What helped you decide diesel or gas?

[ependydad]

For me, with the campers we were looking at and my inexperience level- I felt like I needed a dually and diesel. It's the only truck I've owned and I'm happy with it.

Originally Posted by Oakman

3. With a diesel I can fuel up at the truck pumps and not have to worry about maneuvering room or whether the canopy over the pumps is high enough to fit under. BTW, that’s reason enough for having a diesel.

This is more awesome than Oakman even begins to describe. Fueling up at truck stops is so simple.

[BamaBob]

Originally Posted by doc73

I have not heard many address the maintenance increases. I do my own oil so other than being 4 gallons (LOL) instead of 6qts is fine... Do you need to replace your fuel filters every 10,000 and so on? I am used to the oil every 5,000 to 10,000 and KN air filter cleaning once every 30,000.

With the diesel I know DEF comes into play, does the vehicle get some good distance on 2.5 gallons of DEF or is it best to keep a few gallons in the rig?

We have been researching diesel as well Doc. The RAM 3500 we are considering gets 15K between Oil Changes and has a 8 GAL DEF Tank. Depending on where we are going (we want to do the AlCan in '18) I certainly would have a spare 2 GAL DEF Can in the toolbox

I have heard that a full DEF tank (in the above truck) gets 10K Miles but towing factors, idling and so forth come into play to reduce that. Also the Cummings can use Biodiesel which supposedly refuses DEF consumption (and gives you better mileage)

[Oakman]

BTW, my 6.4 liter diesel develops peak torque (650 lb-ft) at 2000 RPMs and peak horsepower (350 hp) at 3000 RPMs.

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by Oakman

I believe that chart is a comparison of a GAS V8 vs. the Ecoboost.

It is, but the numbers and curve directly dispute the statement made about gas torque curves. I would surmise again that maybe the myth is related to a normally aspirated engine, but it is perceived by many to mean gas engines. It certainly does not apply to all gas engines as the chart displays.

[broncodriver]

Here's the real question why a 3/4 ton when the only difference between that and a 1 ton is one leaf spring and about $600

[broncodriver]

Originally Posted by HSVBamaBob

We have been researching diesel as well Doc. The RAM 3500 we are considering gets 15K between Oil Changes and has a 8 GAL DEF Tank. Depending on where we are going (we want to do the AlCan in '18) I certainly would have a spare 2 GAL DEF Can in the toolbox

I have heard that a full DEF tank (in the above truck) gets 10K Miles but towing factors, idling and so forth come into play to reduce that. Also the Cummings can use Biodiesel which supposedly refuses DEF consumption (and gives you better mileage)

You can also fill the DEF tank at the truck stop for under $3 a gallon VS 3 times that price from a auto parts store.
Love our new F350 and the 440HP and 860 ft of torque not an issue to get up to speed before the end on an on ramp and comes in handy for passing as we're 70 long with the boat behind.

[doc73]

Originally Posted by Oakman

I believe that chart is a comparison of a GAS V8 vs. the Ecoboost.

But my guess is his point is it is showing the high torque at lower RPM. I do know the EB is impressive but I am not going to do a f150 or 1500, definitely a 2500. But this is good info for the next person that might find this thread. Thanks you for the info.

[doc73]

Originally Posted by broncodriver

Here's the real question why a 3/4 ton when the only difference between that and a 1 ton is one leaf spring and about $600

Nothing more than the fact that 2500 are a dime a dozen around here for all the amish builders. 3500 are less common unless in the work truck. It is $60 more for reg but that is what it is. If I found the perfect 3500 then I would buy it but again, 2500's are more common.

[doc73]

Originally Posted by broncodriver

You can also fill the DEF tank at the truck stop for under $3 a gallon VS 3 times that price from a auto parts store.
Love our new F350 and the 440HP and 860 ft of torque not an issue to get up to speed before the end on an on ramp and comes in handy for passing as we're 70 long with the boat behind.

I had heard that the Pilot Flying J's (and I am sure other truck stops) had this. Guess it is just another pump at the fuel pump? I would do this just to save the cash for normal cruising if they started doing this at the regular gas stations.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by doc73

I had heard that the Pilot Flying J's (and I am sure other truck stops) had this. Guess it is just another pump at the fuel pump? I would do this just to save the cash for normal cruising if they started doing this at the regular gas stations.

I think many truck stops have these pumps. I don't use it, but I've noticed it pretty often.

Otherwise, they sell it by the gallon inside.

[wildwoodtraveler]

We are looking at replacing our 2009 F-150 this winter. I see you purchased the F-250 6.2L. Did you get the 3.73 or 4.30 axel ratio? We are towing a Wildwood 23FBS. Total payload on the truck with hitch, us, dogs, stuff is 1630#. Trailer is 7000# loaded. Purchased truck before we bought first trailer. Truck runs great but no oomph for the hills. Would you buy the same F-250 again? Change anything?

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by Oakman

BTW, my 6.4 liter diesel develops peak torque (650 lb-ft) at 2000 RPMs and peak horsepower (350 hp) at 3000 RPMs.

Yes, but not really a fair comparison 6.4 v 3.5. If you were to compare the Ecoboost v Ecodiesel that would be more comparable. I dare say that if you twin turbocharged a 6.2 gas Ford it would give you a run for the 6.4's money.


Found this 6.2 video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjzrEvbdyaU

[Lefty59]

Originally Posted by madmaxmutt

Hmmmm? Wouldn't any engine lose horsepower at altitude? There is less air and air pressure. I would think the difference would have more to do with naturally aspirated vs. turbo charged instead of diesel vs. gas. Even a turbo charged diesel vehicle would lose some power at altitude but, for comparison my Ecoboost is not down 20% at home and surely doesn't have a problem going higher.

