Purchasing a tow vehicle

[woodpidgeon]

I am getting very close to purchasing a new 5th wheel and having decided on a Rockwood 8285WS I am now looking for a tow vehicle, probably a Ford F250 or F350 SRW. My budget will allow a 2006/07. The problem is I have never bought a second hand truck and would like to know how the dealers operate. With a new vehicle there is plenty of information on the Internet regarding pricing and profit margins which one can (and have) used when dealing with a salesman, but what about 2nd hand? All I can find is K.B. Book but can find very little information regarding margins etc. Can anyone help me here, or can I expect to pay close to the asking price? There will be no trade in.

[Poppy94]

this is what I do on used vehicles. I look at the going rate for trade in and asking price or booked value as opposed to what they're asking for it. then I pretty much split the difference towards the lower end, what they might've given for it, and then slowly work up until I have split the difference. I tell them I don't have to buy but they have to sell and I won't be the one financing their next trip to Hawaii. then I ask to talk to the former owner and ask that person about the history of the vehicle. I could, on occasion, ask the owner what they gave him for it too, but I sometimes don't go that far. I mean the dealer has to make a little money on the deal, but I ain't gonna finance his bonus or a trip for him either. I help him put beans on the table and that's about it.

[prof_fate]

You have no way to know what the dealer has in a vehicle.
Some are procured via trade on a new or used vehicle. All are gone over in the shop and inspected and repaired. What did it need?

So a dealer 'pays' $5k figuring it will sell for $7k. Then finds out it needs brakes or ball joints or something and puts $800 in it. He has some forumula for knowing what he needs to avg per unit to make money, and the salesman, sales manager also get a portion of the margin/price on the truck.

Sometimes a dealer will take a trade at a too high price - to move a new unit and get a bonus perhaps, or they know its an in-demand model or it's a good customer or the customer is buying a couple of cars, etc.

Many used cars on lots come from auctions, and that is where the dealer will 'dump' the ones he has that haven't sold (usually in 3 months they'll turn them loose at an auction) and buy ones he thinks he can sell.

As a unit 'ages out' and approaches that 3 month point they'll be more likely to make $500 on it than lose money at an auction.

Now there is a wrinkle in the used car market of late. With teh economic downturn a few years ago new car sales tanked - so the supply of used cars has been affected - those 2006 that would have been traded in 09 were held onto - and there are few 09-11 used cars. That means 09-11 used vehicles are commanding higher than normal pricing - and this means today's cars are leasing a big cheaper (lease prices are based on new vs resale prices, you pay the diff).

[miknem1]

I try to find a vehicle i like on line then go to kbb.com and get a idea of what trade in is that way when you walk in you have a idea of your negotiating room is. Good luck

[jevanb]

my current truck was new from the factory but I have bought several used. I always go private party for mine. I stay away from the dealers when I get used because the price is always more. plenty of good, taken care of trucks on the market and you get to talk to the owner about what has been done to it.

[prof_fate]

Dealers (brand name dealers) only sell good vehicles, inspected ones. They have factory trained, experienced techs look them over and fix them.
I've never had a problem with a used car from a dealership. And they'll stand behind them if there is a problem in the first month or two.

Private party...they will lie (ommission more than outright lie) because they've no reason not to - no repuatation or repeat business to care about. Some are selling for a valid reason, but most are selling because there is something WRONG with the vehicle. They were told 'you'll need X soon and tis' $1000' so they sell it to you - and never mention the X that's about to fail.

EVERY SINGLE used car I've bought off a private party has had a failure of some kind within the first month of ownership.

[jevanb]

Originally Posted by prof_fate

Dealers (brand name dealers) only sell good vehicles, inspected ones. They have factory trained, experienced techs look them over and fix them.

pretty funny statement (dont take personally) most people trade them in because they are failing and they do not want to put more money into them.. I bought a used car last year from a HUGE dealer biggest piece of sh** tried to get some things fixed that I/she never used 30 days after and they said no and that car was $12k (wifes) . as a matter of fact I have bought so many vehicles from private parties and every owner was straight up and truthful

[bakken]

Originally Posted by jevanb

I have bought so many vehicles from private parties and every owner was straight up and truthful

Yup, way more honest than any dealer I have run across!

[woodpidgeon]

Thanks for your input folks, it was more the dealers I was interested in. I guess an independent inspection would help although no one has a crystal ball. I just wish I had the money to buy new

[ridersfan]

I'm a franchised new and used vehicle dealer. My advice... buy from a small franchised dealer. The independents and the huge metro city dealers don't rely on repeat business... they reply on impulse buyers and people shopping for the very cheapest price. A small center relies on repeat business and will look after you to earn your business again and again.

[prof_fate]

PP sells on their own for a few reasons - almost always related to greed. Me included. I was offered $1500 trade for my expedition and I have $8k in it...see, the PO had issues I"m sure he knew about and didn't tell me and I got the bill for it.

Sometimes people sell vehicles when they know there are issues upcoming. We all do this or we'd run vehicles to 1,000,000 miles.

