OMG I'm hauling a rocket launcher

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:01 AM

2011 Ecoboost with Reese dual cam sway control.
Hauling 2012, Salem 27RKSS

I was hauling pretty much level before I installed the firestone air shock system but now I am towing what looks like a scud missile platform.

Worried about the back 2 stabilizer jacks getting pinched on the road.
Truck with 10 lbs air in the Air bags sits as follows.

Front end = 36 3/4 inches from ground to top of wheel well opening
Rear end = 40 inches from ground to top of wheel well opening

The trailer set up level on pavement is approximately 22 inches from where the pavement is to the top of the coupler inside where the ball would sit inside.

I can't lower the ball any more and if I invert the bar it takes it higher.

Any suggestions?

E-trailer site states that the truck should be within an inch difference between front and back at the wheel wells.

**Herk7769** · 09-21-2012, 07:09 AM

Are you sure the mounts on the trailer are the correct orientation for your coupler type?

If the trailers coupler is on the bottom of the frame, the brackets are installed differently on the Equi-li-zer hitch. Perhaps it is the same for the Reese.

You could also have too much torque on the chain/bar.

A photo of the connected trailer combination might help.

**Herk7769** · 09-21-2012, 07:15 AM

I just realized you had the problem when the airbags were installed.
(Just got up - coffee soaking in sorry).

Why did you choose 10 PSI of air?
Is that the minimum inflation?
The bags should not lift the truck at all when there is no load.

You may have to redo your hitch's geometry for the new truck suspension mod.

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:17 AM

This was it before the air system installed.
The front end was actually higher than the back.

**Herk7769** · 09-21-2012, 07:22 AM

Looks like the trailer was riding too high before you put the bags in the truck.
Your truck also looks like it is riding low (like it is a tad overloaded or the hitch was not correct).

Even without the airbags you needed to lower the coupler by lowering the ball; with the airbags the adjustment of the ball upwards will most likely be more.

TURBS · 09-21-2012, 07:24 AM

I'm not sure but something isn't right.
I have to add 15 lbs unloaded for the bags to even move the truck.

Does your truck sit normal unloaded ?

Pics ?

Campster · 09-21-2012, 07:29 AM

The rear of the truck is lower then the front, but the trailer seems to be higher in the front them the rear? Was that a level parking lot or was there some slop to it? The trailer as a whole seems to have a pretty high ground clearance. By looking at this picture if air shocks were added and "aired up" I could see why the nose of the trailer would be pointing up. Seems like your receiver ball needs to be lowered..

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:29 AM

I was hauling at 40 lbs to take out the "6 months in a leaky boat" syndrome.
Min. is 5 lbs
Droppig from 40 to 10 settled the rear end height down some but not much.
Even unloaded the truck always sat higher in the back without the air bags installed.
Any suggestions for links to a good video inatall with air bag support?

MtnGuy · 09-21-2012, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

2011 Ecoboost with Reese dual cam sway control.
Hauling 2012, Salem 27RKSS

I was hauling pretty much level before I installed the firestone air shock system but now I am towing what looks like a scud missile platform.

If the truck and trailer were level and handling well, why install an air shock system ??

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

Worried about the back 2 stabilizer jacks getting pinched on the road.
Truck with 10 lbs air in the Air bags sits as follows.

I am not familiar with air shocks, but can you run less pressure ??

By putting pressure in those puppies, you now have significant more stress on the shock mounts instead of the springs. Shock mounts are fabricated to take the normal up and down stresses of the shocks, but I wonder about long term problems with carrying the weight of the truck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

Front end = 36 3/4 inches from ground to top of wheel well opening
Rear end = 40 inches from ground to top of wheel well opening

The trailer set up level on pavement is approximately 22 inches from where the pavement is to the top of the coupler inside where the ball would sit inside.

I can't lower the ball any more and if I invert the bar it takes it higher.

Any suggestions?

E-trailer site states that the truck should be within an inch difference between front and back at the wheel wells.

All wheel wells are not equal front to back. It depends on the vehicle, and whatever the designers deemed the best look. The frame of your truck riding level might not result in the top of the fender wells being the same measurement to the ground. But I don't want to crawl under my truck doing setup measurements, as probably most people don't want to, so the WDH manufacturers use the fenders as references.

My suggestion would be to run the least amount of air pressure in the shocks that the manufacture recommends, and get your truck axles and trailer axles weighed with both the spring bars in place and then removed and then the truck alone......all with no changes in passenger or cargo placement. Ideally, the trailer should be camper ready, with normal passenger and cargo load in the truck. Bring your results back here and let's see what you got.