That's what I would have thought too...the turbo charger is only one reason why the diesel does better at altitude...but there's a little more to it as well...

From: Five myths about diesel engines | Argonne National Laboratory

"Bonus: One thing you may not know about diesel!

Diesel engines actually perform better at high altitudes than gasoline engines.

Why? Gasoline engines operate at a very specific ratio of fuel and air. At high altitudes, the air is thinner—literally: there are fewer molecules of air per cubic foot. In the mountains, then, gasoline engines have to add less fuel to keep the ratio perfect, which affects performance.

"But a diesel engine runs fuel-lean; you don't have to keep the ratio perfect," Ciatti said. Diesel engines have turbochargers, which are pumps driven by exhaust gas. They add more air to the combustion chamber, and more air means more fuel can be added. At altitude, it can pull in more air and more fuel, and thus gets more power than gasoline engines can. Turbochargers don't use extra energy; they run off thermodynamically "free" energy that would be lost as exhaust if not used.

"Drive a diesel at altitude and you'll see other cars struggling while you zip past," Ciatti said. "The effect is very noticeable.""

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by doc73

But my guess is his point is it is showing the high torque at lower RPM. I do know the EB is impressive but I am not going to do a f150 or 1500, definitely a 2500. But this is good info for the next person that might find this thread. Thanks you for the info.

Exactly my point!

If I was set on moving up in weight class, I would chose a diesel. I don't personally see a current option gas engine that I would want in a 3/4 or 1 ton.

[Lvn2tvl]

I really like how my Tundra pulls my 5r compared to the Chevy 1500 I used to pull it home. The Tundra is geared much better so doesn't shift as much as Chevy. The biggest drawback is that it is still a 1/2 ton truck so weight is major important and very restrictive to pulling a 5r. After looking at web weight calculators for TV & TT matching safe weights I'm definitely going to need a bigger truck for my next 5r. Love the Tundra but want to travel bigger, safely, and not have to worry about weight any longer.

[Oaklevel]

Owned an 1986 and 1992 F250 with diesels Said I don't need a diesel bought a gasser.............

Lost Torque, Lost gas / fuel mileage, Lost over 5 MPG, towing an lost 4 MPG solo with gas. Truck Struggled all the time.

Went back to the Diesel world with a Cummins 3500 duelly gained 5 mpg solo. gained 5 mpg towing, gained two more tires Much more stable / some more in maintenance but not that much. Also gained a 10 foot longer trailer.

Gas for me just doesn't make cents.

[Rick_Geneseo]

I went from a gmc k3500 8.1L to a chevy k3500 6.6L. Both dually. I'm towing a Shasta Pheonix 33CK, grossing fully loaded at 14k. Most of the time it's around 12.5k. Mpg was 5.5 at best. The diesel is about 11. The power difference is amazing, as the gas always took time to come up onto the power curve. The diesel response is immediate. The other thing not mentioned is the upgrade in the Allison from the 5sp to the 6sp double overdrive.

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by Lefty59

That's what I would have thought too...the turbo charger is only one reason why the diesel does better at altitude...but there's a little more to it as well...

From: Five myths about diesel engines | Argonne National Laboratory

"Bonus: One thing you may not know about diesel!

Diesel engines actually perform better at high altitudes than gasoline engines.

Why? Gasoline engines operate at a very specific ratio of fuel and air. At high altitudes, the air is thinner—literally: there are fewer molecules of air per cubic foot. In the mountains, then, gasoline engines have to add less fuel to keep the ratio perfect, which affects performance.

"But a diesel engine runs fuel-lean; you don't have to keep the ratio perfect," Ciatti said. Diesel engines have turbochargers, which are pumps driven by exhaust gas. They add more air to the combustion chamber, and more air means more fuel can be added. At altitude, it can pull in more air and more fuel, and thus gets more power than gasoline engines can. Turbochargers don't use extra energy; they run off thermodynamically "free" energy that would be lost as exhaust if not used.

"Drive a diesel at altitude and you'll see other cars struggling while you zip past," Ciatti said. "The effect is very noticeable.""

Kind of an old article and it doesn't take a gas engine like the Ecoboost into account, but the article makes my point for me. An Ecoboost twin turbo does the exact same thing as the article described. The turbos spin fast and provide more air when the air is thinner.

[elind]

Originally Posted by rarterbury

When I pulled Vail pass with my 05 2500HD gasser with 295rst...screaming up the pass, that's when I decided to get diesel.

Just came over the Vial Pass the other week and the Duranax never went over 3k going up and I was doing 50-55mph passing the semi's. Coming down I kept it under 3.5k with the exhaust brake and not riding the brakes. DW was riding me for NOT riding the brakes.

[asquared]

For your maintenance question.... my 14 Silverado gets its oil changed every 5000 miles or when the oil life gets low, whichever comes first. I got 15000 miles out of my first fuel filter before the indicator got down to 25%. Typically, I add a gallon of def about every 5000 miles or so (pretty cheap at Wal-Mart). In the winter I run diesel Kleen cetane boost to help keep the fuel from gelling up. You need to drain water separator periodically as well.

My old f250 was pre def and post regeneration era so it had to have cetane boost added to every tank of fuel per Ford. It got oil changed every 5000 miles and fuel filter every 10000 miles.

I feel the maintenance is worth the towing comfort for me.