How many are having to make return trips to dealer for repairs to their Crusader

[RV Guy]

First of all, it's our most sincere apologies to anyone who is not having a fantastic experience with their Prime Time product. If you're having warranty issues we want to help. Don't hesitate to contact our customer service department at Prime Time Manufacturing, Manufacturers of travel trailers and fifth wheels if we can be of assistance. I can promise you that we respond pretty quickly on any contact made. And yes, at times, we drop the ball on follow-up. If you've fallen into that category, again, we apologize - give us a call back - we still want to help.

I guess I've stood on the sidelines long enough reading posts by folks with an apparent ax to grind. This non-sense is why Forums like this don't see more particpation by factory personnel.

Regarding our committment to quality, I KNOW Prime Time builds a great product. Ironically, I'm in Vegas this week receiving our 2nd consecutive DSI Quality Award. This award is presented from the Recreational Vehicle Dealers of America - the very people who service and sell RVs to retail consumers. Yesterday I saw the results of thousands of DEALER surveys ranking their manufacturers on Quality. Prime Time rates at the very top of all the results and Crusader is our highest rated product. BTW, many of the brands that seem to be so vehemently defended on this Forum are great products, but apparently not rated high enough by dealers to join us on stage tonight for the award.

There are several examples of defects in this thread based on products that we purchase from a vendor. As a manufacturer, we try to select our vendors carefully since the quality of their components becomes a reflection on us. We have technicians from many of our major suppliers perform regular installation audits (items like A/C, Awnings, Refrigerators, etc) on us to make sure we are doing it to their specifications. We test everything multiple times during the manufacturing process and the dealers will do the same during their PDI. I'm not sure how we can completely prevent malfunctions of 3rd party electronics or mechanical items that are installed by us. However, we monitor those warranties closely looking for issues that we can resolve or for vendors who need to be eliminated.

However, most quality issues are ours to own. You will never find us suggesting we build a perfect product. We make lots of mistakes that make you wonder, "what were we thinking"? But, I'm confident that we do a better job day-in and day-out than our competition with quality. Then when we do fall short, we have a great Customer Service department that's ready to pick us up. As someone mentioned, we hope you never have a need for their service, but if you do, we are pretty good.

Usually, I like to sit these conversations out as I think dialogue both positive and negative is good. We take our shortcomings seriously as it helps us to learn and get better. But, sometimes you have to take a stand. Hope I'm not offending most of you.

To quote from an earlier post - "Let the sparks fly"

PTM

[padave65]

Originally Posted by southernsky

I have a 2012 Crusader 320RLT that I bought in 7/11. I have taken 4 trips of 1500 mls or more and every time I came back home I had to take my trailer back to the dealer.
First trip to the dealer the sound bar had to be reattached because it fell out. The black tank flush had to be repaired because of major leak in basement compartment. Lost gray water valve handle.
Second trip to dealer had to replace Microwave because glass fogged up. Lost black water and another gray water handle.
Third and forth time is was more nick nack problems.
Taking a trip around the end of Oct. and wonder if I'm going to have to visit the dealer again.
How many more happy Crusader owners are on first name bassis with you RV service department?

To be honest, most of these items, less the leak, are tikey tack or is not a reflection on PT. In fact, the valve handles could be attributed to you. After I lost one, I would check to see that the handles are tight. (wind may actually screw them loose....)Microwave...PT does not manufacture the microwaves....You need to look at other forums and find places where new units are delaminating, cracked fiberglass, bent frames, etc....Your crusader will be fine in 4 years. I agree with GRhodes, after this ticky tack stuff is fixed, you will be happy...
I am a Lacrosse owner but I try to be on a first name basis with my service person after one trip...you tend to get better service if you are nice....you catch more flies with sugar than vinegar.

[grhodes50]

Great post RV Guy.
For whatever post I may have made to add to the negative non-sense, I appologize. This forum is, and has always been, for fellow FR owners to help and support each other. We all need to keep this in mind.

JMHO, but PT owners have posted several threads concerning problems with PT's products, mostly 3rd party vendor issues. I think this is largely due to the fact that RV Guy participates on this forum on a regular basis. He is always there for any of us who may have any questions or concerns. We PT owners recognize this privilage and we do take advantage of it, hence the numerous post about PT issues.

Congrats to Prime Time on the award.
I hope your enjoying your trip to Vegas.

[frankm]

Originally Posted by RV Guy

First of all, it's our most sincere apologies to anyone who is not having a fantastic experience with their Prime Time product. If you're having warranty issues we want to help. Don't hesitate to contact our customer service department at Prime Time Manufacturing, Manufacturers of travel trailers and fifth wheels if we can be of assistance. I can promise you that we respond pretty quickly on any contact made. And yes, at times, we drop the ball on follow-up. If you've fallen into that category, again, we apologize - give us a call back - we still want to help.