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:36 AM

the pic of the receiver and ball was taken last night after I flipped the bar. I figured that the ball would need to be dropped and the only way to do that was to flip the bar and reinstall the ball at a lower point.
That way, once the weight of the trailer is applied the truck rear end drops.
Weight displacement chains are applied at the point where the tougue weight is on the ball but not totally supported by the truck reciever alone - correct?
Then I can drop all the weight of the trailer onto the truck and adjust the air system to level the front of the TV to the rear - Correct?

MtnGuy · 09-21-2012, 07:40 AM

Wow, a lot went on with this thread while I composing my last post.

Looking at the photo of the truck and trailer, you probably need to tilt the head assembly back at least 1 more notch if you want to use the same chain setup. And that would be after you get another hitch shank with more drop. You are gonna have to get your head assembly lower.

Check out the options here: etrailer.com - Products reese shank

MtnGuy · 09-21-2012, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

the pic of the receiver and ball was taken last night after I flipped the bar. I figured that the ball would need to be dropped and the only way to do that was to flip the bar and reinstall the ball at a lower point.
That way, once the weight of the trailer is applied the truck rear end drops.
Weight displacement chains are applied at the point where the tougue weight is on the ball but not totally supported by the truck reciever alone - correct?
Then I can drop all the weight of the trailer onto the truck and adjust the air system to level the front of the TV to the rear - Correct?

I was lead to believe that the picture of the hitch was the setup used with the truck and trailer picture. Now I understand that that is not the case ??

If the setup of the pictured hitch was used for the picture of the truck and trailer, then a new shank with more drop will be needed, plus the head assembly tilted back more. If the picture setup is a new setup, then you need to try it out to see if the trailer rides level, and truck ride level....with minimum pressure in the air shocks.

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtnguy

I was lead to believe that the picture of the hitch was the setup used with the truck and trailer picture. Now I understand that that is not the case ??

My truck and trailer in the lot pic was taken without air bags with the shank pointing upwards.
Since I figured I needed to lower the ball substantially lower I have to reverse the direction last night on the shank.
Saturday I have to haul it out onto the Subdivision road and find a flat piece of pavement

and play with the adjustments.
I can't go lower with the shank and the ball attachments.

the one I'm using is
Trunnion-bar system:

Distance from center of ball hole to hitch pin hole: 14"
Rise: 6-1/2" from top of hitch receiver tube opening
Drop: 1-1/4" from top of hitch receiver tube opening

Road-King · 09-21-2012, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

This was it before the air system installed.
The front end was actually higher than the back.

I think you will need a new shank with a longer drop. I don't have air shocks, but when I got my new TT, I used my old WDH from my old 1/2 ton pick-up. My current truck is a 4X4 dully. The drop on the shank I had was about 3" too short.

If you install a new shank, you have to go through the whole process of setting up you WDH, again....

etrailer.com - Products shank

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 07:51 AM

I may need to go with the Reese Accessories and Parts - RP63971 shank

MtnGuy · 09-21-2012, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilCop4523

My truck and trailer in the lot pic was taken without air bags with the shank pointing upwards.
Since I figured I needed to lower the ball substantially lower I have to reverse the direction last night on the shank.
Saturday I have to haul it out onto the Subdivision road and find a flat piece of pavement

and play with the adjustments.
I can't go lower with the shank and the ball attachments.

the one I'm using is
Trunnion-bar system:

Distance from center of ball hole to hitch pin hole: 14"
Rise: 6-1/2" from top of hitch receiver tube opening
Drop: 1-1/4" from top of hitch receiver tube opening

Flipping the hitch shank should give you enough drop so that the trailer now will ride level. If you kept the same head assembly tilt, that may actually increase the spring bar pressure, which by the look of your truck attitude, that will be a good thing. Regardless, a trip to the scales is always good.

lbrjet · 09-21-2012, 08:02 AM

Why the airbags? A pickup is designed to run lower in the rear with a load in the bed.

MilCop4523 · 09-21-2012, 08:22 AM

Air bags were to take the "we're on a ship" pitch and roll out of hauling.
Without them it was an aircraft taking off in the front end. Trailer is well below the tow weight of the vehicle.
Just with the set up being advanced with the air its lifted the center.
Looking for the correct sequence to follow based on others experience in adjusting the height of the shank then the ball then the air bags.

