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Old 11-05-2019, 08:10 AM   #1
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To delete or not

I am fairly new to the diesel truck circuit and have a question about deleting my emissions and if anybody else is running that way. I have a 2012 F250 6.7 L and from the research I’ve done it seems it’s very beneficial to delete emissions and get rid of the filters in the tailpipe and use a straight tail pipe instead. Of course I understand this is only for off-road use. Just wondering if anybody else Is running their diesels this way and towing a trailer how it affects it, the good and the bad.
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Old 11-05-2019, 10:57 AM   #2
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I have 2 diesels. My 2002 Ford 7.3 is modified to the point that its probably near triple the stock HP. The other is a 2017 Ram that is stock as the day it came off the factory.

Having gone both ways, I will say that I will leave the Ram stock. My reasoning is the Ford is more like a thoroughbred horse now instead of a plow horse. Its touchy, and somewhat temperamental. It's sensitive to fuel quality, it makes more heat than I can really shed (needs a way bigger inter-cooler). It's a fun rocket ship of a ride when empty, but a bit PITA when hauling. Keeping one eye on the EGTs at all times, putting up with the noise (its amazing how a noise that's cool on a short trip can become a mind-dulling drone on long one), and making sure I keep a spare fuel filter, cam sensor, and Injection Pressure Regulator on hand at all times take the shine off it it. I usually arrive at a campground wrung out from the drive.

Whereas in the Ram. I just set the cruise control and let her gobble up the miles. No worries about EGT's at all. No drama. Just a relaxing drive.

I say all this to make a point... If stock is getting the job done, then just run it stock. Yes, there will be maintenance costs involved in the upkeep of the emissions systems. But that might be small potatoes compared to all the work I had to do replacing one of my injectors that failed coming home from Goshen because the hi-perf injector I bought are not that tolerant of the bad fuel I picked up in Indiana.

There will be others that have valid opinions the other way, but for me, I have learned my lesson.

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Old 11-05-2019, 11:25 AM   #3
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You (typically) delete for 2 reasons.
1. You want to free the emgine of Emissions related issues or
2. You want to improve power / performance, etc..

To be considered.
Do you live in an area that does yearly emissions testing a spart of your safety inspection, This should be considered.

You already outside of warranty repairs so that would have been my second consideration.

Also to be considered, you can delete, You can run on stock or low power tunes and really be fine. As was said above if you really want to turn up the power be prepared to pay to play.

For me Personally I do not plan to delete my Stock 18 3500 CTD.. UNLESS I start having emissions related issues. I did a lot of research before buying it and it seems that really they have them ironed out pretty good now, thats not to say an issue cant pop up. IF it pops up and Im under warranty, I will get it repaired. IF it pops up, and i'm outside of warrranty. I'm deleting.I would run stock or 30 HP tunes potentially and that would be it. They do not do emission testing on diesels in my area.
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Old 11-05-2019, 11:38 AM   #4
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^^^^ What they said. ^^^

It would void an extended warranty as well.
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Old 11-05-2019, 12:25 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by jjcooler65 View Post
. Of course I understand this is only for off-road use. .
I take it this is a caveat you intend to obey.
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Old 11-05-2019, 01:39 PM   #6
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I'm deleting mine in 4 years when the warranty is up if for no other reason than picking up 5-10% economy. More power and longer life are just side benefits.
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Old 11-05-2019, 01:44 PM   #7
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I'm deleting mine in 4 years when the warranty is up if for no other reason than picking up 5-10% economy. More power and longer life are just side benefits.
What model of truck and engine. Do a cost price relationship on the return on investments to see if you really benefit on the 5-10% fuel economy!

I know what my cost were in 2009 and what the payout is over 10 years. I still have not broke even on my cost in fuel savings.
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Old 11-05-2019, 01:45 PM   #8
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Just traded in my 2012 f250 that had been straight piped. It blew 2 turbochargers in a year. Was told that the power was to much for that stock turbo. Replacement cost for each one was 6 thousand. Now I have a 2019 f 350. It will remain stock as long as I own it.
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Old 11-05-2019, 01:56 PM   #9
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Also, it's against federal law to alter or remove emission control equipment on non off road vehicles. And you may have a hard time trading it in at a dealer one day. Remember they make you sign that little statement? Just sayin'.
I'm sure im going to get flamed for this. Fire retardant suit is on.
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Old 11-05-2019, 02:38 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Jim34RL View Post
What model of truck and engine. Do a cost price relationship on the return on investments to see if you really benefit on the 5-10% fuel economy!

