Frame Flexing on 5th Wheels with Lippert Frames

[rockwood06]

Has anyone noticed any separation around the front end at the pin box. I am hearing that all RV Manufactures are having issues with Lippert frames on 5th wheels.
Friends of ours have a new 2013 Open Range Roamar and it seems to be showing signs of frame issues. Our friends went on to and Open Range Forum and found out that this issue has been popping up a lot within the past year.
And one person on there said they knew of a Forest River 5th wheel that is in the group.
The problems are cracks on the out side finished walls, caulk cracking along seams along with separation in these areas, and one case that was mention the pin box all but came apart, there was just one piece of frame that was holding the pin box in place but it did shift sideways.
The flexing is causing the frames to break at the welds. Maybe there is too much flex due to the thin framing material......So does any know?

[ependydad]

Yes, there are frames made by Lippert that have had failures.

Yes, most manufacturers use Lippert frames.

[BarryD0706]

There are a gigantic number of 5er owners who are NOT having this problem. I'm one of them.

[TURBS]

ILL second barry!

[DDC]

Originally Posted by BarryD0706

There are a gigantic number of 5er owners who are NOT having this problem. I'm one of them.

Not much of an answer to the OP's question!

[BarryD0706]

It's an answer to his statement: "I am hearing that all RV Manufactures are having issues with Lippert frames on 5th wheels."

Seems clear enough to me. The statement is false.

[Witch Doctor]

Originally Posted by BarryD0706

It's an answer to his statement: "I am hearing that all RV Manufactures are having issues with Lippert frames on 5th wheels."

Seems clear enough to me. The statement is false.

I have not heard that except for the wildcat that was about 5 years old. I have some pictures of the frame construction with showing the pin box and how it is made and surrounded with channel iron and gussets. For some reason I can't upload right now. I'll try again later.

[camper1999]

Originally Posted by BarryD0706

There are a gigantic number of 5er owners who are NOT having this problem. I'm one of them.

X2

[DDC]

To the OP type this into the search box on this page " Cracks in 5th wheel pin box to frame" you will see quite a number of people have problems and you really are not the only one.

[Witch Doctor]

Originally Posted by gljurczyk

I have not heard that except for the wildcat that was about 5 years old. I have some pictures of the frame construction with showing the pin box and how it is made and surrounded with channel iron and gussets. For some reason I can't upload right now. I'll try again later.

lets see if this will work

[TURBS]

A few more that I took







Turbs

[rockwood06]

Thank you all for your replies. I am finding out that the problems are on the heavy weight 5th wheels, I myself have a light but not sure if they are effected.
It's not just the Open Range but I have heard of Forest River, and Montana as well, not sure of the models on the last two.
I have a two year warranty and the first year is up but I will keep an eye on things, agains thanks.

[B47]

Just a thought/suggestion, but has anyone thought about setting up a mobile UltraSonic or Eddy Current lab and offer the service to FW and TT owners?

Whether your unit has or is showing cracks or an unit owner wants piece of mind, this might be a nice side line business - I'm certain some of you could learn how to perform UltraSonic or EC inspections or perhaps already know how to do it or do it already.

Just a thought and you shouldn't have to worry about some old noisy FAA inspector coming around asking to see your certification certificates.

[rockwood06]

Originally Posted by B47

Just a thought/suggestion, but has anyone thought about setting up a mobile UltraSonic or Eddy Current lab and offer the service to FW and TT owners?

Whether your unit has or is showing cracks or an unit owner wants piece of mind, this might be a nice side line business - I'm certain some of you could learn how to perform UltraSonic or EC inspections or perhaps already know how to do it or do it already.

Just a thought and you shouldn't have to worry about some old noisy FAA inspector coming around asking to see your certification certificates.

B47 that is a great idea. Eddy Current is how we test and check the integrity of the tubes in our chillers, if there is a crack in the tube and/or at the tube sheet we know it right a way.
On some jobs x-rays of weld joint are part of quality control and are required as part of the inspection.
Correct me if I am wrong but a big part of RV problems are lack of regulations, I have heard this from a few of the Tech's that work in the RV shops.

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by rockwood06

B47 that is a great idea. Eddy Current is how we test and check the integrity of the tubes in our chillers, if there is a crack in the tube and/or at the tube sheet we know it right a way.
On some jobs x-rays of weld joint are part of quality control and are required as part of the inspection.
Correct me if I am wrong but a big part of RV problems are lack of regulations, I have heard this from a few of the Tech's that work in the RV shops.

As B47 posted, it would be a side line business, but it is certainly not practical on a production line operation such as rv's. It is a diagnostic tool like x-ray and magnafluxing.

[B47]

Originally Posted by rockwood06

B47 that is a great idea. Eddy Current is how we test and check the integrity of the tubes in our chillers, if there is a crack in the tube and/or at the tube sheet we know it right a way.
On some jobs x-rays of weld joint are part of quality control and are required as part of the inspection.
Correct me if I am wrong but a big part of RV problems are lack of regulations, I have heard this from a few of the Tech's that work in the RV shops.

Thanks - as far as lack of regulations being a big part of RV problems, I'm not speaking for anyone else, but IMO the lack of Quality Control and Quality Assurance, if done in the manner that the FAA requires the U.S. Airlines and repair facilities to do it ( which is the background that I refer to), would go a long way in preventing a lot of RV problems we hear about here.

It would be nice IMO if the RV industry and manufacturers would adapt some sort of industry QC and QA standards ( some might say they already have such standards,but if they do, it's not working as good as it should).

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by B47

Thanks - as far as lack of regulations being a big part of RV problems, I'm not speaking for anyone else, but IMO the lack of Quality Control and Quality Assurance, if done in the manner that the FAA requires the U.S. Airlines and repair facilities to do it ( which is the background that I refer to), would go a long way in preventing a lot of RV problems we hear about here.

It would be nice IMO if the RV industry and manufacturers would adapt some sort of industry QC and QA standards ( some might say they already have such standards,but if they do, it's not working as good as it should).

Keep in mind, if they had the same regulations as required for airlines, none of us, or very few could afford them.

[B47]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

As B47 posted, it would be a side line business, but it is certainly not practical on a production line operation such as rv's. It is a diagnostic tool like x-ray and magnafluxing.

Don't know why it couldn't be used in RV production. After all, eddy current and ultrasonic are both Non Destructive Inspection processes and we all know what Non Destructive means.

Not sure, but I bet Boeing uses many types of NDI as part of their QC and QA programs.

[B47]

Originally Posted by OldCoot

Keep in mind, if they had the same regulations as required for airlines, none of us, or very few could afford them.

A valid agreement that is used all the time. However for the purpose of this discussion,do you think that the RV owner that discovers cracks in his FW king pin area is not wondering why the manufacturer is using such cheap materials in his product?

[OldCoot]

Originally Posted by B47

Don't know why it couldn't be used in RV production. After all, eddy current and ultrasonic are both Non Destructive Inspection processes and we all know what Non Destructive means.

Not sure, but I bet Boeing uses many types of NDI as part of their QC and QA programs.

Boeing doesn't produce 37 frames in 8 hrs either. I am very familiar with the both tests and they are not practical in rv production methods and are far too expensive time wise.