Designing a camper - sleep 6, under 20' length

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by dustman_stx

You know, now that I look that over, I think you're on to something here!!! I think you'd have to change from a Murphy bed to a tri-fold or similar, though. The Murphy bed sits behind the couch, and the couch therefore couldn't sit all the way back against the wall. BUT, I can't imagine someone can't design a couch that would turn into a bed that is comfortable utilizing maybe a 6" memory foam mattress. Maybe even a futon with a really great memory foam cushion???

Actually, I think Sunseeker is already onto something like that. bclemens mentioned that they're doing something like that with a new upcoming model. They already do something with a folding bed.


Here are his comments:

Originally Posted by bclemens

It is in fact a convertible bed. You can sleep on it and watch TV. And you can sit on it and watch TV.

I'm thinking that I agree with a lot of your thoughts:
1) I don't think I'm crazy about the converter being in the bathroom. I think I'd rather check that space to see if an on-demand waterheater could fit down there.

2) The converter could fit in the bottom of the ward across the back. The heater would be a challenge to find a spot. Maybe the passenger-side shelf beside of the murphy bed. I didn't check heaters for dimensions.

3) I think you're right about the cabinets above the sink.

4) I'm loving the idea of pull out storage for under the dinette accessible from the outside. I figured the same would happen for the passenger side shelf beside of the murphy bed.

5) I don't know how slides and axles work out. I've been looking at campers at campgrounds and it seems like it's not overly uncommon.

6) GVWR is generally determined by the axle rating + 11-15% for tongue weight. So, to achieve what you're after, you'd have to put bigger axles and report a lower GVWR than is typical. I'd want to have decent cargo carrying capacity (1,200-1,500 pounds after "standard" options).

7) I haven't put much thought into water tanks especially with the 2 slides.

8) Brand name tires are required.

[Semperfi24]

It might not be cost effective, and there also may be laws against it, lol, but what about building your own? If you are simply using it for the purpose of a tent, it doesnt have to be spruced up like an rv would be. If you can get your hands on an enclosed trailer, like you see landscapers use (as long as it is tall enough for you to stand inside), you could build a bathroom and kitchen (kitchen is optional if you want to just cook outside), and then have a big open space for bunks (they could just fold up when not in use) or just leave the floor open and everyone gets a personal air mattress for sleeping. It would take some work to get it just right, but it could certainly be done. But like I said, would it be legal, and would you be able to stand up in it, etc?

[ependydad]

I'm not against building something. I know people do it all of the time with tear-drop trailers and whatnot. I've explored the idea of picking up a frame off of Craigslist through the idea of just having a frame built. My father-in-law has access to all sorts of welding equipment and materials.

I don't expect cost-wise for it to be any cheaper and, in fact, I'd expect it to cost more to custom build something myself.

Is it worth it, is the question?

BUT- I'm really interested in input for the floorplan that I've proposed and how realistic it is?

[Semperfi24]

The answer of is it worth it would probably be the biggest constraint. Some might think it is worth it, some might think if all thing are equal, the easy thing is to buy one that is already made for me, lol.

I hope you find what you are looking for, or get the answer that your particular desires are or arent possible with the size limit of your storage facility. Probably a small market for really small trailers with large sleeping capacity, but if there is enough people looking for it, someone will offer it, lol

I dont remember precisely, but there is a line of trailers that are designed for ice fishing. They may be called "ice house"? Perhaps that style might suit your needs. Having a small box with a good amount of sleeping space (unless people ice fish alone?)

[ependydad]

Semperfi24- the is it worth it is the crux of build vs. buy and comes up in any discussion. A while back I built a pair of kayaks because with 2, it was more cost effective than buying them. With that, I had expenditures of tools and whatnot that I included in the kayak cost. Had I just built one, it was a ridiculously expensive kayak. Once I got the second one built, the cost evened out and worked in my favor. Unfortunately, with a camper build- I wouldn't have the luxury of a second one to amortize the costs.

I feel like there is some market for it as there are some small campers already with many of the features baked into them. The Vibe is probably the best example of it. But, the Vibe's weights reflect that the average family would be pulling this with less than a 3/4-ton truck (which is the arena that I feel like this design would put it into). I think the 2 biggest killers to marketability are it's small size and the weight for the design. I feel like it's going to be pretty heavy overall with the dual slides and can be pretty tongue heavy with the fridge, murphy bed, propane tanks, and battery bank.

Interesting idea about the ice houses. I'll google them up.

I'm just now sort of fascinated by the concept of trailer design. I've already PM'd bclemens to pick his brain about how the process works now.

[OldCoot]

The El Camino camper I built would sleep 4 on beds and one on an air mattress in the floor. Wasn't all that comfy, but at least we all slept.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

The El Camino camper I built would sleep 4 on beds and one on an air mattress in the floor. Wasn't all that comfy, but at least we all slept.

I'm trying to figure out if I were to approach something like this if I would go for an all-wood construction or if I'd try and adopt some current manufacturing methods like aluminum frame construction. I've got a few family and friends who can weld.

I figure the walls would be the metal siding like the Pumas have. That way there isn't any fiberglassing or anything like that.

Still wonder about actual appliances, tanks, and how tall this thing would have to be to all work out. Would you build it like a fifth wheel where it's wholly above the axles (tanks and all that jazz below the floor)? Or does that become a center of gravity nightmare?

[OldCoot]

I would build it on a 5er steel I beam frame with 1-1/2" sq. alum tube framework with closed cell foam insulation.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

I would build it on a 5er steel I beam frame with 1-1/2" sq. alum tube framework with closed cell foam insulation.

As a fiver? Or as a TT?

[IlliniJoe]

Why not purchase an enclosed cargo trailer and build what you want.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by IlliniJoe

Why not purchase an enclosed cargo trailer and build what you want.

I think that would be difficult with slides an possibly not as tall as I'd need.

[IlliniJoe]

Yeah, slides would be difficult, but they do sell some with an 8' overhead. You could put some queen size bunk beds in and then a couch that would convert into bunk beds. Cabinets can be purchased from Lowes, Homedepot, etc.... The sky's the limit with designs options. Just no slides.. What ever you do go with, please keep us all updated on your progress should you go with the DIY route.

[ependydad]

We'll see. I'd love to see this design come to fruition, but it's "ambitious" so to speak.

[Sharon455]

There are some very short toy haulers with the double bunks at the back of the garage. The biggest downside for us was the lack of storage, but it always worked out. Our Stealth (which is 23' with bumper and tongue) came with a full bed up front, and the optional bunks, which we didn't get. Ours didn't have slides, but some do. You might look around and find one that you could modify to meet your needs.
The plus is a really big door/ramp to quickly load/unload without squeezing through entry door.

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by ependydad

As a fiver? Or as a TT?

I would build it on a 5er steel I beam frame...

With shocks on torsion axles and Reese Sidewinder hitch.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

I would build it on a 5er steel I beam frame...

With shocks on torsion axles and Reese Sidewinder hitch.

I agree on the shocks. I don't know the difference between leaf springs and torsion axles. Why are the torsion axles better? Or even they vs. something like the walking axles that I have (EquaFlex suspension).

The problem, as a fifth wheel, it messes with my whole design. :-)