Suburban H20 heater problem

[Jammer3025]

My water heater on my suburban water heater is not working properly. When I try to use the electric side the breaker trips on the distribution center. The first 2 nights we camp when we first got it, it did the same thing. When I got home I replaced the heating element with an exact replacement part, and thought I was done. The old one looked fine. It even showed the same Resistance as the new one did, but I changed it anyway.

Last week we went on a 7 day trip, and the electric side still doesn't work. The gas sides works fine. When I try to switch from gas to electric, the breaker trips. I'm using a lot of gas at a campsite that has electricity.

Maybe someone on here can help me out. I'm kinda stumped. Thanks for your help.

[Herk7769]

Remove the rubber cover from the thermostats. The left side is the AC side.

Look for a broken connecting wire or twisted thermostat body that may be touching the frame of the water heater.

Ebay has replacement ones; just make sure you get the one for the AC side as the DC side is made different.

Suburban RV Water Heater 120 Volt Thermostat 232317 | eBay

[Jammer3025]

Thanks Herk, I will give it a look.

[Jammer3025]

Well they both looked good.

[Herk7769]

Not much left in that system

ON/OFF Switch shorted?

Wiring to the outlet?

Something in the camper pinching the Romex?

[Jammer3025]

Yeah Herk your right. The only other thing I can think of is that the solenoid on the A/C side of the gas valve is bad. The Trailer is under warranty, but it's a real pain to get this TT out of my driveway. You wouldn't believe how tight it is. Anyway I'm trying to avoid the warranty issue. Looks like I may need to though. If our house sells we plan on going full time, so I need that electric side to work.

Thanks for your help.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by Jammer3025

Yeah Herk your right. The only other thing I can think of is that the solenoid on the A/C side of the gas valve is bad. The Trailer is under warranty, but it's a real pain to get this TT out of my driveway. You wouldn't believe how tight it is. Anyway I'm trying to avoid the warranty issue. Looks like I may need to though. If our house sells we plan on going full time, so I need that electric side to work.

Thanks for your help.

There is an AC side of the gas valve?
That is a new one on me.
Is it specific to your model?

Propane is only DC controlled with NO AC component.
Two separate and independent systems on models I am familiar with.

Here is the DC diagram. Note: no AC at all.


My money is on a pinched 120 volt wire going to the outlet the water heater AC side plugs into or a short inside the socket.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by Jammer3025

Yeah Herk your right. The only other thing I can think of is that the solenoid on the A/C side of the gas valve is bad. The Trailer is under warranty, but it's a real pain to get this TT out of my driveway. You wouldn't believe how tight it is. Anyway I'm trying to avoid the warranty issue. Looks like I may need to though. If our house sells we plan on going full time, so I need that electric side to work.

Thanks for your help.

There isn't much AC wiring in the water heater, the only item left besides hidden wiring is the circuit breaker. Its probably 15 or 20 amp and tripping with inrush current of the heater element. Easy to change and not expensive might be worth a try.

[Jammer3025]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

There is an AC side of the gas valve?
That is a new one on me.
Is it specific to your model?

Propane is only DC controlled with NO AC component.
Two separate and independent systems on models I am familiar with.

Here is the DC diagram. Note: no AC at all.


My money is on a pinched 120 volt wire going to the outlet the water heater AC side plugs into or a short inside the socket.

Ok I wasn't sure about the solenoids or a/c power . Right now I'm at home with A/C going to the TT, water tank filled, 12vdc water pump on, Gas valves off on both tanks, breaker is closed, and the switch to the electric side of the heater is on, and I'm making hot water. It has done this before, but somewhere along the line it will trip the breaker inside the TT. The element is new, and both t-stats are good. I'm just waiting for it to get good and hot, then I'm going to try switching from AC to gas (DC) and see what happens. The last time I switched from gas (DC) to AC it tripped the breaker. It has done this on several occasions. I tried to trouble shoot it while camping last week with neg results.

[Jammer3025]

Originally Posted by VinceU

There isn't much AC wiring in the water heater, the only item left besides hidden wiring is the circuit breaker. Its probably 15 or 20 amp and tripping with inrush current of the heater element. Easy to change and not expensive might be worth a try.

That just might be. I didn't think about that breaker. Thanks for your help.

[Jammer3025]

Well fellas I can't duplicate the problem. It worked perfect today. I used both gas and electric 2 times, and the breaker never tripped. IDK.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by Jammer3025

Well fellas I can't duplicate the problem. It worked perfect today. I used both gas and electric 2 times, and the breaker never tripped. IDK.

Good news is you got a good education on water heaters and you have some left over spare parts! Hope it stays fixed!

