TV bed length for large 5th Wheel

[Jim34RL]

I have a 2008, 2500 Dodge Ram Mega Cab 6.7L, 68RFE 6spd auto, 4X4 with 3:73 gear set. My tires are LT285/70R17 126S Nitto Dura Grapplers with Mickey Thompson rims. These are rated to support a load of 3,750 LBS at 80@PSI each. Gross vehicle weight is 8,000 lbs. and the trail a 34RL Cedar Creek has a gross weight of 16,173 LBS for a total combined weight of 24,173 LBS so, my class D license is adequate in the state of IL per the Sec of State police. (I contacted them on my towing needs). If I was to go to a new truck with a GWR of 10,000 LBS I would need a non-commercial license and retest since trailer and truck are over the 26,001 LBS limit on my license now.

My bed length is 6.4" long and I use a manual Reese sliding hitch. The hitch is removed and installed at least 10 times a year by myself, I take the head off and then the frame. I can lift each section by myself if I so, choose but I do have a chain hoist to assist if needed (if I am lazy the hoist comes out). As I use the bed to haul plywood and wood for my wood working hobby.

I have found the manual sliding hitch meets my needs since the only time I actuate the sliding feature is to back into my driveway and in campgrounds if I need to. Most campgrounds sites we choose now are pull thru with full hook ups. So a manual slide hitch is an option for lighter weight and lower cost, if this is something you are will to look at.

[Rich5117]

Thanks for the additional info, the first thing that really caught my attention is your anticipated pin weight. That weight is probably based on dry weight. If you take 23% of 15,500 lbs that comes to 3450 lbs of pin weight even at 13000 lbs it's going to be around 2990 lbs. While all these are best guesstimates the only true way to know is to weight it loaded.

Think you will be right on the edge of max weights based on your additional info. I am not a fan of dually's but think you really should consider that as a choice since you have the opportunity to correctly match your truck to your RV. You do not want to buy a new truck then a month later realize it is just not cutting it or you decide to carry more stuff, which we all seem to do, then be way heavy.

I have to tell you I am not a weight police person or safety guru. Don't get me wrong these are extremely important considerations. Knowing that you are pulling a rig with in all of these, as well as the feeling of traveling safe, will make your excursions much more enjoyable.

The final choice has to be yours, but you can see where the other great people here on this forum are steering you.

Safe travels.

[BandJCarm]

State regs amaze me!!

I can NOT imagine that the gazillions of Big Honkin' Rigs I see traveling the USA have any such CDL license! It would stagger my puny imagination.

Did the dealer you bought from tell you this? If not, are they not liable? If so, what specific STATE reg did they quote.

All that aside, I have a huge dually and big 5th wheel and I have a CAT scale paper that says I weigh 25,001 pounds. Surely you can find similar?

[Rich5117]

PA has these driver regulations for Recreational Vehicles. Already had my CDL from fire dept so did not have to get them. They kind mimic federal rules and are more for units over 26,001 lbs combination weight for towables

[BandJCarm]

Originally Posted by Rich5117

PA has these driver regulations for Recreational Vehicles. Already had my CDL from fire dept so did not have to get them. They kind mimic federal rules and are more for units over 26,001 lbs combination weight for towables

OK, here's my questions then.

1) If a state has a requirement for NON COMMERCIAL travel trailers to be under 26,000 lbs total, can someone from one of those states show me that clear state regulation?

2) If I live in a state without these requirements, and travel through your state, am I subject to this law?

3) If #2 is "yes", can you show me that law also? I'd think I'd NEED a comprehensive list of such states! If #2 is "no", then why would a resident/citizen not have a legal recourse for discriminatory application of state laws?

[AquaMan]

The percentages for trailer weight to calculate pin weight can be all over the place and fall within the acceptable range of 15-25%. I had a 42'/14k 5er that had a 16-17% pin weight.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

OK, here's my questions then.

1) If a state has a requirement for NON COMMERCIAL travel trailers to be under 26,000 lbs total, can someone from one of those states show me that clear state regulation?

