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Old 04-30-2012, 12:08 PM   #31
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Amazing... For whatever reason, I've never come away from a car deal feeling ripped off. The dealer has to make money or he's not going to sell the vehicle, and I don't mind that. But to keep me from paying too much, I go in and first establish the price of the vehicle... then the trade-in-value negotiations begin... then the financing negotiations... they hate me. I always demand copies of the negotiated prices. If they won't give me a copy, I walk and wait for them to call... having made my own notes as to the prices involved. I usually take about 3 months to buy a car. My last TT buy took 5 weeks. However, I bought my last truck in a day, because my current employer has what is known as the "X" Plan with Ford. I couldn't have negotiated it down that far... so why try? The only negotiations were for my trade-in value. I was prepared with a NADA printout of it's value. They tried to "steal" it as described in the article, but that didn't work. I let them give me an extra $1,000- off because I financed through Ford Motor Credit. The loan cost me $110- because I had to keep it 90 days. On day 91, I paid it off... saving $890- of the original discount. I have always been prepared to walk on a deal and never look back. Dealers are not prepared for that. They are trained to make the sale some kind of emotional thing and to keep you from thinking rationally. These guys are truly slick, and you have to watch them very carefully. Take your time and ask questions, especially when you are signing the final sales/finance agreement. I've had the finance manager try to slip things into the contract on every car I ever bought. They don't like to be called down and forced to remove things that I didn't agree to. They don't like it when I take an hour to read and understand everything, either.
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Old 04-30-2012, 12:35 PM   #32
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The dealer has to make money or he's not going to sell the vehicle, and I don't mind that.
Believe me they make money on EVERY sale. I just don't want to be the "Fish" that pays for the salesman's Aspen Vacation.
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Old 04-30-2012, 01:26 PM   #33
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Confessions of a Car Salesman - Edmunds.com

NOW I know why the fleet manager "wants my truck"
He was just telling me how great the new 3500 Duramax was.
Sales isn't a 'dirty word' - I wish my experiences with insurance 'salespeople' were more like the link you have there - actually trying to sell you something.

Just reviewed my business insurance and found out my studio (sep building on my property) isn't covered by them - or my homeowners insurance. Which then canceled me because I have a business here...which the agent has known about since 2007...so i've essentially had no homeowners insurance for 5 years.

As for my cars...i use them for business so it gets weird - trailers are covered in motion (for at least liability). Unless of course, you have a regular car policy and a business only trailer...

I did find out that camping trailers are covered on my homeowners when parked here (for at least a nominal amount). Well, will be when my homeowners policy is back in force...

At least I understand car shopping!

As to my trailer...I believe we could have gotten it for $1000 or 1500 less IF we were willing to shop, travel, etc. Next time we may do that, but this time we're a first time buyer, had yet to get a tow vehicle so the free winter storage and free delivery to our house had some value to us.

I also liked being able to see and touch our specific unit before talking price, etc. It was the trailer at the show so it had been checked over and used a bit vs something just dropped on their lot and handed over a few days later. And should any issues arise (none have, been a year now) a local business in the same state is a lot easier to put pressure on than some mega dealer 2 states over.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:54 PM   #34
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Sales isn't a 'dirty word'.
You ARE kidding right?

Of course, it is a dirty word. For every honest, helpful, BROKE or FIRED salesman out there; there are a hundred crooked, evil, conniving, lying SoBs. The rep is well earned.

Don't get me started on Insurance salesman. How they sleep at night is beyond me. If you ever had one sell you a "Whole Life" policy or an "Annuity" you got ripped by Satan. If you ever had one sell you Whole Life on your child, it was by one of Satan's Spawn.

Did I mention "salesman" IS a dirty word.
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Old 04-30-2012, 03:03 PM   #35
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You ARE kidding right?

Of course, it is a dirty word. For every honest, helpful, BROKE or FIRED salesman out there; there are a hundred crooked, evil, conniving, lying SoBs. The rep is well earned.

Did I mention "salesman" IS a dirty word.
Honest Salesman/woman
Happliy Married
Friendly divorce
Cheap Mechanic
Military Inteligence
Jumbo Shrimp

its all the same difference
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Old 04-30-2012, 03:11 PM   #36
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I have to say, I've known some honest salespeople. Their reputations got them more business than they could handle... and they didn't have to do a lot do schmooooozing... They're actually a rare breed. But they actually DO exist.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:00 PM   #37
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You ARE kidding right?

