Water Heater Question

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by formerFR

if you just leave your water heater on, and run the hot water thru each faucet/shower in the RV several times during the overnight low temp hours, then you'll be fine. It's like leaving your outside spigot 'dripping' - moving water has a much harder time freezing than sitting water, especially near an outside 'metal' spigot outlet.
If your RV is heated, then it's even less of a worry, as your heated interior will provide for the interior water lines, so the only concerns are those water lines not contained within the RV, or near the exterior. If you don't have a water hose connected, you'll not have too many concerns.
Another solution some of us use is to place a small electric heater in the water/wet bay, running overnight. The small thermostatic controlled units are very easy and small and works well. No worries.

Hi and thanks for your reply! I am definitely heating the RV (the builder is paying for electricity still so I mainly rely on an oil filled space heater but on really cold nights run my propane furnace too. I’ve covered all the windows and doors and it gets quite toasty inside (75 degrees). I believe that is helping the underside to stay warmer as the remote temp monitor I put underneath showed several degrees warmer than the actual temperature. However I know it will be much better protected with the insulated skirt and a space heater under there. I have one ready to go underneath. Can you please explain what you mean by wet bay? Sorry I am a first time RV owner. Are you simply referring to the area under the trailer where most of the water system is or inside one of the compartments?

As far as staying connected to city water, running hot water thru the lines periodically at night and leaving the tap dripping, I’m too worried about the outside hose freezing (although I understand what you are saying). I have 150 ft of hose connected to my house.

Thanks so much for your advice!

[JohnD10]

Originally Posted by KyDan

I don't believe the original poster has a park model so you are comparing apples to water melons!
Not the same.


Again, a warm water heater will not freeze in one night if it's turned off!!!
No idea what other pipes might freeze but the water heater TANK won't in one night.

I'm trying to point out that draining the water lines and leaving the water heater on is NOT a good idea.

Not sure why you guys can't read that in my post since I spelled it out in bold red letters.

Anyway...

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by JohnD10

In case you didn't read the whole post...

This was an electric water heater in a park model home...which is basically a giant RV water heater!

I didn't know that it had an adjustment on it either...but apparently the previous owner of my park model did know how to do it!

Unfortunately, the plumber was unable to remove the element to replace it without damaging the water heater itself, due to it being in use daily for several years at a higher than factory set temperature so the whole water heater had to be replaced.

Anyway...it is not worth the risk to leave the water heater turned on with no way for it to replenish itself.

Those are not rv water heaters . they are smaller home style water heaters and not the same beast as an rv unit . even at a higher then factory setting on those home style water heaters he should have been able to remove the element . it's very common for plumbers to up the temp on these unit to a min of 140 since they come from the factory set at 120 . if the water was run out of the unit the element would burn up before any damage could happen to the unit . leaving water in the unit for a night will not hurt anything , but also no reason to leave it turned on . several years is nothing for the home style water heater.

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by JohnD10

All of the advice here about leaving the water heater turned on when full of water while the water pipes are empty is ABSOLUTELY BAD ADVICE!

DON'T DO IT!

You risk burning up your water heater!

First off...if you don't bypass the water heater before you open the low point drains, the water heater will drain along with the rest of the plumbing.

If you are not going to drain the water heater along with the rest of the plumbing, heat up the water in the water heater...then shut it off for the night before you open any low point drains to let the water out of the plumbing for the night.

Just had to replace the electric water heater in my park model home in an RV park after the water was shut off to the whole park for three hours...an unexpected $600 repair bill!

The plumber said that while the water was off it appeared that the previous owners had set the temp too high and it boiled out while not refilling due to the water shutoff.

I'm not familiar with your TT, but I think that there are ways you can get by without all of the draining every night, but would require you to fill your fresh water tank and use that with the water pump instead of the city water...keep your furnace on at night to keep the under belly warm...leave the kitchen and bathroom cabinets opened to allow heat to flow inside them during the night...that kind of stuff!

I lived in the freezing temps of Denver, Colorado for three months last winter in my 5'ver, which is not prepped for winter living, and the only things that froze up was my outside shower (hate those things) and I did have to replace my city water inlet as the heated hose I bought turned out to be a total waste of money, froze up at the connection (despite being wrapped in electric heat tape and having an electric heater blowing inside the basement wall directly at that area where the water pump and heater is) and cracked the fitting on the side of the trailer.

Thanks for the advice, JohnD and I’m sorry you had such an expensive mishap! I am trying to avoid a similar issue. I will definitely not leave the water heater on overnight again. I guess I was lucky. :-)

[JohnD10]

Jengacat...

Unhook your city water hose at night and use the fresh water tank...

And, if you run the camper's furnace you should get heat to the underbelly to keep the plumbing warm.

I survived a freezing cold winter in Denver in my RV...so I've been down that road!

