TV blues - Page 4

drittal · 10-25-2015, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

I also was a Service Tech, installer and designed systems. Had a company, and also managed 45 Sheet metal Mechanics. Buy a break or a plasma cutter and then tell me what it cost. Tools are built into the overhead. Never ever did we ever charge for tools, that's part of overhead. When I started we charged 35.00 per hour when I got out it was doubled that. It wasn't because of tools it was because of the price of labor and benefits. (Union shop local #104 SF.Ca. and proud of it) Plasma cutters and design cad programs made the job easier and less labor. We abosberted the new tech. and never charged for it. We bought our mechanics the tools required to due there job, just as a dealership does. How many times you going to charge for the same computer or the upgrades? Yes it cost a shop 2000.00 to up grade there programs yearly, but there has to be an break even point. Thanks for letting me rant about being ripped off....

I agree with this. Using a scan tool to check codes or run diagnostics should not be any more than straight labor rate.

bob caldwell · 10-25-2015, 06:20 PM

Kenny kustom · 10-25-2015, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

We bought our mechanics the tools required to due there job, just as a dealership does. :

BEST POST EVER....

I must have been at the wrong dealerships, as they have never BOUGHT me any tools....

2008 F350 CCSB V10
2016 Sabre 36QBOK

bob caldwell · 10-25-2015, 06:35 PM

Special tools are required by manuf. to be purchased by dealers every year in order to retain dealership....not hand tools. (In the states anyway.)

mud yapster · 10-25-2015, 06:38 PM

No one bought my tools either. He must be union.

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drittal

I agree with this. Using a scan tool to check codes or run diagnostics should not be any more than straight labor rate.

I don't think anyone said any different.
Usually its a 1 hour labor charge. And yes labor rates may be $90 -125 per hour. Its really not worth it for any less. From the writer, to the lot porter, to the tech to the cashier, The shop isn't getting rich on a scan and it is probably at a loss actually if thats all is done after you figure all the hands that are involved. But its customer service and it aids getting work done that will make the shop profit.
I have never heard of any shops charging extra for using different computers or tools, we just charge more hours because it will take longer or the book states a certain hourly rate for the procedure.

There are some bad shops and a few bad techs out there, but the rest are what keeps us all rollin' !

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom

BEST POST EVER....

I must have been at the wrong dealerships, as they have never BOUGHT me any tools....

2008 F350 CCSB V10
2016 Sabre 36QBOK

X3
But i do give my helpers tools occasionally just like the guy that i use to help did so for me!

bob caldwell · 10-25-2015, 06:43 PM

Any shop that needs a porter to bring cars in is a joke...the person work'n on it has legs.

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob caldwell

Any shop that needs a porter to bring cars in is a joke...the person work'n on it has legs.

Ok, guess you've never been to a large dealership.
The porters take them off the drive and park in the lot AND THEN the tech goes and gets them to work on and once complete they go back to the lot. When a customer comes to pick it up, the cashier will send a porter to bring it to the front for the customer.

bob caldwell · 10-25-2015, 06:51 PM

That is what the service writer did.

mud yapster · 10-25-2015, 06:56 PM

Overhead overhead overhead and you wonder why it costs you so much for a repair. You can this same occurrence on a outrageous hospital bill.

Witch Doctor · 10-25-2015, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom

BEST POST EVER....

I must have been at the wrong dealerships, as they have never BOUGHT me any tools....

2008 F350 CCSB V10
2016 Sabre 36QBOK

Wait a minute here I do not want to be misunderstood. Do you buy the computer that you use and pay yearly for the up grades? I think maybe the dealership will. Our sheet metal mechanics bought there own hand tools. But they didn't buy the cutter or cad. For a mechanic to lay out and form a sq. to rd. Took hrs in labor, with the equipment bought it took less then 15 mins. which brought the labor rate down which was passed on to the customer and kept us competitive. More contracts won more money made. It what you do to gain the edge. And YES I"M Retired Union, and Proud of it.....

