Tire wear one tire

[jleon01]

I have greywolf 29bh tt with newly installed rear and front axles . The front driver side tire is wearing in the inside but only at one spot. Tire has been balanced and this is the second tire at this position that has happened. Any suggestions? Any hints?

[donn]

bent axle, overloaded on one side, not towng level.

[jleon01]

But all the other 3 tires are fine

[donn]

regardless, it is likely one of the three

[jimh]

take a close look under the trailer at the arch in the axles. if the one wearing the tire is bowed down, that will cause inside wear.
my 5th wheel wears on the outside on the passenger side. recently, i looked at the axles while connected to the truck. the front axle is bowed up and rear axle is straight. the front axle on mine isn't taking enough load. i'm going to try and lower the hitch a little and see if it redistributes.
it sounds like the one (on urs) with the wear is carrying too much load.
general info: the axles are arched with the bow up. that bow will be reduced as the weight of the trailer is put on them.
axles can be re-arched by a spring shop. new axles shouldn't need this.
by the way, it took me only 5 yrs to figure this out on mine. i had the alignment checked 3 yrs after i bought (by the dealer) and it was declared inline.
after adjusting the hitch, i should know if it works after a year or two.

[crocus]

Do you have springs, or are they torsion axles?

[jleon01]

It is spring. Dexter 3500 lbs axles. Anyone know who can look and fix axles near west yellowstone?

[Bill_C]

Originally Posted by jleon01

I have greywolf 29bh tt with newly installed rear and front axles . The front driver side tire is wearing in the inside but only at one spot. Tire has been balanced and this is the second tire at this position that has happened. Any suggestions? Any hints?

If the tire is wearing only in one spot and not all around, then it is called 'cupping', and is caused by an out of balance tire. Not a camber or axle problem. Since this is the second balance you may have an out of balance brake drum. Some tire stores have the ability to spin the tire on the trailer which will show up the unbalance condition. Don't attempt to balance again with wheel weights. You need to replace the drum.

[jimh]

on my vehicle, cupping was due to running under inflated tires. but they were the front tires (steering tires on my truck).
the trailer, i wear all the way around (but only on the outside the other three wear normal). the weight distribution is what i suspect on mine.

before u get too far along, try putting a different tire in that spot and check the inflation and see if it shows the same wear; it may be something as simple as the cord broken in that tire. sometimes, if it is the tire itself, you can run ur hand along the tread (around the tire tread) and feel a knot.

[flyrotor]

Originally Posted by Bill_C

If the tire is wearing only in one spot and not all around, then it is called 'cupping', and is caused by an out of balance tire. Not a camber or axle problem. Since this is the second balance you may have an out of balance brake drum. Some tire stores have the ability to spin the tire on the trailer which will show up the unbalance condition. Don't attempt to balance again with wheel weights. You need to replace the drum.

To test this theory, with a marker mark one of the lug bolts and the rim where that lug passes through the hole, then remove the tire/rim and remount off setting the lug to see if the tire wear starts at a new spot consistent with the previous mount.

You could also rotate the tires to see if it is specific to that drum

[jleon01]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I did rotate the tires around. Put a good tire in that position and it wore it off. This was the second tire, but same brand. The wear seems to be worst in about 1/4 of the inside thread of the tire. The other 3/4 of the inside looks fine. I am going to take it where they installed the axles next week. Right now I am hoping to make it back home, 1000 miles, before having to wear any of the other tires to that position. It hasn't hit the wear indicator yet.

[jimh]

Originally Posted by jleon01

Thanks for all the suggestions. I did rotate the tires around. Put a good tire in that position and it wore it off. This was the second tire, but same brand. The wear seems to be worst in about 1/4 of the inside thread of the tire. The other 3/4 of the inside looks fine. I am going to take it where they installed the axles next week. Right now I am hoping to make it back home, 1000 miles, before having to wear any of the other tires to that position. It hasn't hit the wear indicator yet.

let us know what they find.

[Maxterra]

Sounds like bent axle or even crooked axle stub welded in the new axle. Definitely should not wear out that fast. I used to build quite a few trailers, and I've fixed few flatbeds with either a bent axle or axles out of parallel wearing out one tire. If the axle crown wasn't set perfectly at the top, both tires on that axle would be wearing.

Once fixed, they couldn't believe how much less effort was required to pull the trailer, and how much better it tracked.

[jleon01]

Thanks for all the suggestions. This is definetely a place to come for good advice. I made it home from Yellowstone to Oregon. Had to rotate the right side tires to the the left.