2) If I live in a state without these requirements, and travel through your state, am I subject to this law?

3) If #2 is "yes", can you show me that law also? I'd think I'd NEED a comprehensive list of such states! If #2 is "no", then why would a resident/citizen not have a legal recourse for discriminatory application of state laws?

1. I think a previous member linked to the Texas regulation. Here’s Maryland’s page on licensing requirements. I followed it up with an email to Maryland directly for MY situation (12,300 lbs truck and 15,825 lbs camper) and they confirmed: Class A Non-Commercial.

http://www.mva.maryland.gov/drivers/...lass-codes.htm

2. No, licensing is reciprocal. If you’re legal in your state, you’re legal in any other.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by AquaMan

The percentages for trailer weight to calculate pin weight can be all over the place and fall within the acceptable range of 15-25%. I had a 42'/14k 5er that had a 16-17% pin weight.

Agreed. Mine hovered right around 16%.

That variability is why I created the “pin weight estimator” at www.towingplanner.com. Plug in dry weights and it spits out best guesstimate wet weights.

[BandJCarm]

Originally Posted by ependydad

1. I think a previous member linked to the Texas regulation. Here’s Maryland’s page on licensing requirements. I followed it up with an email to Maryland directly for MY situation (12,300 lbs truck and 15,825 lbs camper) and they confirmed: Class A Non-Commercial.

Driver's License Class Codes

2. No, licensing is reciprocal. If you’re legal in your state, you’re legal in any other.

OK. Wow.

Short of moving, I'd sure consider suing the state, if I was a resident.

Edit: I said "OK" but I can't make that link show me that a Maryland resident Needs a CDL to pull a trailer with the CVWR of the Truck AND Trailer exceeding 26K lbs. Even if I could, there's not an "endorsement" to fit that scenario that I see. Exactly which DL Class and which Endorsement are you saying is required?

???

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

OK. Wow.

Short of moving, I'd sure consider suing the state, if I was a resident.

Edit: I said "OK" but I can't make that link show me that a Maryland resident Needs a CDL to pull a trailer with the CVWR of the Truck AND Trailer exceeding 26K lbs. Even if I could, there's not an "endorsement" to fit that scenario that I see. Exactly which DL Class and which Endorsement are you saying is required?

???

A CDL is *NOT* required.

It’s a non-commercial Class A license that is required.

[BandJCarm]

Originally Posted by ependydad

A CDL is *NOT* required.

It’s a non-commercial Class A license that is required.

With which listed endorsement? A Class A Non Commercial License appears (??) to be just the normal one everyone gets.

I see none for pulling a travel trailer nor any weight numbers listed, other than a VEHICLE weighing 26K lbs. What would that be, a D9 Cat?? LOL

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

With which listed endorsement? A Class A Non Commercial License appears (??) to be just the normal one everyone gets.

I see none for pulling a travel trailer nor any weight numbers listed, other than a VEHICLE weighing 26K lbs. What would that be, a D9 Cat?? LOL

If I recall correctly, the standard license in Maryland is a Class C. You can use that for up to a trailer of 10,000 lbs. After that, you need the class A.

The weight-cutoffs are based on GVWR, not actual weights.

The vehicle over 26K fits things like some Class A diesel pushers. If I recall, my friends were in the upper 40k or lower 50k pounds range with theirs. At least that’s what I think I remember.

[BandJCarm]

I assumed the standard was a Class A. I need to bow out. I admit, this is all very confusing. I guess I'm glad I live in a state that doesn't have all these burdens.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

With which listed endorsement? A Class A Non Commercial License appears (??) to be just the normal one everyone gets.

I see none for pulling a travel trailer nor any weight numbers listed, other than a VEHICLE weighing 26K lbs. What would that be, a D9 Cat?? LOL

Here is my correspondence with the Maryland people:

If the trailer/vehicle being towed is Over 10,000 lbs GVWR and the towing vehicle GVWR are added together and that weight is 26,001 lbs or more then you would need a class A (full or restricted A-No Tractor Trailers)license to operate that combo.



