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Old 05-24-2015, 11:21 AM   #1
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Electrical outlets and fuses ???

A friend has lost power in one electrical outlet (kitchen area). Is a fuse a possible culprit, or are fuses only for the 12v?

Thank you.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:24 AM   #2
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A friend has lost power in one electrical outlet (kitchen area). Is a fuse a possible culprit, or are fuses only for the 12v?

Thank you.
Fuses are for 12 volt, circuit breakers are for 120 volt.

I would check the circuit breakers for a tripped one, and also a GFCI for it being tripped. The outlets are usually daisy chained off of a resettable GFCI outlet. If it trips, then all the other outlets in the chain are inoperable also.

You many times have a GFCI outlet near a sink in the kitchen and bathroom. I would check both places and reset (press the reset button) the gfci to see if it controls the outlet in question...and it goes back to working.

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Old 05-24-2015, 11:25 AM   #3
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Fuses only for 12 volts. Either a breaker tripped, a GFCI receptacle has tripped or bad connection...
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:30 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by wmtire View Post
Fuses are for 12 volt, circuit breakers are for 120 volt.

I would check the circuit breakers for a tripped one, and also a GFCI for it being tripped. The outlets are usually daisy chained off of a resettable GFCI outlet. If it trips, then all the other outlets in the chain are inoperable also.

You many times have a GFCI outlet near a sink in the kitchen and bathroom. I would check both places and reset (press the reset button) the gfci to see if it controls the outlet in question...and it goes back to working.

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Fuses only for 12 volts. Either a breaker tripped, a GFCI receptacle has tripped or bad connection...
Thanks! I know he tried the circuit breakers. I just sent him a message to reset the GFCI outlets. I know the one that is out is not GFCI, but I told him to reset the ones that are.

No word yet...

But thank you!
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Old 05-24-2015, 05:55 PM   #5
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You can have several regular outlets connected to a GFCI outlet . Even if it is a standard outlet it still can be protected by a GFCI outlet ! So just check all GFCI outlets .
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Old 05-24-2015, 06:31 PM   #6
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GFI

Reset the GFI in kitchen. Check the actual breaker in the panel to be sure it is not the breaker. You must push the handle of the breaker all the way to the off position then to the on position in most breakers. Also the breaker can also be a GFI breaker so you may need to reset the breaker itself with the installed button. Last if all this fails, disconnect shore power, be sure you have disconnected shore power, no 110/220 into coach or that circuit. Take apart he affected outlet and be sure all neutrals' and heat are firmly wire nutted together. The copper ends should also be twisted together and then a wire nut applied. Pigtails should then be installed in outlet.
Hope this all makes since to you. Good luck, and be safe.
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Old 05-24-2015, 08:02 PM   #7
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You can have several regular outlets connected to a GFCI outlet . Even if it is a standard outlet it still can be protected by a GFCI outlet ! So just check all GFCI outlets .
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Originally Posted by tahoe1840 View Post
Reset the GFI in kitchen. Check the actual breaker in the panel to be sure it is not the breaker. You must push the handle of the breaker all the way to the off position then to the on position in most breakers. Also the breaker can also be a GFI breaker so you may need to reset the breaker itself with the installed button. Last if all this fails, disconnect shore power, be sure you have disconnected shore power, no 110/220 into coach or that circuit. Take apart he affected outlet and be sure all neutrals' and heat are firmly wire nutted together. The copper ends should also be twisted together and then a wire nut applied. Pigtails should then be installed in outlet.
Hope this all makes since to you. Good luck, and be safe.
Thanks!!! The reset seemed to do the trick. I'm not there, so I don't know all that is going on....could be overloaded.

I sent him a troubleshooting list, so he can check all the wire connections should this pop up again.

Thank you all for your input and suggestions.....greatly appreciated!
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Old 05-25-2015, 09:53 AM   #8
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Thanks!!! The reset seemed to do the trick. I'm not there, so I don't know all that is going on....could be overloaded.

I sent him a troubleshooting list, so he can check all the wire connections should this pop up again.

Thank you all for your input and suggestions.....greatly appreciated!
AC wiring contains three wires; a hot, neutral, and ground. GFCI's measure the current flow on the hot and neutral wires and trip when there's ANY difference in the current on the two wires. The only way a difference occurs is when current enters a device then leaves it by a route the doesn't include the neutral wire. This happens if there's leakage to the ground wire or current starts flowing through your body to another ground, the metal case of the microwave for example.

Leakage can be caused by simple things. One example is a toaster that was washed and has some water inside it that makes an electrical connection between the heating elements and the outer case. GFCI devices are designed to protect people from being electrocuted when there's a problem with something that's plugged in to an outlet. The NEC (National Electric Code) now requires GFCI protected outlets at all locations where there's electrical outlets and water nearby. (There's other locations too.)

Circuit breakers protect wiring from overloads. Plug in a toaster and an electric fry pan to an outlet, try using both at the same time and you'll see the effects of overloading a circuit. (I don't actually recommend doing this.) Overloaded circuits overheat the wiring and can cause a fire which usually cannot be extinguished with a fire extinguisher until power has been removed from the circuit. I've fought an electrical fire (on my parent's boat) and can almost guarantee that you won't figure out that it's an electrical fire until it spreads enough to be impossible to put out with a fire extinguisher. We were lucky on the boat. The fire occurred in a location where it took two seconds to expose the area and determine it was an electrical fire and the three fire extinguishers within reach were able to control it until we could get the batteries disconnected.

Phil
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Old 05-29-2015, 10:54 PM   #9
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Good explanation "GFCI's measure the current flow on the hot and neutral wires and trip when there's ANY difference in the current on the two wires."

To add even more detail, here's more:

The way a GFCI operates is to pass the Ungrounded Conductor (Hot) PLUS the Grounded Conductor (Neutral) through a Torroid Coil. If the outgoing Hot line current is the same as the return Neutral current, there's no net current flow and no voltage gets induced into the coil. HOWEVER if there's a 5 milliamp difference, which means there's 5 milliamps of return current leaking/flowing in a path OTHER THEN the Neutral Grounded Conductor, the voltage in the Torrid signals the control circuit and the GFCI trips open.

The GFCI doesn't trip if there's ANY difference in Hot and Neutral line currents, it trips if there's at least 5 milliamps of difference. The reason 5 milliamps is used is because it takes typically in the range of around 30 to 50 milliamps through the human heart to cause defibrillation (spelling??)

Hope this helps and doesn't confuse lol

John T retired Electrical Engineer
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Old 05-30-2015, 07:40 AM   #10
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PS to add a bit to my hurried response above: A) If the outgoing Hot supply current and the Neutral return current is the same, the effect is NO VOLTAGE gets induced into the torroid coil. There's still current flow through the coil, but the SAME amount flowing one way as the other cancels out any coil induced voltage, so there's no signal to trip the GFCI. HOWEVER if the difference is around 5 milliamps or so, that's enough to induce sufficient voltage to trip the GFCI. B) I think 30 to 50 milliamps through the human heart can cause FIBRILLATION not DE FIBRILLATION I got that bass ackwards I think lol Silly me, I'm an Engineer NOT a Doctor


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