I took the trailer to a alignment shop and this is the information they provided me.

Front Axle Toe
L: Initial: -1/32" Final: 0"
R: Initial: +1/8" Final: +1/32"
Total: Initial: +3/32" Final: +1/32"

Front Axle Camber
L: Initial: 0deg Final: +1/4 deg
R: Initial: +1/8deg Final: +1/4deg
Side to Side: Initial -1/8deg Final: 0deg

Rear Axle Toe
L: Initial: +1/32" Final: 0"
R: Initial: +1/32" Final: 0"
Total: Initial: +1/16" Final 0"

Read Axle Camber
L: Initial: -1/2deg Final: -1/4deg
R: Initial: -7/8deg Final: -1/4deg
Side to Side: Initial: 0deg, Final: 0 deg

They also found out that the wheel bearing were loose. The tech basically could wiggle in and out the tire and could hear a snap. So they adjusted the bearings prior to the alignment.

Now the question for the more experts, with the above initial measurements could explain inside tire wear on the driver side front tire?
Numbers above don't mean much to me as I am not an expert.

Is the final numbers above look reasonable? Find hard to believe that newly installed axles would be misaliged out of the getgo, but then again, I did decide to take the trailer to a truck shop instead to the place where they installed the axles.

[Bill_C]

Originally Posted by jleon01

Front Axle Toe
L: Initial: -1/32" Final: 0"
R: Initial: +1/8" Final: +1/32"
Total: Initial: +3/32" Final: +1/32"

Front Axle Camber
L: Initial: 0deg Final: +1/4 deg
R: Initial: +1/8deg Final: +1/4deg
Side to Side: Initial -1/8deg Final: 0deg

Rear Axle Toe
L: Initial: +1/32" Final: 0"
R: Initial: +1/32" Final: 0"
Total: Initial: +1/16" Final 0"

Read Axle Camber
L: Initial: -1/2deg Final: -1/4deg
R: Initial: -7/8deg Final: -1/4deg
Side to Side: Initial: 0deg, Final: 0 deg

Camber is the tilting IN or OUT of the top of the tire from vertical. Tilting in is negative camber, tilting out is positive camber. Excessive camber, either way, will cause one side of the tire to wear, ALL around. Not just one spot. That is easy to understand as the tire is constantly applying more weight on a side rather that all across the tire tread.

Toe-In or toe-out, is the pointing in or out of the front of the tires. If a person is pigeon toed, they have excessive toe-in. Again, excessive toe-in or toe-out will also cause tire wear. This wear shows up as a scuffing across the tread of the tire. This wear shows up all around your tire, not just one spot.

Caster is the third level of steering geometry on vehicles and is responsible to keep the vehicle traveling in a straight direction. Not applicable to trailers. In either case, improper caster adjustment will not wear a tire.

What will cause a tire to wear in only one spot and not all around then? Centrifugal force is trying to throw your tire off the rim at 180 degrees to the tire rim (straight off). If the force is equal all around the rim, the tire is stretched equally all around the rim for 360 degrees. This provides a perfect (or close to) circle for the rim to rotate around resulting in a smooth ride. Unfortunately tires are not manufactured close to perfect so a tire may have a bit more rubber in one spot than another. This will make that one tire spot heavier resulting in more force at that point being thrown outward when it is spinning down the road on your trailer. Does it make sense then that the one heavy spot will hit the road harder? And it will hit with a thump. This will give you wear in only one spot on the tire. The point where the tire is heaviest. Get to speed and you have the thump happening so often it feels like a vibration-- leading to getting your tires balanced. Your tire tech will spin that tire, find where the heaviest point is and counter-balance the heavy spot with a wheel weight 180 degrees opposite the heavy point. At speed, the weight should equal the same force as the tire heavy point is exerting resulting in a balanced tire.

Now that the geometry is explained how do your numbers read? I don't know your alignment specs for your trailer, however, some positive toe-in (+) is usually required. When you travel down the road the toed in tires try to straighten out this takes up any slack in the bearings etc.. Camber is usually called for to be also positive (+). As weight is applied into the vehicle the axles bend down, pulling the top of the tire in, so they run in an almost zero degree camber. This puts the entire tread on the pavement, not just the edge.

There is never an exact number for steering geometry. The specs will give you a number with a plus or minus value. (eg: 1/4 degree, plus or minus, 1/8 degree) It is the skill of your technician to determine which way the 'preferred' number should go.