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob caldwell

That is what the service writer did.

One of the dealerships i was at a couple years ago had about 7 writers, 2 service managers (1 Gmc/buick and 1 chevy), 1 shop forman, 2 or 3 porters for service, 3 or 4 girls in the cashier office, 1 or 2 csa girls, about 20 or so techs, about 3 or 4 lube techs, and about 6 or so make ready and detail.....and then the body shop, and then sales.
We had hundreds of cars and trucks at the lot for repair and thousands for sale. And this is just one of many like this around the okc metro.

Writers dont have time to move cars just like techs when thier time is better spent working on the dozens of cars lined up, especially when you can pay a porter $10hr.
Its all bottom line and production. If it was cheaper to do it differently, trust me, it would be. These guys and the manufacturers spend alot of time going over production models and layouts.
You can argue the points here all day, but this is how it works today, well actually tomorrow. All dealers here are closed sundays

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

Wait a minute here I do not want to be misunderstood. Do you buy the computer that you use and pay yearly for the up grades? I think maybe the dealership will. Our sheet metal mechanics bought there own hand tools. But they didn't buy the cutter or cad. For a mechanic to lay out and form a sq. to rd. Took hrs in labor, with the equipment bought it took less then 15 mins. which brought the labor rate down which was passed on to the customer and kept us competitive. More contracts won more money made. It what you do to gain the edge. And YES I"M Retired Union, and Proud of it.....

Some of us do buy our own computers, scanners and specialty tools.
The reason why....if a place has only one or 2 of said tools or even 6 or 10, with 20 guys working on stuff, you are waiting for the tool or looking for it (which takes up more time) and so in the end you can be money ahead to just buy your own specialty tools, computers etc. But not everybody is high speed and highly motivated so not everyone does this.
I dont want someone keeping me from making money, so i figure out a way that is most profitable for me. Sometimes you might not need a tool that much, but you can take it home to use on side projects too!

Witch Doctor · 10-25-2015, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MillerTime

Some of us do buy our own computers, scanners and specialty tools.
The reason why....if a place has only one or 2 of said tools or even 6 or 10, with 20 guys working on stuff, you are waiting for the tool or looking for it (which takes up more time) and so in the end you can be money ahead to just buy your own specialty tools, computers etc. But not everybody is high speed and highly motivated so not everyone does this.
I dont want someone keeping me from making money, so i figure out a way that is most profitable for me. Sometimes you might not need a tool that much, but you can take it home to use on side projects too!

So I guess I would call that piece work, That is fine and if we pieced worked I can see that. I didn't know dealership mechanics pieced worked, you see I learned something here. I know my Ford dealership is not ran like that. If someone is using there computer and program the next person waits. They have one and 6 mech. only, after all I live in the backwoods.

Kenny kustom · 10-25-2015, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

Wait a minute here I do not want to be misunderstood. Do you buy the computer that you use and pay yearly for the up grades? :

Yes I did. Otc pegasys.
Owner of the small shop thought the genesis was just fine. I did not agree. Took the scanner with me, when I went to the dealerships.
Used it there too. The factory scan tool is useless of other makes.

2008 F350 CCSB V10
2016 Sabre 36QBOK

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

So I guess I would call that piece work, That is fine and if we pieced worked I can see that. I didn't know dealership mechanics pieced worked, you see I learned something here. I know my Ford dealership is not ran like that. If someone is using there computer and program the next person waits. They have one and 6 mech. only, after all I live in the backwoods.

Its like i said, not everyone is willing to do that. But it may make the difference of a tech making $50k a year or one making closer to 6 figures, if they want to put some of their money in it.
I also live in the country and im not sure how the little dealers around here do it. I wanted to make more than local could provide, so i made a 100 mile commute every day.