[Jammer3025]

^^^^ Yeah, I guess I did. I have the old (probably perfect element) In my TT parts bin aboard the Trailer. And the nice socket I bought to remove it.

Heck, If you ever need a socket to replace your heating element, and you see a large red Ram pickup, pulling a Windjammer flag me down, I might be able to help you. Ha Ha.

[Herk7769]

So, you may think you are done; but you are not.

Just because you could not duplicate the problem, does not mean the problem went away. You should still track down this malfunction (though it is harder now that it is working).

1) It will likely fail again; while you are camping; at night; letting the smoke out.
2) It could be a loose 120 VAC connection (always dangerous and can cause fires).

Finagle's Law says that it will fail at the worst possible time; to cause maximum damage.

Starting at the circuit breaker in the panel find and inspect every inch of that feed wire. Examine it for burned ends, loose, blackened, chaffed, or cut wires.

Follow the wire to the outlet (even if you need to drop the belly covering).

Take the outlet apart. Look for a poor connection (I would just replace it; those RV outlets use a "squeeze" type connection with knife blades to make contact).

I would do the "ends" first (most likely point of failure) and then work from one end to the other.

[wmtire]

Originally Posted by Jammer3025

When I try to use the electric side the breaker trips on the distribution center. The first 2 nights we camp when we first got it, it did the same thing. When I got home I replaced the heating element with an exact replacement part, and thought I was done. The old one looked fine. It even showed the same Resistance as the new one did, but I changed it anyway.

When you say the breaker is tripping, is it the individual breaker that controls the water heater circuit...or the main breaker (ie30 amp)?

[KyDan]

Lou is right. The problem didn't just "fix itself".
Look for shorted/pinched wire somewhere between the heating element
and the breaker. Could be right on the WH. My wires were laying right
against a sharp metal edge. I easily bent them away but had I left them,
they could have eventually cut thru the insulation and caused a short.

Also wonder if the dunderheads at the factory might have put some other
device on the same circuit?? Are you SURE everything else works when
the WH breaker is off/tripped?

Intermittent problems are the worst! Good Luck finding this one.

[Jammer3025]

Originally Posted by KyDan

Lou is right. The problem didn't just "fix itself".
Look for shorted/pinched wire somewhere between the heating element
and the breaker. Could be right on the WH. My wires were laying right
against a sharp metal edge. I easily bent them away but had I left them,
they could have eventually cut thru the insulation and caused a short.

Also wonder if the dunderheads at the factory might have put some other
device on the same circuit?? Are you SURE everything else works when
the WH breaker is off/tripped?

Intermittent problems are the worst! Good Luck finding this one.

Yep, as far as I know everything else works when that breaker trips.

[Jammer3025]

Is this a possibility? Because this is when I have noticed this. Ok, so I pull into the CG, and begin setting up. I usually have the hot water switch that is outside in the HW tank compartment turned off when I'm done camping or traveling in case I run out of water, so I won't burn up the element. So I suppose in the past I have turned the Gas side on first. I don't know why, but lets just say that this as been done before.

Ok so later in the day I hear the HW heater burner come on. It reminds me that I should be using the heater in the AC mode, so once the burner goes off, I turn the Gas switch off on the inside panel. Then I go outside and turn the AC HW switch ON.
Then I go inside and I hear the breaker trip. I did this like 4 times last trip. I could never get the AC side to work.

I tried that yesterday twice and the AC side did work. None of the resets have ever needed to be reset either.

[KyDan]

What wattage is stamped on the WH element??

There are 2 wattages out there.... both are 120v AC
but
One is 2000 watts and that will draw about 16.6 amps and
will trip a 15 amp breaker in a minute or so.

You need the 1500 watt element that will draw about
12.5 amps.

I'm just grasping at straws but it's possible you have the wrong ones???
Take a look at the one you took out and see what it says.

As far as tripping or not tripping because the gas is/was on or not....
No effect.
Folks often use gas and electric at the same time to get faster recovery
during showers.
Hot or cold tank should not make any difference either.

A weak breaker is a real possibility.
They are easy to replace and cheap.
Home Depot or a well stocked hardware store can sell you a 15 amp
plug in breaker for about $5.
Take your old one with you to be sure you get the right kind.
(I'm thinking it's a TQL but don't hold me to it.)
That's what I'd change next if you don't find any pinched wires.

UNPLUG TRAILER FROM SHORE POWER BEFORE REMOVING A BREAKER.

Good luck!

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by KyDan

What wattage is stamped on the WH element??
There are 2 wattages out there.... both are 120v AC
but one is 2000 watts and that will draw about 16.6 amps and
will trip a 15 amp breaker in a minute or so.
You need the 1500 watt element that will draw about
12.5 amps

Bingo...