Suggestions to get weight off the rear axle

[saskrick]

I just got back on my first weekend with the trailer and I would like some opinions for my setup. I have a 2012 screw eco max tow 4x4. The trailer is a 2010 north trail 31bdss( I know its not a forest river, but I like this forum), and I bought a reese strait line dual cam hitch with 1200 lb bars and I also have a friction bar from the previous hitch.
I set up the hitch using wheel well heights, it looked good but the truck and camper were not loaded. With everyone in and loaded it felt heavy on the back, so I weighed it. Here is the problem I face. I have about 900 lbs of cargo(family) which goes in the truck. I am about 700 lbs too heavy on the back axle.
My question is what are good ways to redistribute the weight. I can tilt the head of the hitch to spread weight to the front wheels a bit more, but will 1200 lb bars be sufficient. I can also load the trailer more to the back to take weight off the hitch at the risk of making more sway. As a side note, I was surprised how much weight we packed in the camper (probably 1500lbs or so)
Here are my weights at the scale with seven people, five bikes, and trailer full.
Front-3526
Rear-8248-3526=4722
Gross total=15149
The truck alone with full fuel is just shy of 6000 lbs. An assumption here is it looks like the cab cargo would place the load fairly evenly across the two axles of the truck.
Please give me suggestions, but none that say should have got 3/4 ton. I tow between zero and three times a year and this is the truck I have. I know I can make this work with a little tinkering. Thanks

[OldCoot]

I think you got the idea of tilting the head just a little more and transferring a little more wt to the front axle of the truck. 1200# bars should be more than ample even tho' you didn't state the actual tongue wt.

[jjm901]

a couple of quick options that I can think of- without upgrading the truck:

1. increase weight distribution to spread the weight out more- not enough is going to the front axle.

2. move stuff stored in the bed into the camper if possible.

3. change packing of camper to place less weight in front of camper axle and more on top of the axle/behind the axle.

If you only tow 2-3 times a year is it possible to have two vehicles travel for the trip to help reduce passenger weight and maybe move the bikes to the second vehicle to save yourself the extra weight. From your numbers (8248) it appears you are over the GVWR of the truck by about 500-600 lbs or more depending on the specific set up you have.

[jjm901]

Another suggestion to reduce weight: you have 36 gal tank, although it would require more fill ups- tow with a max of the tank 1/2 full. A gallon of gas weighs ~6lbs.... so you could save yourself 100lbs by running half full. Also, if you are not already, consider running with all of your tanks on the camper empty, water is ~8.33 lbs a gallon.

[ChooChooMan74]

7 people?? If you have 7 people, at least one of them should not be in the truck. If you have 2 bench seats, the most seat belts you have is 6. If you have the center console, then you have 5.

[ependydad]

Agree with the other suggestions - tinker with the WDH hitch; move as much stuff out of the truck bed and into the (rear) of the camper (watch your weights so you don't end up tongue light and induce sway); and how do you fit 7 people comfortably for any distance?

[Dave_Monica]

Wish you had some more information on weights...front/rear axle weight of truck unhitched, front/rear axle weight of truck hitched up without W/D bars loaded. You need to determine the tongue weight of the camper...guessing that it's high and may be re-distributed and still have 12-13% tongue weight.

Dave

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by ChooChooMan74

7 people?? If you have 7 people, at least one of them should not be in the truck. If you have 2 bench seats, the most seat belts you have is 6. If you have the center console, then you have 5.

Understand and agree with your concern, but it's really not pertinent to his original question, it's his family and his situation and he has to deal with it the best he can.

[Dave_Monica]

To the OP...I found some specs for your camper. Dry tongue weight of 780, dry weight of 6740 and GVWR of 8600. Are these the correct specs?

Using your combined weight, there's 7171 lb on the camper's axles. If tongue weight is 13%, the total camper weight would be 8242 lb with a tongue weight of 1071 lb with the W/D bars in place.

You mentioned that the truck's empty weight is around 6000 lb...was that with full fuel, passengers and any gear?

Dave

[saskrick]

Here is the truck wt full of fuel with me alone (190 lbs in front seat) I know this kind of messes things up a bit. Some assumptions need to be made or else I would need the whole family around for a day at the scales ( I already had the "stare" if you know what I mean).
Front-3373
rear-2767
gross-6140
If i'm out let's assume f-3233 r-2717. I assumed 75% of my wt on the front wheels
The trailer dry is about 6750. I don't know the tongue wt. I tried it using a scale i have here but it showed around 675 but i really don't think that was correct, especially with the wts in my above post.
Another assumption- if the truck is say 5950 plus 900 lbs cargo equally over two axles that would make f-3683 r3167=6850
the scale wt hooked up has the truck at 8248 with the bars leaving 6901 on trailer wheels.
I just measured the wheel wells of the truck. This is the load i had in trailer but no one in vehicle.
Truck not hooked to tt
f-38.75 inches
r-37.75
truck hooked with no bars
f-39 3/8
r-36.25
truck hooked up with bars
f-37.5
r-36.5
so i definitely got wt going to the front. I'll try one notch on the head and report.