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by MR.M

the hot water tank will not freeze over night even if the water in it is cool . it's insulated and would take over 24 hrs of below freezing temp to start to freeze and longer to freeze solid

Mr M, thanks for responding. Yes, just this morning I pulled back the false panel in the rear storage compartment and saw the water heater. It looked like a cheap styrofoam cooler (I know that is just the insulating part lol). And it’s good to know I can leave it overnight. It’s above freezing during the day so I should be good. My house will be done by mid December and I should NOT be living in the TT when we have several days of below freezing weather, fingers crossed! Thanks again

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by JohnD10

Jengacat...

Unhook your city water hose at night and use the fresh water tank...

And, if you run the camper's furnace you should get heat to the underbelly to keep the plumbing warm.

I survived a freezing cold winter in Denver in my RV...so I've been down that road!

This is my ultimate goal. But I have to sanitize my fresh water tank (at least I feel that I do) as I just purchased this TT in August and I don’t know what was left in it. Gauge says empty. The TT is a 2016 and I believe the dealership was using it as a rental unit. I have bottled water for drinking, cooking, brushing teeth etc. so maybe I can get by without sanitizing? I’m not being lazy but I have a bad cold right now and feel crappy lol. This is why my skirt is not done yet. Plus I’m a perfectionist and am doing foam board insulation PLUS OSB sheathing inside a 2x4 frame lol. The wind has been bad here so I want to make sure it doesn’t blow down. Well, I am suiting up to venture out and work on it now. And maybe sanitize the freshwater tank based on your opinion! (as well as the opinion of anyone else who wishes to respond!) Thanks for your advice so far ��

[cavie]

Originally Posted by JohnD10

All of the advice here about leaving the water heater turned on when full of water while the water pipes are empty is ABSOLUTELY BAD ADVICE!

DON'T DO IT!

You risk burning up your water heater!

First off...if you don't bypass the water heater before you open the low point drains, the water heater will drain along with the rest of the plumbing.

If you are not going to drain the water heater along with the rest of the plumbing, heat up the water in the water heater...then shut it off for the night before you open any low point drains to let the water out of the plumbing for the night.

Just had to replace the electric water heater in my park model home in an RV park after the water was shut off to the whole park for three hours...an unexpected $600 repair bill!

The plumber said that while the water was off it appeared that the previous owners had set the temp too high and it boiled out while not refilling due to the water shutoff.

I'm not familiar with your TT, but I think that there are ways you can get by without all of the draining every night, but would require you to fill your fresh water tank and use that with the water pump instead of the city water...keep your furnace on at night to keep the under belly warm...leave the kitchen and bathroom cabinets opened to allow heat to flow inside them during the night...that kind of stuff!

I lived in the freezing temps of Denver, Colorado for three months last winter in my 5'ver, which is not prepped for winter living, and the only things that froze up was my outside shower (hate those things) and I did have to replace my city water inlet as the heated hose I bought turned out to be a total waste of money, froze up at the connection (despite being wrapped in electric heat tape and having an electric heater blowing inside the basement wall directly at that area where the water pump and heater is) and cracked the fitting on the side of the trailer.

Please explain this. Why would the heater burn up? It will come up to temp and shut off. The temp will go down slowly and when it gets cold enough it will heat up the water and shute off again. Just as it does if you're not there for a day or two. One night is NOT gonna burn up the heater. It may not even come on. He will turn the water back on in the AM. I an not aware of an RV water heater that you can SET the temp too high. But then I am not aware of everything.

[Mickey M]

Originally Posted by Jengacat

This is my ultimate goal. But I have to sanitize my fresh water tank (at least I feel that I do) as I just purchased this TT in August and I don’t know what was left in it. Gauge says empty. The TT is a 2016 and I believe the dealership was using it as a rental unit. I have bottled water for drinking, cooking, brushing teeth etc. so maybe I can get by without sanitizing? I’m not being lazy but I have a bad cold right now and feel crappy lol. This is why my skirt is not done yet. Plus I’m a perfectionist and am doing foam board insulation PLUS OSB sheathing inside a 2x4 frame lol. The wind has been bad here so I want to make sure it doesn’t blow down. Well, I am suiting up to venture out and work on it now. And maybe sanitize the freshwater tank based on your opinion! (as well as the opinion of anyone else who wishes to respond!) Thanks for your advice so far ��

Her is what I have done when needing to spend some time in rv in below freezing temperatures for extended amounts of time.

1st I went and bought a heated hose. Found out real quick that a heated hose by itself will not stop from freezing on really cold nights. So I bought another one and got some pipe insulation and covered the heated hose. Worked really well down to 0 for multiple days.

2nd I want and got a small temperature controlled space heater and set it to 50° and placed it into the bay that all the water lines and water filter was.

3rd in order to save on propane seeing how my heater at the time was propane only and not electric. I bought a oil filled space heater for the inside and set it at the desired temperature.

4th set my furnace at 55° for the times my space heater didn't keep up. This allowed the furnace to run for short bursts throughout the nights dispersing enough heat throughout the rv to keep the pipes from freezing.