I guess I've stood on the sidelines long enough reading posts by folks with an apparent ax to grind. This non-sense is why Forums like this don't see more particpation by factory personnel.

Regarding our committment to quality, I KNOW Prime Time builds a great product. Ironically, I'm in Vegas this week receiving our 2nd consecutive DSI Quality Award. This award is presented from the Recreational Vehicle Dealers of America - the very people who service and sell RVs to retail consumers. Yesterday I saw the results of thousands of DEALER surveys ranking their manufacturers on Quality. Prime Time rates at the very top of all the results and Crusader is our highest rated product. BTW, many of the brands that seem to be so vehemently defended on this Forum are great products, but apparently not rated high enough by dealers to join us on stage tonight for the award.

There are several examples of defects in this thread based on products that we purchase from a vendor. As a manufacturer, we try to select our vendors carefully since the quality of their components becomes a reflection on us. We have technicians from many of our major suppliers perform regular installation audits (items like A/C, Awnings, Refrigerators, etc) on us to make sure we are doing it to their specifications. We test everything multiple times during the manufacturing process and the dealers will do the same during their PDI. I'm not sure how we can completely prevent malfunctions of 3rd party electronics or mechanical items that are installed by us. However, we monitor those warranties closely looking for issues that we can resolve or for vendors who need to be eliminated.

However, most quality issues are ours to own. You will never find us suggesting we build a perfect product. We make lots of mistakes that make you wonder, "what were we thinking"? But, I'm confident that we do a better job day-in and day-out than our competition with quality. Then when we do fall short, we have a great Customer Service department that's ready to pick us up. As someone mentioned, we hope you never have a need for their service, but if you do, we are pretty good.

Usually, I like to sit these conversations out as I think dialogue both positive and negative is good. We take our shortcomings seriously as it helps us to learn and get better. But, sometimes you have to take a stand. Hope I'm not offending most of you.

To quote from an earlier post - "Let the sparks fly"

PTM

RV Guy, first of all thank you for your participation in this forum. I believe that you offer good advice and insight into the RV construction business not only to PT owners but to all of us as well.

As it has been stated by just about everyone (myself included) that has participated in the PT vs FR discussions your post alludes to there is NO DOUBT in anyone’s mind that PT makes a good product. One that will last years and provide their owners full enjoyment. There is also NO DOUBT, by the accounts of PT owners, that PT Customer Service is a notch above many customer service centers in the RV business. Again, there hasn’t been any argument against that.

So what am I, a non-PT owner, peeved about? Well, I am a little tired of the constant and incessant “my PT is better that your (fill in the blank) FR trailer. When you have members hurrahing the addition of each new PT owner (BTW, are these folks supposed to use that number when calling customer service?) but when the same member has a problem they are nowhere to be found. When a new member to the forum posts a question about a leaky valve and the first response is “well my PT valves don’t leak”. When you have a self-proclaimed non-expert go on to tell us how after “extensive research” he has determined the PT manufacturing process to be so much superior to others that only an idiot would purchase them, yet when questioned about his so called extensive research there is no answer. When Mr. PT Guy (sorry but it is not you RV Guy) chastises us for straying from a thread topic but says nothing when a reply is PT-favorable. When a thread discusses an apparent shortcoming on a FR product they quickly point out how the PT does not suffer from the same flaw, but the same folks fall silent when a PT owner discovers that he has no roof-ladder option. When someone with no knowledge to anyone’s financial situation or needs states that “dollar for dollar” PT is a better buy. When an issue with a PT is nothing more than a call to customer service yet a similar issue with a FR is a calamity. These are all examples of what has been going on lately.

Yet you don’t see anyone with a Rockwood tell someone with a Flagstaff that their trailer sucks, or someone happy with their purchase of a Windjammer be told that they should have purchased Surveyor. I think by now you get the idea. We all own a Forest River product and are here to help each other out.

This forum is of great help to many of us out here with limited knowledge and resources, so I'm all for keeping it that way!

I may have fallen on my own sword by spelling this out, if so so be it.

PS. One comment I want to make regarding the dealer survey. I too used to fill out surveys like that and the make/brand/model that contributed the most to our bottom line ALWAYS got the highest rating.