At most places everyone except the reception girl, the porters and the cashiers were on commission. The detail guys, make ready, lube techs, managers, parts guys, writers almost everyone that made more than about $10-12 hr were commission.

bob caldwell · 10-25-2015, 07:48 PM

Here is the same...commission. Depended as to what you did as to what pay scale you got paid from.

Witch Doctor · 10-25-2015, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MillerTime

Its like i said, not everyone is willing to do that. But it may make the difference of a tech making $50k a year or one making closer to 6 figures, if they want to put some of their money in it.
I also live in the country and im not sure how the little dealers around here do it. I wanted to make more than local could provide, so i made a 100 mile commute every day.

At most places everyone except the reception girl, the porters and the cashiers were on commission. The detail guys, make ready, lube techs, managers, parts guys, writers almost everyone that made more than about $10-12 hr were commission.

I understand your point, by what you just said about commission is the reason they charged me for something that I didn't need at all. That increased my bill by over a 1/3. The mechanics get paid an hourly wage. If they work on 1 truck all day or 5. I'm sure if they do not preform they are fired. They also use the big book for every job. The book say's 3hrs labor they get done in two, I still pay 3 hrs i Not in Sheetmetal and HVAC. I had to bid and bring the job in to make money if we went over I couldn't go back to the customer, but it's to common in the RV and Mechanic business. Don't mean to lump you in with them, but as an example. I respect that you are willing to do that for you and your Family. My Son Commutes over 4 hrs a day to work at Google, I know how it is, been there and done that. Still has nothing to do with the service manager adding things to a quote saying well it took longer and we needed to use the computer They should have known that from the beginning, At that point I could have refused before they began. From what I read here on your post on the forum, you sound like a good mechanic, wished you lived closer...

MillerTime · 10-25-2015, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

I understand your point, by what you just said about commission is the reason they charged me for something that I didn't need at all. That increased my bill by over a 1/3. The mechanics get paid an hourly wage. If they work on 1 truck all day or 5. I'm sure if they do not preform they are fired. They also use the big book for every job. The book say's 3hrs labor they get done in two, I still pay 3 hrs i Not in Sheetmetal and HVAC. I had to bid and bring the job in to make money if we went over I couldn't go back to the customer, but it's to common in the RV and Mechanic business. Don't mean to lump you in with them, but as an example. I respect that you are willing to do that for you and your Family. My Son Commutes over 4 hrs a day to work at Google, I know how it is, been there and done that. Still has nothing to do with the service manager adding things to a quote saying well it took longer and we needed to use the computer They should have known that from the beginning, At that point I could have refused before they began. From what I read here on your post on the forum, you sound like a good mechanic, wished you lived closer...

Thanks!!
The way i try to explain to people, mainly insurance adjusters, hours are or is basically just a currency. It will take 3 hours at this rate, say $100 an hour. Basically im just saying it going to be $300 to do that job. Basically its my bid. Sometimes everthing falls into place and you can knock out 3 or 4 hours of work in 1 hour, the next hour you might make .5 hours.
Im going to say my boss expects me to turn 2 to 2.5 hours for every hour im at work. You dont start there obviously. In the beginning you are lucky to do 1 hour for every hour on the clock. And as your gain experience you become quicker and more efficient. You cant knock somebody for charging 3 hours and it taking an hour with one tech, there might be another tech that will struggle to get it done in 5 hours.

I got bent out of shape the other day at an adjuster that asked, "did it really take 3 hours to do that" to settle a total loss. That just set me off, after i spent my time to tear something down, write a supplement, go over it with a writer, the spend thier time writing it up, submitting it and then taking time to deal with the adjuster, get me out there to explain stuff to them....and this was after all the paperwork the front office did, and dealing with the customer. It actually cost the shop money just to deal with that vehicle and the adjuster was sitting there bitching about it. No, that one part didnt take 3 hours, but it cost more than that to handle that job. Luckily those are few and far between!

Done with that rant! And probably just sign off now.

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