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Old 04-13-2015, 09:33 AM   #91
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Sorry but no. A fulcrum is indeed all it is. The simple mechanics of the suspension do nothing to counteract that and send weight forward. This has been discussed ad nausem on RV forums everywhere and when people take the time to get weighed at a CAT scale the results are always the same. The tongue gets lighter when the garage is loaded. My last rig went from 3k pinweight to 2400 with 2k in the garage. The ratio will vary from trailer to trailer but will never reverse itself....

The only toy haulers that get heavier in the front when loaded at ones with a front garage or the ones with an open deck up front.
Exactly, weight behind the axle(s) is entirely on the axle(s), but acts to move some of the weight from the tongue to the axles. Gravity, you can trust it.

From what I can tell... going by the measurement spring eye front to spring eye rear... OR.... the center of the axle pair is the same, for our purposes. The expanse between axle mounts and contraptions does spread the weight over a longer portion of the frame. But, no matter there is a mathematical center or fulcrum point. If they share the same weigh, or nearly the same weight is what we shall assume until proven wrong. The only thing(s) that could cause one axle to carry more weight than the other is weaker spring or the effective height from ground to spring eyes are not the same. You might remember mine was different by weight, by what 80 lbs. I don't remember and too lazy to look. But, the scales weren't perfect either.

Consider: Three guys walk into bar... oops wrong story... So, you have three guys carrying a boat upside down, over their heads. One is very strong so he takes the bow end and the other two being weaker by a considerable margin take a position near the stern; one in front of the other hands side to side on the gunwales. If one of those two at the stern slacks off intentially or one is considerably shorter than the other, he will be carrying less weight. The stronger or taller guy will carry his share and more; by looking you can't really tell. Other than the knowing smile the short guy flashes at you. Don't assume you know why he is smiling, but lets assume honorable intent.

I plan to weigh when on the road next time in about a week or less. This will be with a loaded for bear, bike, et al.
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Old 04-13-2015, 12:01 PM   #92
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Thanks again for the info everyone, I hop I was notbeing a pain, I believe with the experience on here I would get aclear understanding of loading my camper, it had look likeI was pushing things to the limit with my 1400# UTV and a tank of gas backthere, but dry camping I would like to bring as much as I am able to soI am not running back into town for water or fuel,
WolfWhistle
northstar1960
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PlayHarder
thanks for taking the time here, and helping me out. I work in south Mexico and I will be home in a few weeks, but I am going to do the same thing WolfWhistle is and load it up like I would need it and find a Cat scale and see what I can and cant have on board.
Thanks again
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Old 04-13-2015, 12:07 PM   #93
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Not a pain at all! Glad we could help. We're all here to help each other...
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Old 04-13-2015, 12:56 PM   #94
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I’ve read this whole thread and sometimes it made my head hurt, but I am convinced I’m in the right place to ask a related question about tongue weight. It’s probably obvious to most in this thread, but not so much to me. I bought a new 27 HFS and I want to get a baseline empty weight and TW to compare against the same weights once the TH is loaded. My thought was to go to the scales and weigh my TV by itself. Then I’d hitch up the TH and get another weight of the TV and the TH together. Finally I would pull forward so that the TV is off the scales and get a weight of the TH while it is hitched to the TV. With those 3 weights and a little math, I think that will allow me to determine the empty weight of the TH and the TW. I have a WDH. My question is this…if the WDH is hooked up, do I get a true and accurate tongue weight or do I need to disengage the WDH before I move the TV off the scales for the last measurement. My understanding is that the WDH “distributes” some of the tongue weight to the front axle of the TV and the axles of the TH. It would seem to me that any weights with the WDH engaged would not provide a true value of the TW. Can anybody confirm how to get an accurate TW by using public scales? Thank you.
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:50 PM   #95
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With the trailer sitting level with it unhooked from your tow vehicle... the rear axle set on one scale and the tongue on another scale and you have it that way. You just sit tongue on a scale... Is another way. I would get TV alone and hooked all three axles (trailer counts as one) and do the math.
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Old 04-13-2015, 02:54 PM   #96
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Thanks WW. I was trying not to have to unhook the TH once on the scales, but that may be the only way. I'm not sure the nearby scale has more than one section, although it should given it's at a moving and storage company. If it does, your solution will work. If it doesn't, I'll have to come up with plan B. Given all the concerns about TWs, garage loads, and axle ratings, it may be worth buying a tongue weight scale.
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Old 04-14-2015, 08:25 AM   #97
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Thanks WW. I was trying not to have to unhook the TH once on the scales, but that may be the only way. I'm not sure the nearby scale has more than one section, although it should given it's at a moving and storage company. If it does, your solution will work. If it doesn't, I'll have to come up with plan B. Given all the concerns about TWs, garage loads, and axle ratings, it may be worth buying a tongue weight scale.
I agree, a trucker doesn't want to wait for us peon RVers, and you don't have to tie up the scale hooking and unhooking.

I also don't know if you want to weigh on a 3 section CAT scale or the single platform, like you would find at a county dump. Ideally, when weighing the rig should be loaded like it will be when traveling, driver, passenger, and gear. I have a "Guess-tomater" and can predict adding weight to the trailer later, but the best way is to load 'er up.

If it is a single platform (to da dump, to da dump, etc, etc) do it this way:

A- Truck and trailer hooked up, but with WDH disconnected (place bars on the trailer tongue so they are weighed) Pull truck onto scale with both axles of the truck on the scale (trailer OFF the scale) get a copy or write down the weight. (A)

Pull off the scale, chock the trailer tires, and unhook from the trailer.

B- Pull back onto the scale with just the truck; get a copy or write down the weight (B)

The math is: A-B=TW (tongue weight)

I would weight the trailer by itself (tongue and axles all on scale) on the single platform scale so I would know the TWR. Where total trailer weight / TW = TWR

If you have access to a CAT - three platform scale you get this information plus more quickly, but same idea.
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Old 04-15-2015, 09:55 PM   #98
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Thanks again, WW. That's what I plan on doing...twice. Once with the TH empty and then another time with it and the Harley loaded.
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:57 AM   #99
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I'm fixin' to load the Trumpet, add some water, add some more stuff, forget to add some stuff, and then head to the Winn Dixie parking lot (with tools) and set up my hitch anew. Old hitch, but things have changed, so I want to be sure its good to go and I am going soon. A few days volunteering at Lake Yale, then Leesburg bike rally. Then, absolutely not sure, I have today to decide where I will be in May-June.
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Old 04-16-2015, 09:00 AM   #100
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I miss our 27HFS that we camped with 20 times in 24 months and traveled 10,000 trouble free miles with.

I honestly never weighted ours, but I knew I was likely exceeding the weight limits with 1500lbs in the garage.(4 quads standing up, 660, 250, and two 90s).

It doesn't surprise me how heavy yours is weighting.

the only thing I kept a close eye on with ours was a very slight tire rub. When properly inflated I put chalk on the in side frame/body to see if the tire rubbed and it didnt. I assume it just rubbed when I pulled it home from the dealer underinflated.

Just curious if your pulling this with a half ton? I pulled mine once with a half ton and it made me nervous. Our regular tow vehicle was an Excursion with F250 spring and shock upgrades and a F350 rear swaybar. It pulled with more confidently than my experience with a half ton truck.

enjoy it, I have found more issues with my new class c than I ever had with the hfs.
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