[M109Rrider]

I wouldn't defend any else's comments IRT superior construction, quality etc.. since I have no first experience in RV manufacturing. But the "your trailer is broke and mine doesn't do that" most certainly does happen throughout ALL the other FR lines. The Prime Time Member thing was something Gary and I came up after we got our own secton. At the time there was only about 5 members and we were trying to find more owners. Don't know why this upsets you...but....whatever.

[Rugged Brown]

I think it is commendable that a company representative is part of this forum and I would like to see more reps here. I think this is an indication that the company cares about the product and is open to suggestions for improvement. A great QA initiative. Hats off to RVGUY, SabreSam and others who may have identified themselves here. I think your involvement in these forums bode well for your company. Those who aren't here give me an impression that they may have something to hide or not open to suggestions for improvement or critiques. My comments where never intended to take any strips off one product or build up another. I was merely making an observation. It is very apparent that PTM has a very good customer service dept. I have heard about it countless times. Again an observation and my opinion, but if a customer service dep is inundated, that tells me something about the product. I have owned and used my unit since April and have used it 29 nights and travelled over 5000 kilometres without an issue that requires dealer or factory intervention. I maybe a lucky one. The poster who initiated this thread was giving his experience with his unit and as a fellow camper to prospective other campers who may be in the market for new, I just wanted to inform them about my observations. I make no apology for that. I may have incited some feedback with my comment "let the sparkes fly". This was not intended to be malicious, but rather to invoke discussion. Moderators on this forum have scolded me for my comments. If big brother delete or modify our posts, this forum no longer becomes impartial for individuals and will become corporate controlled. Happy Camping to all. I can only hope to provide 1/4 of the benefits I have gained from all the other very smart posters.

[grhodes50]

Great post Rugged Brown.
Peace?

frankm.
I'm guessing I'm PT Guy?
Before I make a post I try to answer a few questions.
Do have have a facted based answer that will help the OP?
Has the OP's questioned been answered and my post will only repeat what has been said?
Will my answer be taken as offensive?

I'll admit that I haven't always stuck to those self impossed guide lines. For that I'l apologize to you and anyone else I may have offended.

I truly do not recall ever targeting a specific FR brand in a negative manner, except for one that I previously owned and I made sure to point out my negativity was aimed towards that particular tt and not the brand or FR. I also want to point out that my positive PT post in no way means a negative towards any other brand.

I have tried to keep my post PT positive since I own one, however I have posted issues I have experienced with my tt. Honestly, I just haven't had very many.

I have helped other PT owners and owners of other FR brands on the forum as well. I have several "Thanks" in my cp user panel to back that up.

As for the "How many of us" thread. As M109Rrider explained, that started off as a search for more PT owners. It has sinced turned into a "welcome wagon" for new PT forum members. Just tryin' to make them feel welcome to the forum and help add to the excitment of a new purchase.

I'll also offer the peace branch to you as well.

[M109Rrider]

I'll buy the first round Even you Crocus

[southernsky]

Thank you Rugged Brown, great comment. I was expressing my frusration with the trips back and forth to the dealer. Granted some problems were with third party product but also problems in the construction of the Crusader. I could have done some of the repairs myself and yes I should have checked my valve handles, it seems to me during the construction lock tight could be used. I didn't buy a new trailer to do repairs, I would have kept my old Seirra for that. Unlike some people that money is no object, I'm retired now and worked hard for my money and expect a good product for what I pay for.
This all could be new trailer bugs (hopefully) and all will be good soon.
We are heading out at the end of the month for a 1200 mile round trip to the Smokies and I'm being optimistic that I won't have to go back to the dealer when I get home.
The factory guys, didn't mean to step on your toes but like I said when I was in the work force my company as I took pride in our job and product.
Strive for the best and work hard at it.
Now lets end this thread and play nice......

[Rugged Brown]

[QUOTE=grhodes50;137343]Great post Rugged Brown.
Peace?



Peace brother.

[Koodog]

Great thread! Thanks to all whom have contributed. Many good points made. Often times I forget that problems also offer opportunity. Some days I just don't care to have problems, nor wish to share in opportunity.

[frankm]

Ok then so let's

RIP Steve J.

[KAB449]

Grhodes50 & RV Guy: Please continue your contribution to this forum as in the past. Your insights are valuable and help the participants of this forum.

[RV Guy]

KAB449 - thanks for the encouragement. I wasn't going anywhere anyway.

I hope Gary continues to be an active participant, too. Obviously, PTM likes the support, but I personally think his enthusiasm for life, camping, family and yes, Prime Time is contagious and brings smiles to many of the particpants on this forum. To me, it's the essence of our lifestyle and the number one benefit of involvement in this Forum.