5th I did not drain the water lines and kept the water supply on and seeing how the water heater was pretty much inside the rv I just left it on so I could have hot water on demand without burning too much propane.

6th. I did drain completely the fresh water tank. And kept the black water and grey water tank flush drains closed and emptied as per usual. It takes quite a while to freeze Large amounts of liquid. And as far as the flush valve I never seemed to have had a problem. As long as I was able to go long enough between flushing to allow for a day that was well above freezing. The I think is to allow enough space in the tanks to allow for expansion in case it does freeze. And leave enough water in there so it takes 1 hell of a freeze for an extended time to freeze solid enough to break anything.

This is my personal experience with my rv in below freezing weather. Every rv is different and may require different measures to survive freezing temperatures. Depending on water line locations, HW heater locations xcetera.

I must add that the RV park I was in had their water lines wrapped in electric tape and insulation as well.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by Jengacat

I’ve drained the lines using the low point drains and I emptied my gray water tank.

Does enough water remain in the tank after I’ve drained the lines (it’s a 6 gallon Atwood) that it will not be damaged if I leave it on? Based on the small amount of water that came out of the hot water drain, I am assuming that there is still a significant amount of water left in the tank. I left it on last night after draining the lines and I could periodically hear it running. It was fine when I reconnected to city water this afternoon. However, I don’t want to damage the heater if I am doing something incorrectly.

Based on what I'm reading above, it sounds like you drained all the water out of your heater and then turned it on which would have burned out your element. Unless you bypassed your heater before you drained the lines.

If you only got a "small amount of water" out of the drain, that means it was empty.

When you say it's "fine" does that mean you've actually gotten hot water out of it since then?

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by Mickey M

Her is what I have done when needing to spend some time in rv in below freezing temperatures for extended amounts of time.

1st I went and bought a heated hose. Found out real quick that a heated hose by itself will not stop from freezing on really cold nights. So I bought another one and got some pipe insulation and covered the heated hose. Worked really well down to 0 for multiple days.

2nd I want and got a small temperature controlled space heater and set it to 50° and placed it into the bay that all the water lines and water filter was.

3rd in order to save on propane seeing how my heater at the time was propane only and not electric. I bought a oil filled space heater for the inside and set it at the desired temperature.

4th set my furnace at 55° for the times my space heater didn't keep up. This allowed the furnace to run for short bursts throughout the nights dispersing enough heat throughout the rv to keep the pipes from freezing.

5th I did not drain the water lines and kept the water supply on and seeing how the water heater was pretty much inside the rv I just left it on so I could have hot water on demand without burning too much propane.

6th. I did drain completely the fresh water tank. And kept the black water and grey water tank flush drains closed and emptied as per usual. It takes quite a while to freeze Large amounts of liquid. And as far as the flush valve I never seemed to have had a problem. As long as I was able to go long enough between flushing to allow for a day that was well above freezing. The I think is to allow enough space in the tanks to allow for expansion in case it does freeze. And leave enough water in there so it takes 1 hell of a freeze for an extended time to freeze solid enough to break anything.

This is my personal experience with my rv in below freezing weather. Every rv is different and may require different measures to survive freezing temperatures. Depending on water line locations, HW heater locations xcetera.

I must add that the RV park I was in had their water lines wrapped in electric tape and insulation as well.

Mickey, thanks for the tips. All the info is very helpful. My biggest issue is the 150 ft run of hose from my house to the trailer (my house is being constructed). That’s why I have to use the fresh water tank. Made progress on trailer skirt today and based on all the tips here, I think I’ll be ok! Thanks again

[Jengacat]

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

Based on what I'm reading above, it sounds like you drained all the water out of your heater and then turned it on which would have burned out your element. Unless you bypassed your heater before you drained the lines.

If you only got a "small amount of water" out of the drain, that means it was empty.

When you say it's "fine" does that mean you've actually gotten hot water out of it since then?

Well, that’s what I was trying to determine—when I drained the water from the low point drains, did I drain the water heater, at least partially, enough to damage the element since I left it running? I did not bypass the heater. Being a noob, I assumed that since the heater has a drain plug, draining it is a separate process. The “small amount of water” I mentioned didnt come out of the heater, it came out of the hot low point drain. Anyway, yes, I have used the heater since that night and it is heating water and operating the same as before (there is enough water for a shower etc). After looking at the heater itself, identifying the bypass and seeing how it works, and talking to the dealership, it appears that my cold water inlet has a check valve on it, meaning that the water in the heater won’t drain when I open the low point drains. Anyway, I learned my lesson (haha) and will now bypass the heater and turn it off overnight if I need to disconnect city water and drain the pipes. This keeps the water in it, and there is zero risk of burning out my element and a low risk that 6 gallons of hot water will freeze overnight. I know this procedure is not typical, but until I am able to finish the trailer skirt and run the heater under the trailer, I am trying to make do. :-)