If the trailer is Over 10,000lbs and the trucks weight added together total to 26,000 lbs or less than you can drive it using a class C –car license…..unless…the vehicle required placarding for Hazmat or was designed to carry 16 or more passengers including the driver, then you would need a CDL license.

I got curious about the Class B thing and asked that also. Here’s the response:

If a driver wishes to operate a single unit vehicle that has a GVWR of 26,001 lbs or more (or a vehicle -26,001 lbs or more & pull a trailer/vehicle 10,000 lbs or less) they are required to have a class “B” license.



If the driver is operating a noncommercial Fire Truck, Farm Truck or RV with the above mentioned weights, they must have at least a noncommercial class B license. If the driver is operating a commercial Truck or Bus then they must have a class B CDL.

A commercial vehicle would be a vehicle other that the Fire or Farm trucks or the RV that is 26,001 lbs or more, requires placarding for Hazmat or is designed to carry 16 or more passengers including the driver.

And that’s all I know about that. You’ll be best off reaching out to one of the states if you gave more questions.

[CaptnJohn]

Just me but never a long bed or dually again. It seemed I was always parking in the back 40. I tow a Montana with a 2016 F350 srw. The Ford sb is 6'9". A B&W Patriot slider is installed and rarely used. It is the easiest manual slider I have found. Made in the USA of steel made in the USA. We are only towing about 18,000 miles and using 165 days each year. No other hitch I've had compared.

[Slow Moon]

Originally Posted by CaptnJohn

Just me but never a long bed or dually again. It seemed I was always parking in the back 40. I tow a Montana with a 2016 F350 srw. The Ford sb is 6'9". A B&W Patriot slider is installed and rarely used. It is the easiest manual slider I have found. Made in the USA of steel made in the USA. We are only towing about 18,000 miles and using 165 days each year. No other hitch I've had compared.

X2

[Slow Moon]

My dually/SRW preference is like Captn John's. I avoid the need for a long-bed dually.

If your tongue or towing weight requires a dually, then you probably ought to have a dually.

If a short-bed SRW meets your payload and tow-weight requirements, a side-winder should solve clearance issues, IF ANY. Slide hitches work, but they are big, heavy & some are a hassle.

Some say dually towing stability is superior, but my SRW is fine, as are many others. TIRES do matter, on both the TV & 5er.

DUALLY ADVOCATES PLEASE NOTE: the foregoing shares MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE/EXPERIENCE. Dually/SRW debates never end & sometimes are uncivil. Let's not go there.

[mikeysotp]

Originally Posted by Slow Moon

My dually/SRW preference is like Captn John's. I avoid the need for a long-bed dually.

If your tongue or towing weight requires a dually, then you probably ought to have a dually.

If a short-bed SRW meets your payload and tow-weight requirements, a side-winder should solve clearance issues, IF ANY. Slide hitches work, but they are big, heavy & some are a hassle.

Some say dually towing stability is superior, but my SRW is fine, as are many others. TIRES do matter, on both the TV & 5er.

DUALLY ADVOCATES PLEASE NOTE: the foregoing shares MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE/EXPERIENCE. Dually/SRW debates never end & sometimes are uncivil. Let's not go there.

I neglected to mention in my original post the hassle aspect. While I love the fact that my hitch slides automatically no matter where I am or what I'm doing, it does come at a price. I am only able to hook and unhook pretty much in a straight line. Pullrite says you get 15 degrees in each direction I think but that might be stretching it. I've found the the hitch really likes the truck to be more or less straight in line with the trailer to unhook. There have been a few times in tight CG's where I wish that wasn't necessary but I prefer that over not having the hitch auto slide when I need it to.

[Rich5117]

BandJCarm, this is to big a pdf to put on, but search PA title 75 section 1504 for the non-commercial license requirements in Pa.

[Rich5117]

Mikeysotp, I to use a Pullrite, was my first hitch used for fifth wheel towing. Just put the newer ISR version in my new truck. Have only had a few times were it would have been nice to stop and unhitch at an angle, instead of playing the wiggle game.

The way this hitch works far out way those few times.