Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-18-2015, 09:06 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
RooVader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 630
When is slightly larger too large?

I wanted to enlist the help of experienced tow people. The two Roo's I am considering are similar. Individually no single aspect bothers me but when does the cumulative differences become a problem?

I am limited by a 1300 payload in my Ecoboost. It is generally just me in the truck, sometimes the wife. Not loading the truck with anything but clothes.

The larger Roo is different in the following ways:

~2 feet longer and set back 2 feet because of a bike deck. Same box size.
~7 inches taller due to the larger slide.
~50 pounds heavier tongue weight (675 vs 620).
~600 pounds heavier (4600 vs 4000lbs).

I am struggling because individually none of these bother me. As a complete package I am worried it would make a significant difference in towing. The larger one is attractive due to a slight preference on floorplan and additional outside storage for light items, and of course a nice option for bikes.

Standard Ecoboost towing package, 3.55, FX4 crew cab stock. Will be purchasing blue ox or equalizer 4pt. Will I notice a difference or will it be negligible...in your opinion of course.
__________________

__________________
RooVader is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 09:10 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Witch Doctor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Clarksville Va.
Posts: 7,628
Quote:
Originally Posted by RooVader View Post
I wanted to enlist the help of experienced tow people. The two Roo's I am considering are similar. Individually no single aspect bothers me but when does the cumulative differences become a problem?

I am limited by a 1300 payload in my Ecoboost. It is generally just me in the truck, sometimes the wife. Not loading the truck with anything but clothes.

The larger Roo is different in the following ways:

~2 feet longer and set back 2 feet because of a bike deck. Same box size.
~7 inches taller due to the larger slide.
~50 pounds heavier tongue weight (675 vs 620).
~600 pounds heavier (4600 vs 4000lbs).

I am struggling because individually none of these bother me. As a complete package I am worried it would make a significant difference in towing. The larger one is attractive due to a slight preference on floorplan and additional outside storage for light items, and of course a nice option for bikes.

Standard Ecoboost towing package, 3.55, FX4 crew cab stock. Will be purchasing blue ox or equalizer 4pt. Will I notice a difference or will it be negligible...in your opinion of course.
You should be alright with either one, Go bigger IMO. Really don't think you will notice any difference in towing at all. Maybe a little more wind resistance that's about it.
__________________

__________________
Rockwood #8289 WS 2012
F250 6.0 / Husky 16k
With 4 point leveling system
Witch Doctor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 10:23 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
geotex1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 730
RooVader, I'm probably interjecting too much into your decision-making at this point since I'm just a former hybrider, but here's my thoughts... First, don't wrap up in dry weight comparisons because neither option will be delivered at them. Compare considering the max trailer weight at full CCC. So, with the BD you are looking a 6600# and the DK you are looking at 5000#. The BD has heavier running gear. I believe you wanted them reasonable optioned and with the sapphire package, so either will be delivered to you ~500# over dry. I can ask our friends what their loaded BD weighs if you like.

Payload already accounts for a 150# driver, so say DW, clothes, and other things hauled in the truck add 350# and consider 250# to account for full propane, electric tongue jack, battery, and the weight of the hitch. So, 1300-350-250=700#. So, either way you are going to be at your payload. You obviously can keep your tongue weight right at the "sweet spot" for trailer behavior and within your payload by properly packing either trailer and with proper WDH setup.

Some may argue the small difference in frontal area, but it's hogwash that I could prove to you with a basic flow model for your specific case where you'll be presumably towing with a pickup without a topper or fairing. That is, the delta in frontal resistance will be peanuts compared to the resistance already there considering the front rake on the hybrids.

Have you weighed considerations such as: where you will really be camping - on the flats, in the hills, are really up in the mountains? Will your journeys be predominately short, or are you a frequent long-hauler? How long do you plan to keep the camper? Will it outlive the current truck or do you have plans to grow your family? Finally, take a real-world assessment of what you will really be packing into the camper. I swear more gets in there than you ever imagine, and I was originally disciplined as a hiker with a bedroll!

Whichever way you go, the fundamental thing is a must is that you feel satisfied you made the best decision to check-off as many needs, wants, and concerns as you could with the available options!

Good luck!
__________________
geotex1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 10:33 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
B and B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Wilmot Twp, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 8,604
I wouldn't worry about it. Growing up we used to tow a 24 ft travel trailer with a 1968 Ford Country Squire wagon with a 18 ft boat on top, 20 hp Mercury Outboard, Fishing Tackle, 4 people and weeks worth of clothes and food and couple cases of Old Vienna. It was over weight and no one died. My uncle had the same setup and he did not have any problems either.