I traded in my 93 taurus because it was beginning to rust and needed an alternator. I bought it from someone because it needed wheel bearings, a/c, a headlight and had 130k miles on it and they were 'tired of putting money into it'.

got a jeep wrangler -needed an engine and tires - and a lot of things the seller never mentioned (u joints, steering shaft, transmission work).
Bought a grand caravan and it was decent - dont' recall it needing much for a couple of years - seller had just put a transmission in it though.

My 08 subaru I got last fall off a dealer. I'm guessing the PO traded it in because it was in need of brakes and tires the dealer did this work (they showed my the workorders). It only had 47k miles on it..like new really. But had he tried to sell it privately would he have put $600 into it before selling it? Prolly not.

I sold a sable wagon years ago - the transmission light would come on at times because the trans plug to computer leaked at random intervals. Take it apart and spray some cleaner and ti was good to go for months. A dealer would have fixed this or had to fix it. As a private selling...hey, the light was off, I don't know what you're talking about mr buyer.

A private seller can plead ignorance - and be honest or lying, you can't tell or prove otherwise.
A dealer cannot.

No guarantee a dealer will sell a 'good' vehicle - chevy bought back a 6 month old S10 from me in 89 so even new can be bad - its just that they do inspect and fix them and stand behind them. At least around here. Now i'm talking new car dealers - the little lots on some corners are scarier than hell and to be avoided like the plague.

[prof_fate]

Originally Posted by ridersfan

I'm a franchised new and used vehicle dealer. My advice... buy from a small franchised dealer. The independents and the huge metro city dealers don't rely on repeat business... they reply on impulse buyers and people shopping for the very cheapest price. A small center relies on repeat business and will look after you to earn your business again and again.

Very good advice!

[extremebike]

Hi!

Go to Youtube and search Powerstrokehelp. Watch the videos you will find out tons of information. Buy the truck for your next trailer. Good luck.

[whj77372]

I live in SE Texas and Texas has the biggest market for pickup trucks. Almost one half of all registrations are pickup trucks. There are lots of then for sale, both used and new. Back in 2010/2011 when I was in the market for a TV for my fiver, I looked high and low, all over the Houston area and on the internet, Ebay, Crag's List etc for used diesel pickup trucks. What I found, they want way to much for used diesel pickup trucks with way to many miles. I do know that they will tell you that the engine will last for hundreds of miles, but it is just a pickup truck and it will require repairs just like like any vehicle.
I looked for seven months for a used 3/4 ton diesel pickup truck, any brand, Fords, Chev/GMAC and Dodges/Rams and what I got, a new 2011 F250 XLT, CC, diesel, longbed, RWD for $39,125 which I condider to be as good a deal as I could get. If you are willing to pay about half of that for used diesel pickups that are five years old with 135,000 miles on then, you can find them. I was not willing to pay that much for them. Good Luck

[kz08h5]

It's a crap shoot when buying used. Get a Carfax on the vehicle. At least you'll know about the major issues with wrecks, title issues, etc. One thing to consider is purchasing a warranty. My background is Reliability Engineering in the automotive industry. I will never purchase an extended warranty for anything I buy except for vehicles. The only reason I buy warranties for vehicles is the cost of repairs vs the cost of the warranty.

Look at KBB, NADA, and other internet sites like eBay to determine what he truck you are looking for sells for.

[jimmac28]

Go to this site, these guys know Fords and ask the same question.

Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums - Ford truck and SUV owners and enthusiasts Community And Information Source.

Then go to this site and you will be able to find the value of the truck you want.

New Car Prices and Used Car Book Values - NADAguides

[Sgt. Schultz]

Hello woodpidgeon Just curious are you looking to purchase in UK or NA?

[John4th]

I can remember back in the 90s when one could by a 2-year old car, with under 30K miles, for no more than half of what it sold for when new.

When we had to replace our '06 Jeep Liberty due to incurable electrical problems, we decided to go with a Honda CRV. This was December of 2011. The final asking price was $26K new. Loaded with leather, gadgets, heated seats, etc... An '09 just like it? $24K with 35K miles. Like most folks, we have to finance. 6% for used versus .9% (yes, .9%) for a new one with warranty.
Oh, shopping for Tundras. Trucks in general tend to hold their value. In the summer of 2011, I started looking around a little. There were 10 used current generation Tundras 2007 on up) within a 50 mile radius of Indianaplis. Found an '08, red, with 35K miles. Asking price? $30K. Forget it. Fast forward to March of 2012 when my wife got fed up with my Dodge Dakota repair bills. Found my current truck, new, for...$30K! Now it didn't quite have all the goodies the '08 had. But it was still the same drivetrain.

So, the point of my blabbering here is that lightly used vehicles with low mileage are not a good deal, especially if you have to finance. If you have excellent credit scores, those super-low interest rates make new vehicles more affordable than the lightly used ones. If you're looking to buy something with over 80K miles in it, I would plan to be able to pay cash AND have a reserve to make any repairs. I wouldn't want to make payments and have several repair bills.
Finally, I tend to avoid used because people in general do not gland good care of vehicles anymore. From hard driving habits to not doing maintenance. For what it's worth...

[John4th]

Correction: the Liberty was an '04. The Dakota was an '06.

[EricInColorado]

I hear what John III is saying when it comes to used toyota trucks. I have been shopping for a Sequoia. A Sequoia that was $45k new, is $40k after two years and 30,000 miles. Sheesh.