[Bill_C]

Originally Posted by southernsky

I have a 2012 Crusader 320RLT that I bought in 7/11. I have taken 4 trips of 1500 mls or more and every time I came back home I had to take my trailer back to the dealer.
First trip to the dealer the sound bar had to be reattached because it fell out. The black tank flush had to be repaired because of major leak in basement compartment. Lost gray water valve handle.
Second trip to dealer had to replace Microwave because glass fogged up. Lost black water and another gray water handle.
Third and forth time is was more nick nack problems.
Taking a trip around the end of Oct. and wonder if I'm going to have to visit the dealer again.
How many more happy Crusader owners are on first name bassis with you RV service department?

In general, includes ALL NEW UNITS. All of us.

[grhodes50]

Originally Posted by KAB449

Grhodes50 & RV Guy: Please continue your contribution to this forum as in the past. Your insights are valuable and help the participants of this forum.

Originally Posted by RV Guy

KAB449 - thanks for the encouragement. I wasn't going anywhere anyway.

I hope Gary continues to be an active participant, too. Obviously, PTM likes the support, but I personally think his enthusiasm for life, camping, family and yes, Prime Time is contagious and brings smiles to many of the particpants on this forum. To me, it's the essence of our lifestyle and the number one benefit of involvement in this Forum.

Thanks KAB449 & RV Guy.

I have to admit I feel a little ashamed of myself for my involvement with the negative non-sense that has been posted on this thread and others. That’s not the type of person I am, but you wouldn’t be able to tell that from my post. I not only apologize to those that I offended but to all FRF members.
This is a great forum. It has helped me tremendously and I hope that somewhere along the line I have been able to help others.
I will continue to try and help others where I feel I can. I will remain silent on threads that I feel I have nothing of value to offer or if anything I do have to offer has already been posted. I will continue to post welcomes on the “How many of us….” thread until we reach our goal of 100 members. I will continue my support of PT.
I also have made several B.S. posts for fun. I can’t honestly say I will end those post since I am so full of it! Sometimes I just can’t help myself. I do promise to restrain myself as best I can.
One last thing, I hold no ill feelings towards any of my fellow FRF members. They have only stated their opinions and whether I agree with those opinions or not, doesn’t really matter. They have the right to do so.

With all that being said, I'm going fishing. My wife is fishing right now. Now that just ain’t right.
Can you believe I had to return home this morning to do some work! Just thought I would check in on the forum while I was here. Oh well, sometimes things come up at the last minute and you gotta give a little back every now and then, right?

Good luck to all and happy camping!

[Walke]

I agree with CROCUS, all RV's in the $30 - $50K digit price range are built with the same cost guidelines, using the same workforce. The problems with PT units reported on this Forum to date are really very minor inconviences. Whenever I have a problem with an RV it is an opportunity to buy some better material and rebuild that area of the RV to make this RV, MINE !!!!

Just one minor example, if you have a handle vibrate off the shaft thread of the storage tanks, the DEALER is going to put another one on the shaft, and say done!! A good RV owner leaves the RV in his driveway, obtains the handle from the dealer and installs the handle with RTV, teflon tape, or any other material that insures it will never to come off again, and while your under the unit, do the other handle!!!

If you don't have fun managing, repairing, and installing modifications to your low cost RV you better buy an Airstream and take it to the dealer every time something squeeks.

Prime Time where absolutely amazing when we purchased our unit, there is not enough space to write what they did to ensure we obtained the exact unit we wanted with the desired option combination.

My dealer is useful for doing the annual Safety Inspection to obtain the government required sticker and maybe some warranty parts. ( I have dealt directly with the manufacturers of the appliances with great service over the years) Adding electrical plugs, switches, AV outlets, etc. is all in the challenge of having a better unit to sell than you purchased. It's easy when they are built with glue and staples, everything can be improved!!!!

RVing is a way of life, and camping is a way of life, but that's another story.
Have fun with your RV and make it YOURS !!!

[lbrjet]

Bought my Flagstaff 13 months ago. Put 4700 miles on it this year and have had zero problems. I take that back as I did have one: a string broke on a shade.

However, I did purchase the 2nd year warranty a couple of months ago just in case my luck runs out.

[southernsky]

GEEEEEESH!!!!!!!
Now we're talking about good RV owners????
If all I had was a handle fall off I would certainly go to the dealer and get one instead of hooking up and bringing my trailer to the dealer.
This isn't my first rodeo, I've had six travel trailers and fithwheels and have worked on all of them.
The frustration was in buying a new rig and having to work on it and the pride in ones product. Wondering if it was me or others who had the same problems.
Give it a break people....

[M109Rrider]

Did u just wake up.. lol j/k. This thread is water under the bridge.