Your truck is well within limits, remember you can pack the trailer so more weight is over the axles to minimize truck loading.
__________________
B and B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 11:13 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: West Jordan, UT
Posts: 829
I don't think you will see a tangible difference especially when coupled with WD and sway control. As long as you aren't fully loading the trailer and truck (which you indicated your weren't) either one will be fine. 50 lb tongue weight increase is not a lot in comparison between the two, go with the one you like more!
__________________
2018 XLR Nitro 36T15
2015 GMC 3500 6.6/Allison

Nights Camped (2017- 16) (2016-13) (2015-13)
SuicideSaints is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 11:25 AM   #6
Site Team
 
asquared's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 10,373
I think your difference is negligible enough here. Get the trailer you want and call it a day.
__________________
<a href=http://i62.tinypic.com/28rp645.jpg target=_blank>http://i62.tinypic.com/28rp645.jpg</a>
2014 Crew Cab Chevy Silverado 3500 4wd Duramax/Allison
2014 Sabre 34REQS-6
asquared is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 01:13 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
RooVader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 630
Geo, I want as much feedback as you are willing to give! That would be great if you could ask them what theirs came in at fully loaded. I am also trying to figure out how heavy the rails are and whether they account for part of that tongue weight.

When I checked the DK at the local dealership it was literally right on the published dry weight...I mean virtually right on. The only option I would add that it didn't have is a power tongue jack. I have no idea if the BD would be the same but that is where your friends could sure help!

I am a little confused by your frontal area comments. Are you saying that either one will have so much wind resistance that the extra 7 inches and being set back a couple feet will be negligible in difference...or the opposite? Sorry, just wasn't sure which you were arguing.

I totally understand your point about gross weight, but I absolutely know I will not be packing more regardless of which way I go. The primary difference is whether things go in the back of the truck under the tonneau, or in the storage hatches of the trailer. I am talking about kayak life jackets, dog bowls, etc...not firewood. The bikes would obviously add but they would be along maybe 10% of the time. I will not take more because of a higher GVW, I just won't...but I do see the fact that heavier operating gear factors in for sure.

I tend to camp pretty light and 90% is local, but I am trying to open the option of trips 3-5 hours away once per year. Family is not growing...or better not be! The kids are teens and if they join they always drive out on their own.

This trailer will outlast our truck if plans go the way I expect.

Great feedback, keep it coming.
__________________
RooVader is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 02:01 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
geotex1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by RooVader View Post
Geo, I want as much feedback as you are willing to give! That would be great if you could ask them what theirs came in at fully loaded. I am also trying to figure out how heavy the rails are and whether they account for part of that tongue weight.

When I checked the DK at the local dealership it was literally right on the published dry weight...I mean virtually right on. The only option I would add that it didn't have is a power tongue jack. I have no idea if the BD would be the same but that is where your friends could sure help!
Shot them an email for the info about "wet weight" off the dealer lot and now that it's geared for camping and what they can say about the rails.

Are you saying the dealership has a scale, or are you going by sticker and weight written on the A-frame with keel or china marker? If either of the latter, neither probably reflects the actual as-delivered weight. Many think the weights marked on the A-frame are more accurate, but I learned something from full-timer friends who do trailer transport that confirmed my suspicion never to rely on them. Further, it would be nice if the yellow stickers did reflect the as-built dry weight with certainty, but many have found with a trip to the certified scales that the weight is off.

I will share my personal experience picking up our HG last year. Dealer tech "helped" me put on my Equal-i-zer I brought out with us. I knew not to expect much, especially when he said they "set these up for this height at the coupler." I had already located where the closest CAT scale was to the dealer - 7 miles away! For giggles, I asked tech and service manager if they knew where the scale was - nope!!! Anyway, we left the dealer and I headed straight to the scale to get the Equal-i-zer better setup because I also have an auto-leveling suspension and it was a 5.5 hour tow home across PA. Our sticker weight was 787# less than the weight across the scale. Granted I now had two 30# propane bottles full, a deep cell, and oh, the "free" rv starter kit in the camper... LOL! Don't believe everything you read.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RooVader View Post
I am a little confused by your frontal area comments. Are you saying that either one will have so much wind resistance that the extra 7 inches and being set back a couple feet will be negligible in difference...or the opposite? Sorry, just wasn't sure which you were arguing.
The extra 7" and set-back would make negligible difference considering how the airstreams that come off the cab and duck down across your tonneau "slam" into the frontal area and then have to divert around. Different story if your TV was an SUV or pickup with cap-high topper, and another story yet if you had a topper that was tall in the tail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RooVader View Post
Family is not growing...or better not be! The kids are teens and if they join they always drive out on their own.
__________________
geotex1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 02:03 PM   #9
Phat Phrog Stunt Team
 
TURBS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 34,337
Average user added items are 1000#
__________________
TURBS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2015, 02:26 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
RooVader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 630
Wow, shows just how much I didn't know! I thought the yellow sticker reflected the trailer fully optioned as it leaves the factory? In other words, everything except battery and propane fill-up. Of course I knew this would not be the weight once I add things but I thought it included any options (power awnings, appliances, AC, etc.).

I definitely respect your analysis of wind drag so I appreciate your feedback. I know I am going to be pulling a huge wind drag so I definitely did not want to do anything that noticeably adds to that at all.

Thanks again for checking with your friends. There are so few owners of this model so it is invaluable.
__________________

__________________
RooVader is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
light

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




ForestRiverForums.com is not in any way associated with Forest River, Inc. or its associated RV manufacturing divisions.


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:49 PM.