Water tank support upgrade

[Mr Havercamp]

Originally Posted by metalsideup

I reinforced my fresh water tank today. I too have an open belly, which is what brought the problem to my attention last season. With an almost full tank, my front support bracket was bent in 2 places and dropped the tank down 4-5 inches from the floor. It may have been fine, but once an issue is made known to me, my mind won't let me rest until it's addressed. BTW, when I fill, I dedicate myself to that task only, patiently filling to about an inch or so from the top of the tank. Yeah, its time consuming and boring, but we've all heard the stories of an overfill...
My job today applies to the Mini Lites.
The structural problem on my trailer is where they machine some slots in the main side-to-side support bar to take the hooks of the fore/aft shorter support bars. They machine a slot on both sides of the side-to-side L bracket, and it's having those two slots at the same point of the span that apparently creates a weak point. The 2 slots are probably so the installer doesn't have to worry about orientation. Here's a picture of the original situation:
Attachment 135143

I looked at a 2017 Mini Lite the other day and noticed the main front bracket is now bolted to the frame. If my 2015 was, I would have removed it, straightened it and welded a piggyback angle iron over it. But mine is welded in place to the frame, so my approach was to place a piece of real cold rolled 1-1/2 x 1-1/2 x 3/16 angle iron over the original, gently jack the two up together so the original is fairly straight again, then drill and bolt the two together at the ends, with the ends c-clamped.
I decided to not slot my new piece to accomodate the hooked-in pieces. To preserve the integrity of the new guy, I ground the hook tips flush to the original first.
Attachment 135144
I did do a little mod I'll detail in a bit so the hooks don't bounce out.
Attachment 135145
Attachment 135146Attachment 135147
I made sure the tank wasn't squeezed too tight anywhere, including the top to floor contact. Remember, too, that my "full" water level always leaves a bit of air space inside for insurance.
Back to those flushed hooks; I simply bolted on a short extension to the fore/aft angle iron (not!) support bars so my extension was flush to the bottom of the main cross member, preventing any possibility of the now shorter hook from jumping out.
Attachment 135148

That's it. I'll keep an eye on things until I am confident and can start worrying​ about something else. Like I mentioned, maybe after the initial bending all would have been fine, who knows. I am also aware of you folks who feel these tanks aren't meant for transporting a large volume of water, but I am not in that camp. My yellow sticker that specs out the available cargo weight limit clearly mentions to be aware that a full tank of water will cut in to that cargo limit by X amount.
Total cost was about 20 bucks; time spent was about 3 hours.

Yes sir........they deflect at those punched slots on the vertical leg.

Taking a piece of bent plate which is too light to begin with and further weakening it by punching slots in the vertical leg does not work out so well.

One of your factory supports should be bolted. I cut out the welded one and tossed the entire Lippert assembly in the scrap pile.

I explained this issue and showed some pics to a structural engineer who I have known and worked with for 20 years. He had a good laugh. He said if this was designed or approved by a registered engineer the bozo should have his stamp shoved up his ##s sideways LOL.

[rockfordroo]

Metalsideup: So you only reinforced one of the two side-to-side supports? Are you planning anything for the other one?

[scotty1121]

My front bracket was bent in the same place (at the unnecessary cut-out). I took the bend out and bolted a piece of angle iron to the existing one. I did finally hear back from the dealer. FR has approved my claim and is supposed to be sending the dealer a schematic to replace the fresh water tank brackets so they will not bend. I feel pretty confident in my repair, but I am curious to see what they will do. I am going to let them put a redesigned support system in place. I will post pictures of their "fix" when it is completed.

[CedarCreekWoody]

Originally Posted by scotty1121

My front bracket was bent in the same place (at the unnecessary cut-out). I took the bend out and bolted a piece of angle iron to the existing one. I did finally hear back from the dealer. FR has approved my claim and is supposed to be sending the dealer a schematic to replace the fresh water tank brackets so they will not bend. I feel pretty confident in my repair, but I am curious to see what they will do. I am going to let them put a redesigned support system in place. I will post pictures of their "fix" when it is completed.

Please keep us posted. It will interesting to see their solution.

[metalsideup]

Yes Sir, I only reinforced the front main span because the rear is still straight. If that changes, I will address it as required. I don't know why it's only my front span being defective; perhaps braking applies much more (and cumulative) "weight" or force towards the front?
I also inspected my other tanks. They all appear to be solidly mounted.

[CedarCreekWoody]

This appears to vary widely model to model. Some have weak support on one edge and strong angle iron on the other. Some have the sheet metal supports fore and aft. Hopefully some have angle iron on both sides.

[scotty1121]

Mine does not have the unnecessary cut-out on the rear support. I believe that is the reason only my front brace bent. That and because of the force applied to the front support when braking. Funny part is, I purchased mine with a bent front brace, it was winterized when I bought it and I never had any water in the tank. It must have happened from the factory to the dealer. I would doubt that they had much water in it. Probably only enough to run a system check.

[scotty1121]

[metalsideup]

The main thing, and a great purpose of our forum, is to make other owners aware of a possible defect. With this water tank situation, they can be cognizant during their travels to see if they are affected, and then have some alternatives towards a fix based on our postings.

[scotty1121]

Agree! Not a hard fix to do on your own either. It's just that FR is aware of the issue and should redesign it. The bent support may have never caused a problem, but I dont want to have to worry about it as I'm traveling down the road.

[rockfordroo]

My TT's in storage so I can't run out and look, but I'm wondering why this problem just seems to affect the FW tank. I'd think the grey and black tanks are installed the same way??

[CedarCreekWoody]

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

My TT's in storage so I can't run out and look, but I'm wondering why this problem just seems to affect the FW tank. I'd think the grey and black tanks are installed the same way??

Often those are installed the same way but more people seem to travel with the fresh water tanks full rather than the grey or black.

[youroo]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Often those are installed the same way but more people seem to travel with the fresh water tanks full rather than the grey or black.

Yep! Youroo!!

[rockfordroo]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Often those are installed the same way but more people seem to travel with the fresh water tanks full rather than the grey or black.

I guess the other tanks are probably a bit lighter, too, since the FW tank water is split; some goes in grey tank and some goes in the black.

[CedarCreekWoody]

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

I guess the other tanks are probably a bit lighter, too, since the FW tank water is split; some goes in grey tank and some goes in the black.

If a black tank drops lets hope that we are not around!

[oldjim]

I finally got around to looking under my trailer today, and found all tanks have what looks like pretty good mounts. maybe FR is listening, Woody

[CedarCreekWoody]

Originally Posted by oldjim

I finally got around to looking under my trailer today, and found all tanks have what looks like pretty good mounts. maybe FR is listening, Woody

Excellent!

[Mr Havercamp]

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

My TT's in storage so I can't run out and look, but I'm wondering why this problem just seems to affect the FW tank. I'd think the grey and black tanks are installed the same way??

They typically are not. Black and gray tanks usually have a ledge molded around the top of the tank, and hang from floater bars. The molded in ledge adds strength to the tank making it harder for it to deflect in the center, and transferring weight when full out to the ends of the supports where connected to the frame. On some one side will be hung from a frame crossmember, and a spreader bar on the other.

[mj0528]

I've noticed that the floor seems to bow out when the fw tank is full. The floor is covered by cheap plastic so I'm guessing it bows on purpose? Did you remove your covering to get to that and put it back or do some not have a plastic covering on the bottom that covers and I guess protects?

[scotty1121]

Not all units have the enclosed underbelly.