TT tongue is overweight (from factory)

[brian372lok]

I would load everything up and go to a scale.. Weight with the trailer and just the truck. Then figure out what you need.

[rockfordroo]

If your toys are just kayaks, dump the toy hauler and get a regular TT. Put the kayaks on the truck roof/bed.

[johnm1]

I think I'm missing something here because a bunch of ya are telling me to load up the back of the trailer with stuff I don't have, want or need ... or buy another camper. If you give me the money, I'll get another camper or the "toys" that are heavy enough.


- I've briefly looked at adding a 2nd fresh water tank where the fuel tank would have gone. But I haven't gone any further than just looking. This is something I will pursue more. Side note - the brackets for the 30 gallon fuel tank are there so adding a 30 gallon water tank might be "easy"

- We got the TH to carry the kayaks and I'm not going to change campers. I've had these 4 kayaks on the roof of my truck using Yakima racks and the roof and rack system was overloaded (per Yakima's tech support).

- I definitely need to load up and go to a scale.

- And yes, the truck is more than capable of towing this camper. I just need to get the tw into a safe zone for the way we use this camper.

[rsdata]

I think I'm missing something here because a bunch of ya are telling me to load up the back of the trailer with stuff I don't have, want or need

I don't think you are missing anything... You bought a toy hauler, capable of hauling heavy toys and not designed to haul a few hundred pounds of toys without having a heavy TW.

If you give me the money, I'll get another camper or the "toys" that are heavy enough.

yup, that will happen... NOT

any possibility of changing the position of the trailer axles to a more forward position? This would change the fulcrum, the tipping point of the trailer and relieve some of the TW. I would go to a suspension/frame shop pulling the empty trailer and have them look at it... NEVER take it to the dealer that is not specialized in that type of work.

[polishdon]

I've got a similar set up. My hitch is rated the same as yours and I use an equalizer WD system and have had great results towing empty or loaded. Looking at all the numbers for tongue weight, GVWR, max tow, etc will make your head explode. I know I'm probably close to the tongue weight limit of my hitch when I'm empty, but I also think GM under rates their hitch to cover their ass.

[clr]

OK I get that you do not like any of the answers, and I somewhat understand that. But I would make that best of the situation.

So if it was me here is what I would do: throw the adapter away and secure a new WD hitch that will handle 1500#. Load as much weight as you can in the garage of your TT.

Enjoy the new camper. Being worst case 100# over weight on the TW will not be a big deal. Just keep an eye on it. Most trucks only have about 1500# TW rating. My F350 diesel long bed truck 2010 rating is only 600# conventional and 1500# WD TW so just roll with that number. As others have stated a toy hauler will be TW heavy when empty.

[rockfordroo]

Originally Posted by johnm1

I think I'm missing something here because a bunch of ya are telling me to load up the back of the trailer with stuff I don't have, want or need ... or buy another camper. If you give me the money, I'll get another camper or the "toys" that are heavy enough.

I'd say you've done what many of us have done:

You failed to fully investigate and understand how the weight of TT's is proportioned relative to axles and tongue, and how that gets moved to your tow vehicle. It's particularly important on toy haulers because of the MAJOR difference in weight distribution when the toy it is designed to hold is loaded or not loaded.

There are hundreds of threads here from people with overloaded tow vehicles because they didn't understand this.

You at least have an inkling about tongue weights or you wouldn't have posted. Lots of people have no clue about tongue weights and payloads. All they look at is dry weights.

[johnm1]

Originally Posted by clr

OK I get that you do not like any of the answers, and I somewhat understand that. But I would make that best of the situation.

So if it was me here is what I would do: throw the adapter away and secure a new WD hitch that will handle 1500#. Load as much weight as you can in the garage of your TT.

Enjoy the new camper. Being worst case 100# over weight on the TW will not be a big deal. Just keep an eye on it. Most trucks only have about 1500# TW rating. My F350 diesel long bed truck 2010 rating is only 600# conventional and 1500# WD TW so just roll with that number. As others have stated a toy hauler will be TW heavy when empty.

clr - you hit the nail on the head and that's what I plan on doing so I can carry what I want and load it where I want. I'll probably start with the ball & w/d setup and then replace the truck hitch later.

I guess I was hoping for some wonderful words of wisdom on how to get the factory to respond and somehow get them to help with the costs since the trailer was overloading my truck from the get go.

[johnm1]

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

I'd say you've done what many of us have done:

You failed to fully investigate and understand how the weight of TT's is proportioned relative to axles and tongue, and how that gets moved to your tow vehicle. It's particularly important on toy haulers because of the MAJOR difference in weight distribution when the toy it is designed to hold is loaded or not loaded.

I respectfully, and completely, disagree with this statement.

Based upon the brochure spec's (what else can I use?) of this camper, when we were looking at it on the lot, it was WELL WITHIN the limits of my truck so, yes, I did do my research. There's a major difference between publishing the tw at 1126# and having it end up almost 400-500# more.

[KMP44]

Originally Posted by johnm1

I guess I was hoping for some wonderful words of wisdom on how to get the factory to respond and somehow get them to help with the costs since the trailer was overloading my truck from the get go.