I know what my cost were in 2009 and what the payout is over 10 years. I still have not broke even on my cost in fuel savings.
But, you could also count emissions parts related failures which pretty much pay for the delete. Of course if you delete before you have a failure you'll never know, but after the fact you'll know.
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Old 11-05-2019, 02:39 PM   #11
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Just traded in my 2012 f250 that had been straight piped. It blew 2 turbochargers in a year. Was told that the power was to much for that stock turbo. Replacement cost for each one was 6 thousand. Now I have a 2019 f 350. It will remain stock as long as I own it.
You can delete and choose to run stock or near stock power levels.
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Old 11-05-2019, 02:40 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Springerdad View Post
Also, it's against federal law to alter or remove emission control equipment on non off road vehicles. And you may have a hard time trading it in at a dealer one day. Remember they make you sign that little statement? Just sayin'.
I'm sure im going to get flamed for this. Fire retardant suit is on.
No Flaming its a very good point! Something folks would need to consider.
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Old 11-05-2019, 04:40 PM   #13
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Delete

Check out Powerstroke.com u-Tube. He has a lot of common sense advice. He has a post on when it makes sense to delete. Usually recommends not doing it. My thought is as long as the emissions are not causing you problems, I would not consider deleting. The 6.7 engine has not had the "learning gremlin problems" previous mothers did and the deletion is even more complex due to the engine control systems. I have a stock 19'-F350 that will remain stock. Even putting a lower restriction air filter can cause an error copy-excess air flow. And do not even think about putting an oiled filter in as it causes air meter failure. I had an air metering failure on mine and that was the first thing the Ford tech said and looked for to deny warranty.
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Old 11-05-2019, 04:45 PM   #14
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I never will.
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Old 11-05-2019, 05:05 PM   #15
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The last reputable outfit that will do a diesel emissions delete tune quit doing so in mid September. That was Kory at PPEI. No one except “Charlie’s Back Yard Tuning” will do a delete now. EPA hamstrung the reputable players in that game as part of their National Compliance Initiative 2020-2023. Word has it the EPA manage to get all the invoices of customers that had gotten delete tuning from PDI, Bully Dog, etc. Kory escaped that. What EPA will do with that is anyone’s guess. Likely not kick down doors, but it is foreseeable that they could leverage state DMV offices to refuse tag renewal until vehicle is shown to be in compliance. Plenty to read on this from all the major players.
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Old 11-05-2019, 05:27 PM   #16
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2015 Duramax dually here. 82,000 miles. Zero emissions problems. Not deleted in any way. More than enough power towing 16,000 pounds even through the mountains. I got 20.4 mpg last week on a trip at 75 mph running empty. I have no complaints. If it ain't broke don't fix it.
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Old 11-05-2019, 07:45 PM   #17
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Not this cowboy. Too many potential issues for me. I have a $65,000 truck that is 2 years old and it will remain stock until I quit driving it. I am 61 years old so with the 6.7 Diesel and aluminum body it will probably outlive me.
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Old 11-05-2019, 07:58 PM   #18
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I'm in the same boat but living in California I'm very reluctant to delete. I have many friends that are deleted and would love to see the mileage they are getting. With a $2,500 fine to the vehicle owner, and another $25,000 fine to the person that did the work I have been leaning towards an Emissions Compliant Tuner but having issues getting a supplier to ship the module to me. After many hours of research I believe I did find an inexpensive (and legal) way to increase my mileage slightly and will share after a few more test runs to confirm.
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Old 11-05-2019, 07:59 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by timm9 View Post
I'm in the same boat but living in California I'm very reluctant to delete. I have many friends that are deleted and would love to see the mileage they are getting. With a $2,500 fine to the vehicle owner, and another $25,000 fine to the person that did the work I have been leaning towards an Emissions Compliant Tuner but having issues getting a supplier to ship the module to me. After many hours of research I believe I did find an inexpensive (and legal) way to increase my mileage slightly and will share after a few more test runs to confirm.

I can point you to people who deleted and saw no change whatsoever in mileage, or power.
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Old 11-05-2019, 08:15 PM   #20
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I can point you to people who deleted and saw no change whatsoever in mileage, or power.
Yea well that statement there is a tad loaded. I mean you can delete and stay stock power tunes etc.. Or y ou can go wild child and turn it into a tranny destroying machine. Of course there are plenty of emissions intact tuning available as well. BUT, plenty of folks who saw some increase in Mileage and Power with their delete, but it all depends on the tune. My son deleted his 2013 f350 6.7 and saw a very noticeable increase in mileage, and with the tuner he chose, a few clicks and he was pulling seriously more power than stock. He totaled it in an accident and has kept is 2017 he bought new stock and untouched, so far. He is of the same mind set I am.. As long as it is working and in warranty, Im all for it.. But out of warranty and it starts misbehaving, its all gone.
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