Towing Questions and Limits

[Pooneil]

Originally Posted by MTA F-150

I'm looking at all the trailers out there and it's either the tongue weight is ridiculous and the weight is down or the tongue weight is low and the camper is high. I know it all depends on weight distribution but from everyone's comments it looks like you need a 2500 or 3500 to pull anything. Now people throw out life insurance policy's, really! You need to calm down! I did my calculations, I'm under everything I need to be. If the manufacturers put these ratings in black and white I'm sure that they did all their calculations right or they would be out business! Thanks for the input!

It looks to me like you've done your homework and are satisfied with the answer concerning your TV paired with your new camper. Happy camping. Let us know how it works out.

[BarryD0706]

Originally Posted by tanddc

You throw this out in every discussion regarding insurance issues but at not time does the "poster of unknown credentials" cite any case law or provide any proof.

Unknown credentials? Perhaps you don't believe the credentials he gave in post #13? He is an expert in the field and I certain don't expect him to post examples.

MTA, no one is talking about Life insurance. We're talking about auto liability insurance.

[dlzeller]

I tow my 2007 30' Wildwood with my new 2013 Ford F150 with the 5.0 and have problems what so ever. Towed the UP of Michigan for a 8 hour trip and no problems. Get about 10.4 miles a gallon and with the back up camera it's a real cool package. I also have weight distribution and sway bars. If you add those to your towing package I think you will be fine if not driving in extreme conditions. Also I am a licensed Insurance Agent and if you are towing your trailer, no matter what the vehicle you use, the insurance company is going to pay for the damage to your trailer should something happen. They do not ask what will be pulling the trailer when you add it to your insurance. And if something was to happen on the Liability side, they would defend you in court. Not being a lawyer I would think that if you did use a vehicle not rated for towing the type of trailer you do, then you may be negligent.

[Jjs2000z]

I am towing a 2014 stealth 2715 toy hauler trailer with a side by side inside. I am towing with a 2012 F150 4x4, Cree cab, short bed, 3.73's. I am using the equalizer hitch setup and I am averaging 11 mpg while towing in Southern California. I do not tow above 55 mph. I think that is the secret to safely towing such a heavy trailer.

[SCOC]

Originally Posted by ependydad

Often times, you'll be over on other ratings - namely GVWR and possibly either of your axle ratings. Finally, don't forget to be cognizant of the tire's maximum carrying capacity as they are the weakest link in all of this.

I agree. Although, I've found that the springs are the weakest link in the overall RAWR not the tires. At least this is the case in the few scenarios I've checked including my 2008 FX4 F150 truck stock.

Specs on the components (axle, springs, wheels, tires) for Ford trucks can be found here:
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas.../techspec.html

[rotorhead1250]

It’s not just pushing the weight limits, its pushing the life limits, of the truck. Got no proof, no experience and no articles to read. Just saying that if you are at or near the limits of your tow vehicle, you’re gone dramatically reduce the life of the drive train. Just sayin.

[bikendan]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

When we toured the Flagstaff factory in Goshen in Aug, the very last thing done was weighting the trailer with all the factory options installed and the weight put on the stickers, so the weight on the sticker IS an actual weight. What the dealer adds on is of course not included such as filling the propane tanks and adding the battery(s). Awnings were installed at the factory and therefore were included in the posted weight.

you are right. what i was talking about were Shasta's website/brochure "dry" weights.
i should have clarified that and that the yellow sticker weight is the actual weight when it left the factory and would include the things you noted.

but the OP was using the website/brochure weight numbers which are never real world numbers.
i always recommend that buyers actually look at the yellow sticker weight and start from there.

[MTA F-150]

I had the dealership take a photo of the yellow sticker on the inside front door. It says 6500# not the 7050 that I originally specified.

[crunchman12001]

Originally Posted by MTA F-150

First timer, just wanted to get everyone's input on towing this TT (2014 Shasta Revere 30BH).

I know it all depends on weight distribution but from everyone's comments it looks like you need a 2500 or 3500 to pull anything. Now people throw out life insurance policy's, really! You need to calm down! I did my calculations, I'm under everything I need to be.