Unfortunately you may have an uphill battle getting the factory to do much more than hide behind the "disclaimers" in the fine print that basically say brochure specs aren't gospel. But it never hurts to ask, so follow up with them and see if you can get a response. And maybe your dealer would be willing to contact FR as well on your behalf.

But - sounds like you have a suitable truck, just need to get the tongue weight adjusted. I would find a CAT Scale and spend a little time getting some weights. See what the tongue weight actually is when hooked to the truck with the WDH on. You can find the weighing procedure here in other threads. One option to consider is adjusting the height of the hitch ball along with the setup of the WDH. Generally being "nose high" isn't good, but in your case it would be worth seeing if raising the ball slightly shifted weight back to the axles. If you do this while at the scale, you can see the effect on both the tongue weight and the axles, to make sure you aren't overloading the axles.

[Zoom]

Before I picked up my toy hauler I had the dealer to weight the tongue with propane and one battery. It was just under 1000 lbs. I have the opposite issue than you. I have to fill up my fresh water tank (53 gallons) to get enough tongue weight to handle properly when I have 1400 lbs. of motorcycles in the garage. I am still under the GVW but just 400 lbs.

[rockfordroo]

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

I'd say you've done what many of us have done:

You failed to fully investigate and understand how the weight of TT's is proportioned relative to axles and tongue, and how that gets moved to your tow vehicle. It's particularly important on toy haulers because of the MAJOR difference in weight distribution when the toy it is designed to hold is loaded or not loaded.

Originally Posted by johnm1

I respectfully, and completely, disagree with this statement.

Based upon the brochure spec's (what else can I use?) of this camper, when we were looking at it on the lot, it was WELL WITHIN the limits of my truck so, yes, I did do my research. There's a major difference between publishing the tw at 1126# and having it end up almost 400-500# more.

Brochures almost always use unloaded or dry weights. Most of us are aware of that. You need to look at the GVWR sticker on the side of the TT and use 12-15% of THAT for your tongue weight. Then figure the TW will go up with the toy not loaded.

[drittal]

I personally believe there is a big push in TH manufacturers to make "1/2 ton towable" haulers.

This leads to some models with marginal stability and now it would seem some models that the true TW is concealed.

To stay within limits I'd say your only true recourse is upgrading hitch/receiver.

[johnm1]

Originally Posted by drittal

I personally believe there is a big push in TH manufacturers to make "1/2 ton towable" haulers.

This leads to some models with marginal stability and now it would seem some models that the true TW is concealed.

I couldn't agree more! And because of this, I have to spend more $$$ to deal with their (at best) misleading specs.

[Ida Ratherbe Camping]

Originally Posted by johnm1

I couldn't agree more! And because of this, I have to spend more $$$ to deal with their (at best) misleading specs.

Wait till you find out the tires supplied on your toy hauler are marginal at best and you have to drop another 800 on good tires.

[FrankG]

John

I had a 29V and hauled a 1000 lb Can Am Spyder along with other stuff in the garage. When the Spyder was on board it had a significant impact on the tongue weight... It reduced it. At the time I used a Blue OX WDH with 1200 lb bars. They worked fairly well. Towing empty was easier than loaded, the rear weight had it's impact on sway.

We towed with a 13, F250 SC 4x4 with the 6.2

[polishdon]

Originally Posted by Ida Ratherbe Camping

Wait till you find out the tires supplied on your toy hauler are marginal at best and you have to drop another 800 on good tires.

Been there, done that. lol Best peace of mind I've purchased though.

[SuicideSaints]

I dont really know what else to say, toy haulers are manufactured with the knowledge that the TW will be "super high" because the toys you're supposed to put in the back will lighten it. If they manufactured them like "regular" TTs then when you put the toys in they would sway all over the place because you'de have no TW. This is rule number for for toy haulers and you shouldn't even need a brochure to tell you this....

You're only option at this point is to attempt to shift all your gear and load the garage portion with as much as you can in order to mimic what the toy hauler is supposed to be used for. In doing this you will see your TW go down.

Good luck and I hope you get it worked out.

[llr]

I am a little confused here you started saying you want to add batteries and/or tools on the tongue but it is too heavy already. Then some one suggested moving some things to the garage but you didn't seem to want to.

It would seem to that your garage would have plenty of space and moving the existing battery to the garage would remove over its weight from the tongue, added additional batteries and tools in back would lighten the tongue some more and you don't have the space restriction like on the A frame.

this sounds like a good start to me.

[johnm1]

Are some of you reading the whole thread or just tiny bits of it and making a snap judgment?

It's all about the ADVERTISED tongue weight vs. real life. I understand the physics involved.

This has NOTHING to do with me believing what the factory publishes or not understanding what a TH is designed for. My toys just happen to be lighter than most peoples.

To restate what I've said before ...
- I want to add more batteries.
- Up front with the original one is the logical place to start.
- I weighed the tongue so I understood where I was at on weight.
- I'm too heavy without doing anything.
- I use most of the space inside the camper so I don't want batteries back there.
- I would also have to put in a larger investment to get agm's for inside due to venting.
- I have a path forward by replacing the ball mount, w/d set up and hitch.
- I was hoping someone had some magic idea that I hadn't thought about.