With 10 lbs in the air system, the shank dropped and the ball on the lowest settings I am at 25 inches ball height (if memory serves correct from last nigh.)
The trailer sitting level is 22 to where the ball connects and locks.
A 3 inch difference at the back bumper. Add the TT weight to the tongue and that will drop. Add the WD chains and the rear end will rise again pointing the trailer hopefully level Correct???
that should also take the front of the truck from an upward position which is what we had before in the picture submitted to a more level stance.
Air used to final adjust ride for bounce effect on our great level roads.

So if I took all my air out of the bags (they were bump stops prior) that should set the truck back to factory measurements on level pavement.
TT receiver is 22 inches at level supported on tongue jack. Should that remain similar once loaded onto the truck with WD chains added?

MtnGuy · 09-21-2012, 08:33 AM

The ball should be about 1" on the unhitched truck above the trailer tongue height. If you are now at 25" with the lowest bolt holes used, you may have to get 1 of the extended drop shanks. Don't go too overboard....you don't want that puppy dragging the ground. Before buying another hitch shank, see how the current setup does.

I think a properly setup WDH would have gotten your truck level without the air shocks/bars. IMHO, the hitch head was not tilted back enough for the chain lengths used in your photos.

The 1st post indicated air shocks, and now the referral is to air bags ?? Which is it ?? Air shocks may require some pressure, but I think air bags can be run at no pressure ?? That is the way to set up your truck if you can.

What weight spring bars are you using ?? With a listed dry tongue weight of 720 lbs., you should probably be using 1200 lb bars.

Road-King · 09-21-2012, 08:44 AM

Found this on-line when I was setting my WDH up. Maybe it will help;

"Park the TT and truck on level ground... Level the TT (using the tongue jack) by measuring the frame front and back with reference to ground level... Measure from ground level to inside top of trailer ball coupler... Record this measurement...

Set unloaded ball height on truck hitch head about 1/2' to 1" higher than this measurement... The exact amount will depend on the stiffness of your truck suspension...

Measure all four truck wheel wells with trailer unhooked... Record this measurement...

Hook up trailer and snap up w/d bars so TT appears to be level... Measure truck wheel well distance again... If front of truck is same height as, or slightly higher than, the unhitched height, you're done (not likely on the first try!!)...
If front of truck is not at or close to the unhitched height, adjust w/d bars as necessary...
If the front is too high, you may have to increase w/d head tilt and/or decrease tensioned chain link count to achieve more w/d bar tension...
If the front is too low, you may have to decrease w/d head tilt and/or increase tensioned chain link count to achieve less w/d bar tension...

The amount of tension required will depend on TT tongue weight and on TV and TT dimensions...

Round style W/D bars should be parallel with trailer frame when these adjustments are complete... If W/D bars are not level with TT frame using a given number of chain links (5 minimum) or the trunnion bars are not slanted downward slightly, tilt w/d bars up or down with adjustment screw, washers, etc., (whatever method is employed on your hitch) and readjust as required, dropping or picking up chain links as needed for necessary tension while maintaining a level condition to the TT frame...

Check the truck's front end height again after these adjustments...

Most hitch manufacturers want to see at least 5 chain links between the snap up plates and w/d bars (under tension)... This is to avoid binding of the w/d bars in turns and when backing...

Once you have achieved the proper truck front end height, check TT for levelness again... If TT is not level, adjust ball height on hitch head as necessary to level TT... If you can't achieve perfectly level, opt for a bit nose down... This will increase TT rear end clearance on sloping driveways and add a bit more hitch weight as the TT center of gravity shifts forward a bit with the nose down...
All these adjustments will interact with one another to some degree so a few readjustments will most likely be required...

When you are done, the w/d bars should be level (except trunnion w/d bars), the TT should be level and the front of the truck should be close to or slightly above the unhitched height...

It's pretty tough to get everything EXACTLY perfect, but get the TT as close to level as you can and the front of the truck as close to the unhitched height as you can... My truck is almost equal squat, maybe a 1/4" lower in the back... Avoid the front end of the truck being lower than the unhitched height... This indicates too much weight is being transferred to the front axle and could cause handling problems and excessive front tire wear...
My TT is level within 1/4" front to rear, being a bit nose down... My w/d bars have an upward set to them, but the Pullrite hitch adjustment is a bit different than others as it's w/d bars do not flex like a normal w/d hitch... So that part is pretty normal for my Pullrite hitch...

The procedure sounds difficult but really is not... It can be a bit tedious trying to achieve a perfect condition, but is not difficult... You should be pretty near perfect after a few readjustments and you'll probably find your TT tows and handles much better...

I have seldom seen a hitch adjustment from a dealership that couldn't be improved on with a bit of fine adjustment...
Best Regards,
Les"

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