MTA F-150,
First off, welcome to the site.
Based on your above post, you are really wanting your 8 year old, 1/2 ton truck to work for you and I understand that. You fell in love with a camper that your truck might be able to pull but will be very hard to stop. You have spent some time crunching the numbers because you know your truck is too small for the trailer you would like to buy. I understand your frustration.
Yes, people did throw out life insurance policies because most of the trailer accidents (some fatal) are the results of too small of a tow vehicle.
You came to us for our "input"? We told you what you did not want to hear because you crunched the numbers and you are all good as long as you don't carry to much food, beer ect...
Most people here have been towing for decades and know what they are talking about but you being new to the site must make you an expert?
I wish you luck with your 8 year old 1/2 ton. You will have many dirty underpants moments with it, that I promise you. We suggest at least a 3/4 ton truck for the weights you would like to pull.
Do us a favor and post again to let us know we were right and you are upgrading your truck.
Be safe out there!
crunchman

[garbonz]

If the OP gets a good WD hitch AND sets it up properly, AND goes slowish, AND stays on good road, AND is lucky; He'll be fine.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by BarryD0706

Unknown credentials? Perhaps you don't believe the credentials he gave in post #13? He is an expert in the field and I certain don't expect him to post examples.

MTA, no one is talking about Life insurance. We're talking about auto liability insurance.

Barry, this article on Comparative Negligence might help explain the risks of overloaded driving. It seems it is treated similarly to DUI in that your insurance will cover your liability to the other party up to the limit of your coverage.

However, if the court, civil or criminal, finds you guilty of Negligence, Comparative or Contributory, and awards beyond your coverage, you will be given a check by your insurance company for your maximum liability and you will be on your own to come up with the balance.

Since most states (and most insured) carry only the minimum insurance required by their state (PA only requires $15,000 per person $30,000 per accident liability and $5,000 property damage), a civil lawsuit where the driver was found negligent could well exceed that (average closed head injury awards start at $500,000).

Comparative negligence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Additionally, depending on the egregiousness of the negligent overload, criminal charges can be levied. This will most certainly happen if there are injuries or fatalities caused by the operator of an overloaded vehicle.

Tort - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[JFM-jr]

MTA you have a pm

[tanddc]

Originally Posted by BarryD0706

Unknown credentials? Perhaps you don't believe the credentials he gave in post #13? He is an expert in the field and I certain don't expect him to post examples.

MTA, no one is talking about Life insurance. We're talking about auto liability insurance.

I am not going to assume anyone is who they say on the internet. For all you know I could be a french model. Bonjure

I do expect one to post examples.

[tanddc]

Originally Posted by crunchman12001

MTA F-150,
First off, welcome to the site.
Based on your above post, you are really wanting your 8 year old, 1/2 ton truck to work for you and I understand that. You fell in love with a camper that your truck might be able to pull but will be very hard to stop. You have spent some time crunching the numbers because you know your truck is too small for the trailer you would like to buy. I understand your frustration.
Yes, people did throw out life insurance policies because most of the trailer accidents (some fatal) are the results of too small of a tow vehicle.
You came to us for our "input"? We told you what you did not want to hear because you crunched the numbers and you are all good as long as you don't carry to much food, beer ect...
Most people here have been towing for decades and know what they are talking about but you being new to the site must make you an expert?
I wish you luck with your 8 year old 1/2 ton. You will have many dirty underpants moments with it, that I promise you. We suggest at least a 3/4 ton truck for the weights you would like to pull.
Do us a favor and post again to let us know we were right and you are upgrading your truck.
Be safe out there!
crunchman

Do you have proof that most towing accidents are caused by too small of a TV? That sounds contrived to me. You would have probably said the same thing about my combo and I have had no "dirty underpants moments" and it stops just fine (that's what trailer brakes are for) sounds to me like the OP made a logical decision based on facts. I think there are others here that are just don't like that. Its definitely emotion based and I just don't get it,

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by 5thwheel

I have an F-150. I was going to buy a TT about the same size as the one you're going to buy MTAF-150. He told me that I wouldn't like pulling it. He recommended that I change to a 5th wheel. I did and my F-150 pulls a Flagstaff 28' RKWS fine. The dealer did not make more money by getting me to change to the 5th wheel. I'm glad I did, I like the floor plan and space in the 5th wheel.

We also have the Flagstaff 8528RKWS and pull and stop just fine with an 8yo 2005 Silverado Ext. Cab 1500. We don't win drag races, but we run 55-65 mph depending on traffic and get along just fine. Just finished a trip from Concord, NC to Goshen, IN and down thru MO and the Ozarks and back to Concord on I40. 3 different mountain ranges and no problems. Wouldn't attempt the Rockies tho. Don't know what a 3/4T or 1T would do that my "little" 1/2T truck doesn't do.

Bottom line, if it wears my truck out prematurely, it doesn't cost anybody but me and you sure can bet it's cheaper to repair than buy new.