[Doering]

Just did a quick check on your trailer. Without going into exact numbers, you likely have a good 800-900 lbs on the tongue. You must stick with the 1200 WD bars. As the majority of your cargo weight is people, I would still get everything out of the truck bed and really go through your 1500lbs of trailer cargo. I'm sure you could eliminate at least 1-2 if not 300 lbs of stuff. Go through the stuff with your wife and kids and tweak the hitch adjustments and re-evaluate the weights. Not a good idea to dump stuff in the rear of the trailer unless you really know how you are affecting the tongue weight. Reducing the rear axle weight by 700lbs is going to be tough unless you really take less in the trailer. You may not reach a 700 lb reduction, but I think you can put a good dent in it by being a little more moderate with your trailer cargo.

[jjm901]

another quick weight reducer is looking at your propane needs. Each 30lb propane tank is actually ~54lbs full.... if you don't need 60lbs of propane, consider removing one of the tanks. based on your measurements, it appears you have a lot more weight that can be distributed to the front yet. if you are going to wheel well height they really should be as close to unhooked height as you can get without being less once the weight is distributed.

[Dave_Monica]

I don't know where I got the camper axle weight at 7171...bad math...6901 lbs is correct. If your assumption on the weight of the loaded truck at 6850, that means that the camper tongue weight with the W/D bar snapped up is 1398 lb. I'm thinking that your weight estimate for the truck is low.

By the measurements you provided, you're already transferring a lot of weight to the front of the truck. I'm more of the opinion that you need to reduce weight, not transfer it. Having both the front and rear axle over the limits won't be a better solution.

Dave

[jjm901]

By the measurements you provided, you're already transferring a lot of weight to the front of the truck. I'm more of the opinion that you need to reduce weight, not transfer it.

I agree, but both axles of the truck should be rated for somewhere around 4,000lbs-meaning he could move a couple hundred pounds off the rear axle and onto the axle of the camper and front axle of the truck through more weight distribution- while at the same time trying to reduce what he is packing and strategically cutting weight where possible while minimizing inconvienence.

[ChooChooMan74]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

Understand and agree with your concern, but it's really not pertinent to his original question, it's his family and his situation and he has to deal with it the best he can.

Yes, 3 people in a second vehicle at 150lb/person would result in 450 lbs lost on the whole vehicle. Plus the 2nd vehicle could carry at least half the bikes and maybe a few other items from the truck.

7 people in a truck designed with 5 or 6 seatbelts to me is a major issue.

[saskrick]

I just tilted the head one notch and adjusted the cams. f-37 r37. So i gained a half inch up in the rear and half inch down on the front. The bars are tight. I'm on the fifth link.
I measured the seats in relation to the wheels- centre of back seat to centre rear wheel is 46" and centre front seat to centre front wheel is 57". So my assumption of equal distribution of cab load to the wheels was wrong. There is an engineering formula I had from college to figure this, but I'm not ambitious enough at the moment. The other thing I can do is move my passengers around. At the scales yesterday, I had 400 lbs of people in the front and 480 in the back. I could make that 500 front and 380 in the back. So 100lbs more in the front and 100 less in the back. Wow, my family is going to be angry. I'll have to start a new thread on bribery options.

[saskrick]

The other idea I have is to shorten how much the shank sticks out. My old hitch had the ball much closer to the bumper. This would make a big difference. I asked reese about this when I bought the hitch. They said some people drill a new hole to do this. The reason for it sticking out far is to turn real sharp. I'm a little leary to do this. Drilling cast is not the easiest and to keep the hole centered might be a problem. I'll cross that bridge if needed.

[Dave_Monica]

I don't s'pose that you're close to a CAT scales to weigh the set-up with that adjustment are you?

Dave

[MtnGuy]

Originally Posted by saskrick

The other idea I have is to shorten how much the shank sticks out. My old hitch had the ball much closer to the bumper. This would make a big difference. I asked reese about this when I bought the hitch. They said some people drill a new hole to do this. The reason for it sticking out far is to turn real sharp. I'm a little leary to do this. Drilling cast is not the easiest and to keep the hole centered might be a problem. I'll cross that bridge if needed.

Did Reese suggest drilling the shank, or the receiver ?? They are very careful about instructing anybody to modify any of their equipment. It should be easier to drill the receiver than to drill the cast shank.

My truck came with 2 holes in the receiver, so along with the 2 different holes on the shank, I had a total of 4 positions that I could place the shank. I no longer have all of those options, after I had to replace the receiver (due to a rear-end accident) with a 1 hole receiver.

Moving the total assembly forward should help some, but probably not enough to get you within limits. Plus, you may not be able to lower your tailgate.....mine hits the tongue jack if the assembly is too far forward.

[avolnek]

I would highly recommend air bags or timbrens for the rear end... That much trailer with that light of a truck is going appreciate the stability. The stress you put on the torsion bars to level out the truck and trailer is put into the frame of the TV and trailer... Putting that much force can't possibly be good for it!

Adding air bags or timbren springs would increase your rear end spring rate and any time you adjust increase spring rate you will up the control of sway for the vehicle.

Plus, if you were to add air bags leveling the truck is a breeze.

Highly recommended from me!