about 2K miles on them now. When i filled it up I used dyno oil Lucas 80w-90, quieted down a slight bit.
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05-10-2015, 01:08 PM
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#10
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Mod free 5er
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 24,702
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Doubt very much if they need replacement, they should, if set properly, quiet down immediately.
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05-10-2015, 01:09 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Southern Delaware
Posts: 201
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Backlash for your 9.25 diff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeeguy57
Any gear experts out there?
Got new 4.56 gears Early Late July. Picked it up after they were closed. immediately noticed the howl @45 is called the next day I was told it was normal i just need to drive it and break it in.
100 miles go buy I had to drop it off. They looked at the pattern etc and said you just need to drive it. "sometimes they are just noisy..." they put new oil in and said com back after 1k for fluid dump. They did say they will stand by it however I called to make an appt and mentioned fluid dump and talk about the noise issue...never got a call back.
Dumped my oil on my own, took some pics before I cleaned them up take a look. I have more pics too.
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. Corporate 9.25" Rear Axle Used on 1500 and 2500LD Axle Type Semi-floating, hypoid Lubricant API GL 5, SAE 75W-90 Lube Capacity 4.9 pints ( 2.32 L ) Axle Ratio Options 3.21, 3.55, 3.92 Carrier Split
none Differential Case Clearance Case Flange Runout Bearing Preload ... 0.005 in. ( 0.12 mm ) 0.003 in. ( 0.076 mm ) 75 ft. lbs. ( 102 N.m ) Ring Gear Diameter Backlash Runout ... 9.25 in. ( 23.50 cm ) 0.005- 0.008 in. ( 0.12- 0.20 mm ) 0.005 in. ( 0.127 mm) Pinion Bearing Preload Original New 10-20 in. lbs. ( 1-2 N*m) 15-35 in. lbs ( 2-5 N*m)
Hope this helps. A 'Dial Indicator' is the best way to achieve a true measurement. Best to set it at 0.005 to allow for future wear
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05-10-2015, 02:11 PM
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#12
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Left Coast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: vancouver,washington
Posts: 15,649
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After market gear sets will have their own set-up markings, and the shop that did the swap probably no longer has original gear set for the markings that were on those. Doesn't look like the hard facing is bad yet, so it might be possible to reset. If you need a different set, go with Richmond brand..... stay away from US Gears (brand name). If the axle housing has a round hole on each side ( the cast part that the side brgs.sit in) just outside where the cover bolts on, a spreader (special tool) should have been used to slightly relieve side brg. pre-load. Other wise, one has to tap (force) the brg. races in. Then , if the backlash is off, need to pull back out, and if there are shims behind brgs. they also need to be added to or subtracted from. the original total thickness should be stayed with, although they can be moved from side to side in any amount to keep pre-load good. IF the ring gear carrier gets changed, then it's a hole new ball-game. Not hard to do, just time consuming and if tech is on commission, look for an hourly guy.
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05-10-2015, 02:51 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 140
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Agree with oldcoot, you need to make the proper adjustments as soon as possible though. The longer you drive it, the more the wear. Sounds like both the pinion depth for the howl noise on acceleration side of ring gear, backlash on the coast side of the ring gear. Check out the bearing preload of the pinion. It should be about 10 to 15 inch pounds of preload. New bearing about 20 to 25 inch pounds. If pinion is loose it will cause both of these concerns.
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05-10-2015, 03:28 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 442
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i would put a new set in. it looks like the crown gear is starting to get flashing already.
__________________
haven a blast
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05-10-2015, 04:22 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 806
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Is it me or is the first pic. showing a chipped tooth? None the less, set up was wrong, any noise issue at first drive will never get better after it is driven.
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2006 2500HD CCSB 2WD 2014 Crusader 285RET
Nights camped in 2013 - not enough!, 2014 37, 2015 40, 2016 39, 2017 38, 2018 36, 2019 37, 2020 26, 2021 28
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05-10-2015, 04:28 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Western Connecticut
Posts: 1,587
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Corporate 9.25 with 4.56'ers....sounds like a lifted Jeep?
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2010 Cedar Creek 5th Wheel 34SATS "The Beast"
2006 Ford F350 Lariat 6.0L Diesel
2003 Harley Heritage Softail "Hogzilla"
1986 Marriage to "Wifey" (patience of a saint)
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05-10-2015, 05:00 PM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,916
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If you aren't capable... Find a 4x4 shop. They do it all the time and usually at a discount. I used to have a GM mechanic that did it on the side. I was scared to death of crush sleeve diffs... The last one I did was a Dana 61 and hopefully the last. You need a inch lb torque wrench and a caliper/mic and instructions.
Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums
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2017 Puma 297RLSS
2005 Ram 2500 4X4 diesel SMOKER!!
I love puns, irony and tasteless jokes...
born in Texas.... live in Arkansas
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05-10-2015, 05:35 PM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,183
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Takes the right tools and lots of experience to set one up right. I had one done several years ago, tech said it would take about a day. Well he had my truck three days, said he had to order different shims. When I got the truck back not a sound out of the diff, he did a great job. I was charged almost twice the amount for labor but it ran so good that was soon forgotten.
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Joe & Beverly
2014 Ram 2500 CTD, CC, SB
2014 8289WS lifted
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05-10-2015, 05:49 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 442
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I've done hundreds of diffs. And mostly all by feel. But every now and then you get a set of gears that no matter how much time you spend. You just can't get a good pattern on.
If the tech was lazy and didn't want to pull the pinions and press the bearing to put put a thicker shim. Then i would be asking for another tech to work on it when if and when they cover under warranty.
Now hear is another question. Was it noisy when you first picked it up.
And if so why would you drive it for thus long without demanding them fix is properly.
__________________
haven a blast
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05-10-2015, 06:35 PM
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#20
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Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toslow
I've done hundreds of diffs. And mostly all by feel. But every now and then you get a set of gears that no matter how much time you spend. You just can't get a good pattern on.
If the tech was lazy and didn't want to pull the pinions and press the bearing to put put a thicker shim. Then i would be asking for another tech to work on it when if and when they cover under warranty.
Now hear is another question. Was it noisy when you first picked it up.
And if so why would you drive it for thus long without demanding them fix is properly.
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Yes!! It was noisy when I first picked it up. I called the next day(first post). You can demand some one do something all you want doesn't mean they will do it..I kept getting the line that it was set up right and high gear ratios are just noisy sometimes. "just turn the radio up" lol.
This is why I posted get some opinions, now i will go to another shop and ask them..Then I will go back loaded with some ammunition to make my case that they replace the gears or at the very least change the setup. They will either do it.. or they wont. We will see. Honestly I hope they fix it. But given how they play dumb and make you feel like you have no idea what you are talking about..I will never have them work on anything else.
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