[Iwannacamp]

My opinion is not required. I only "sweat" the small stuff from experience. I have had way to many close calls while driving. Not very many while pulling a trailer, but it doesn't matter. I only say this because the better equipped you are then the better "equipped" you are to handle the extreme. I AM extremely nervous that I will be distracted and not foresee an emergency ahead. I try to watch, but I don't want to be pushed into a car, an intersection, over a bridge or anything else.
I guess I am a itty biddy fraidy cat!!!

Please be careful.

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by Iwannacamp

My opinion is not required. I only "sweat" the small stuff from experience. I have had way to many close calls while driving. Not very many while pulling a trailer, but it doesn't matter. I only say this because the better equipped you are then the better "equipped" you are to handle the extreme. I AM extremely nervous that I will be distracted and not foresee an emergency ahead. I try to watch, but I don't want to be pushed into a car, an intersection, over a bridge or anything else.
I guess I am a itty biddy fraidy cat!!!

Please be careful.

I share your feelings, altho' I'm not "a itty biddy fraidy cat", I do try to be constantly aware of the vehicle ahead, along side and behind me as well as a couple of vehicles ahead of the one in front of me. If I see brake lights on a vehicle 2,3 or 4 ahead of me, I start slowing and look for a safe escape route whether I'm towing or in the car. If on a 2 lane road I try to watch the oncoming traffic and the manner the oncoming driver is approaching as to weaving, etc. Just the way I was taught many years ago.

[Batts-toy]

Originally Posted by MTA F-150

Thank you everyone. I have trailed a lot with this truck from bobcats to smaller campers on the beach. I did my home work last night and crunched the numbers. One good thing is my axle ratio is 3.73 and for my wheel base 145" Ford clocks me in at a maximum trailer weight of 9300#. The base weight of the truck (5500#) plus added people (250) plus supplies (150#) plus tounge weight (710#added 100# with cargo) = 6610 GVW. The camper plus 1000# of cargo, which i calculated my cargo at less than that equals 7100#. 6610# plus 7100# is 13,710#. Max GCWR for this truck is 15,000#. I am not going accross country nor am i driving in the Rockies. I could totally understand big mountain driving and having an issue. My normal trips are Long Island and Upstate NY. Upstate is hilly not mountainous.

I am not going to weigh in on strong opinions with my comment, you have seen enough of that in this thread. The TV numbers you are quoting here tell me your TV is equipped with a full tow package this would be where the 9300 lbs comes from, there are many listings of weight capacities for the same vehicle depending on how it is equipped just be sure the specs you are using are actually representative of your TV's equipment. Secondly I am a firm believer in trailer brakes are for stopping the trailer, if your TV brakes have to work at or your find yourself pressing hard on the TV brake pedal I am figuring your brake controller needs adjusting (I assume you have a brake controller in the TV if not you better get one). Make sure your trailer brakes are stopping the trailer and this will remove a lot of the potential white knuckle moments. What ever your decision take it slow don't let the traffic rush you they can go around. Be careful, be safe.

[kandl]

Originally Posted by MTA F-150

Should i get the weight distribution bars and stabilizer bars from the dealer?

MTA,

WD is an absolute must for your setup and I suspect you've already engaged in that regard. My opinion and based on your number crunching, you'll be fine. I'll caveat that in that you have to be comfy pulling that much TT with an F150. We're in somewhat the same boat. Our Rockwood is comparable to the Revere and not only are we close to the TVs limit, we're nudged right up against it. Notwithstanding, we've tugged the Rockwood 18K km over the past two plus years with the half-ton and that's included six passes through the Rockies to and from the west coast! No white-knuckle issues either. Quite comfortable pulling the TT with the Dodge and there's been no appreciable wear that I would attribute to towing. I know there is - it's just not evident.

Happy trails...

[crunchman12001]

Originally Posted by tanddc

Do you have proof that most towing accidents are caused by too small of a TV? That sounds contrived to me. You would have probably said the same thing about my combo and I have had no "dirty underpants moments" and it stops just fine (that's what trailer brakes are for) sounds to me like the OP made a logical decision based on facts. I think there are others here that are just don't like that. Its definitely emotion based and I just don't get it,

You are correct, I do not have a single document to prove my statement to be true nor would I expect you or the OP to be convinced if I did locate the source. It was my opinion based on my observations and experiences.
The OP asked for input from the board and I gave mine.
Some people feel safe pushing the limits while towing. I on the other hand feel it is safer to have more tow vehicle than required to do the job safely and to make my towing experience more pleasurable and less stressful.
Good luck to you and the OP.