Of course, it is a dirty word. For every honest, helpful, BROKE or FIRED salesman out there; there are a hundred crooked, evil, conniving, lying SoBs. The rep is well earned.

Don't get me started on Insurance salesman. How they sleep at night is beyond me. If you ever had one sell you a "Whole Life" policy or an "Annuity" you got ripped by Satan. If you ever had one sell you Whole Life on your child, it was by one of Satan's Spawn.

Did I mention "salesman" IS a dirty word.
Sounds as if you like the salesmen as much as I like Lippert frames.
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Old 05-01-2012, 12:35 AM   #38
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Watching a good salesman is great entertainment - it really is. Most suck at it. Many are just order takers and too many don't know their product or their industry.

A salesperson helps the buyer get what they want. That can be done without lying, cheating, stealing, etc.

You go into a part store to get a widget. A good salesperson will know you also need widget gasket or a special tool and bring that up - "do you have the left handed metric crescent wrench for that widget?" and you answer yes or no and they leave it at that.
If you don't know you needed it and make the 20 min trip home only to discover such you were not well served, were you?
So is his suggesting the wrench or gasket or lube or what have you 'sales' or 'service'?
A good salesperson asks questions - how do you plan to use your new car/trailer/widget? How many /often/where will you camp/tow/widge? etc.

Salespeople make people happy - when they do their job right.
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Old 05-01-2012, 07:24 AM   #39
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Most suck at it. Many are just order takers and too many don't know their product or their industry. A salesperson helps the buyer get what they want. That can be done without lying, cheating, stealing, etc.
Yep; I could not agree more. When you find one, they (like a good mechanic, or a good lawyer, or a good Shaman, or a good doctor, or a good dentist, or a good cop, or a good campground, etc) are a gem without price.

But there are so many in the other camp (trying to "give" as little as possible; while taking all that they can) that they give the profession as a whole a bad name. So is salesman a dirty word?

Yep.

Any chance that this will change any time soon?

Nope.

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:34 AM   #40
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When we were looking to buy a new trailer last year we went to the dealer in our area and looked at what we wanted,asked the price,he told us and we said we would think about it.He asked if we had a trade and he told us what he would give us for that.I felt it was extremely low so we said we would think about that as well.As we were leaving he said he would drop his price $2000.We went home and by the time we got there he had emailed asking what we had decided.
That day I found a small used car dealer that also sold trailers he brought up from the States.I emailed him,told him what we were looking for and within a day he sent me pics of one he could get.My wife didn't like the interior colour so he sent me some of another.We liked this one very much so we asked the price.He was $9250 cheaper than the original price of the local dealership.
Meanwhile the local dealer had emailed again and had dropped his price another $2000 dollars by me not responding.I finally responded and told him about the deal I was working on.He got quite nasty and said good luck trying to get it serviced in NS where it would be considered an American bought trailer.He later emailed and dropped his price another $2000 dollars.By this time he was only $3250 dollars away from the cheaper price and the lack of service thing was bothering my wife so I told the car dealer we would probably buy locally.Hesaid we would have no trouble getting service,so I told him we would let him know the next day.Meanwhile the local dealer called me and said he had good news that the owner had said to drop the price by another $2500 dollars.He said do we have a deal.This left him only $750 more.But by this time I was just feeling scammed because when we went looking in the first place he ha said "how can I make this deal happen"? I said by giving us the best price you can.Feeling the way I did I told him we were going to get the one from the car dealer.Well he got very angry and said we would have no warranty and that there service must be worth the extra $750 and blah blah blah so I said goodby and and called the other guy and ordered our trailer.
About a weak later our trailer arrived from Detroit and it was even nicer than the one we had been looking at here.I put our old trailer on Kijiji and got $4000 dollars more than what we were offered by the dealer here.So that was a pretax savings of $9250 on the purchase and $4000 more for our trailer.
Then about a weak later the local dealer emailed and asked if we were still in the market for a new trailer,that his boss had told him to do whatever it took to make this deal happen. I never responded.Why don't they just give you the best price they can at the start?
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