Weight surprise!

[Charli]

We finally got to the scales and what a surprise we had. Given that we have a 3/4T truck and that we are pulling one of those X-lite 5ers (see sig) I was sure that we would be fine and could look at a bigger 5er with the same truck.
The Dodge Bodybuilders Guide states the following for the truck: Tow rating 12,800#; GVWR 9000#; GCWR 20000#; Payload 1,970#.
Here is the real numbers:
Ratings. Truck only. Truck with trailer
GAWR-F. 5,200. 4,629. 4,608
GAWR-R. 6,010. 3,174. 4,982
GVWR. 9,000. 7,803. - 9,503. = 1700# pin wt.
GCWR. 20,000. 9,503 + 6,812 Trailer axles. = 16,402# total wt.
Total trailer weight 1,700 + 6,812 = 8,512#
The truck only wts include myself, DW, dog, hitch and our stuff. The truck with trailer is the same but with the trailer hooked up.
So we are 3600# under the GCWR but the truck is overweight by 500#. So if we get a bigger 5er, say another 3500# which would bring us up to an average mid profile 5er and add 20% (700#) of that to the existing pin wt and the truck would weigh approx 10,200 which exceeds the 10,000#GVWR for a Ram 3500.
So what gives. Am I doing the properly. I have seen some pretty big 5ers being towed with 3/4T and they look fine. Is everybody out there overweight. Do airbags compensate enough to be 1200# overweight and still be safe?
Your comments would be appreciated. In the meantime I'll start my search for a Kenworth.

[cstover]

You would need to order the 14000 gvwr sticker. It is an option when building a new rig. Doesn't change the truck, just the sticker.

[Herk7769]

You have discovered the "ugly truth" of 5th wheels.

You can tow more travel trailer than 5th wheel due to where the tongue/pin weight is located with a 2500/250.

[ependydad]

My 3500 DRW has a GVWR of 12,300 pounds. Hitched up and ready to camp, we came in right about 11,500 pounds. But, we were light on that trip in a number of areas. I'm really trying to find time to weigh on the way to one of our camping trips to see what a more normal load comes in at. I wouldn't be surprised to be right about at GVWR.

Anyway, I can't actually help your question. People say air bags and what not don't increase carrying capacity. I'm not smart enough to know what means or how to defend it either way. As well, lots of people travel overloaded but 1,200 (over 1/2 your total payload) seems excessive.

And yes, lots of people pull big fivers with 2500 trucks and are overloaded (not all). Either the drivers are doing it knowingly or unknowingly and some may have done things to the truck to help carry the load.

[Dave_Monica]

Originally Posted by Charli

So what gives. Am I doing the properly. I have seen some pretty big 5ers being towed with 3/4T and they look fine. Is everybody out there overweight.

Lots of people ignore the truck's GVWR and use the RAWR as the limiting factor as long as the tire load ratings exceed the RAWR. Using GVWR, your payload (or pin weight) is limited to 1197 lbs...using RAWR it's limited to 2836 lbs. You'll have to decide what's right to you. I'd say that there's lots of 12000 + lb 5vers being pulled by 250/2500 series trucks.

Dave

[garbonz]

I'm posted some time ago about the same thing with a 3/4 chevy and my 7900 dry 10K fiver, way under on everything except the GVWR of 9200 and was 500 over.


I'm on a diet now, and shifting alot of stuff from the truck to the back of the camper in an effort to reduce the pin weight. Not there yet, but I will report when this is completed.

[Rebel702]

Would loading more weight behind the trailer axle take pin weight off? (maybe fresh water if the tanks are behind the axle?) I am not a 5er so just curious. His pin weight is right in the middle of the recommended range at 20%. Does a light pin weight cause more sway?

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by Rebel702

Would loading more weight behind the trailer axle take pin weight off? (maybe fresh water if the tanks are behind the axle?) I am not a 5er so just curious. His pin weight is right in the middle of the recommended range at 20%. Does a light pin weight cause more sway?

Yes, you can decrease pin weight by loading heavier behind the axles.

Yes, you can get sway. But, I don't know how light of a pin you need for it. By design, my fifth wheel has 16% pin weight and loaded, I've found we're right about that.

[Frankm2]

I've done a lot of research on the subject. What I've decided for me, which I drive commercially, is that if I don't exceed the axle and tire ratings, I'm calling it good.

I'm still dreaming about a 1 ton dually diesel for now.

[Charli]

Thanks for all the feedback. I already have the bikes on the back bumper (actually a 4" receiver we had welded on to the frame cause the bumper is like paper and wouldn't even carry the wt of the spare tire) but there isnt much room for storage behind the axles. I'm going to go to a few places next week that specialize in truck suspension mods and also talk to the dealer (not a salesman cause we know what he'll recommend) and see what they suggest.
Will probably list the trailer and see what we can get and then decide about the truck. Have seen a few 2011 F350 and they sure look nice. They have the new Ford diesels which are supposed to be a big improvement on the old 6.4L.
We have one more year before we join the snowbird crowd so have some time to get this right.