Quick electric question

[RoadTrip]

Now I kinda wanna learn how to weld...

But I'm totally firing the electrician...sheesh.

[Grizzlygibbs]

I would have him come out, tell him that you are having problems with the outlet. Then show him the plug and the requirements for your RV (30 or 50 amp 120v). Then tell him you need an adapter to go from the plug he put in, to your RV. See where he goes from there. If he then tells you it wont be compatible, ask him to fix it and make it right. If not, demand a refund and/or take him to small claims if he refuses as you know it will not work (of course do not let him attempt to make an adapter, let him know this will kill your RV appliances...).

This could just be an honest mistake as it seems that he was not supplied with any direction or wiring schematics. If you show him the diagram that has been posted up here in PDF form he may have an "aha" moment and be able to solution the problem at no additional cost.

Go ahead and flame me, but I believe he deserves to at least be told he did it wrong and give him the chance to make it right and learn from his mistake before he tells people he has wired outlets for RV use and never had any problems that he knew of...

[RoadTrip]

Originally Posted by Grizzlygibbs

I would have him come out, tell him that you are having problems with the outlet. Then show him the plug and the requirements for your RV (30 or 50 amp 120v). Then tell him you need an adapter to go from the plug he put in, to your RV. See where he goes from there. If he then tells you it wont be compatible, ask him to fix it and make it right. If not, demand a refund and/or take him to small claims if he refuses as you know it will not work (of course do not let him attempt to make an adapter, let him know this will kill your RV appliances...).

This could just be an honest mistake as it seems that he was not supplied with any direction or wiring schematics. If you show him the diagram that has been posted up here in PDF form he may have an "aha" moment and be able to solution the problem at no additional cost.

Go ahead and flame me, but I believe he deserves to at least be told he did it wrong and give him the chance to make it right and learn from his mistake before he tells people he has wired outlets for RV use and never had any problems that he knew of...

I considered telling him - and still might. But I just don't think I care enough to help him improve his business. When I'm a dissatisfied customer, I just stop being a customer.

But I am torn b/c we had zero instructions for him. Whether that's more or less cupable than the electrician not clarifying - or the electrician installing something that obviously shows he did not even know what an RV plug was....I dunno.

No flaming - you have a good point. I just don't know if it's good enough to overcome my reluctance to let him learn with my wiring.

[Grizzlygibbs]

I would tell him for the sake that he does not make this mistake and do harm to another customer.

I understand your stance on not staying a customer, but you have not even given him the chance to make things right...

Not flaming you, just hope this all works out to your advantage as this seems to be a huge misunderstanding from my point of view.

[RoadTrip]

no offense taken here.

I just don't know where my "second chance" line is here. He hasn't returned my follow up text asking about neutral - in fact he was terrible to get ahold of the entire process. Plus we had problems with what appeared to be a power struggle between him and another subcontractor - leaving us in the middle.

I'll have to think on it some more.

[popinfresh2]

I own a 32 foot Forest River "Flagstaff" 2010 Model. Last Season I had to replace Both Slide Out Motors, on the Livingroom and Bedroom. I asked the Repairman in Tennessee why they went out. He said normally you don't have any problems but it could be a bad batch of Motors. These Motors was made in China was my first thought. I love my Rig and enjoy what Forest River put into it, but has anyone else had this problem?

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by Grizzlygibbs

Then tell him you need an adapter to go from the plug he put in, to your RV.

Sorry Grizz,

I respectfully disagree. The outlet needs replacing (and the panel side rewired) or a new 4 wire home run to the panel and complete outlet replace/rewire. I doubt any adapter would be feasible in the long or short run.

Just my opinion of course.

[Grizzlygibbs]

I think you misread, this was a poor attempt at judging the electricians actual knowledge of how to solve the problem (not that it could be done but to see if he would try to make something work or acknowledge his mistake and letting him know the specs of the RV an that his work is not acceptable for what he needs). I worded it poorly. Basically, he needs to see what he did was wrong and fix it, but if he won't even return a call or text he should be reported to BBB.

[RoadTrip]

I might tell the general contractor, but the importance of educating the man is pretty low on my list of priorities.

Anyway - the question is at least answered and now I know what the fix is.

Who will fix it - haven't decided yet.

But all of you have been tremendously helpful (and patient) with someone that lacks the in depth knowledge many of you have. For that, I am very thankful.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by Grizzlygibbs

I think you misread, this was a poor attempt at judging the electricians actual knowledge of how to solve the problem (not that it could be done but to see if he would try to make something work or acknowledge his mistake and letting him know the specs of the RV an that his work is not acceptable for what he needs). I worded it poorly. Basically, he needs to see what he did was wrong and fix it, but if he won't even return a call or text he should be reported to BBB.

Thanks for clearing that up. I totally agree with how you explained it.

Posts get confusing because "tone" does not go through and confusion is possible:

For Example I just got this today:

Wife texts husband on a cold winter’s morning:
"Windows frozen."

Husband texts back:
"Pour some lukewarm water over it."

Wife texts back 5 minutes later:
"Computer really screwed up now."

[Joe_GA]

Wow! I just read this entire thread in horror. Besides the fact that the electrician used the wrong receptical and probably wired it wrong, nobody seemed to find anything wrong with the fact that he used a 40 amp breaker. If he intended it to be a 30 amp hook up, that is unsafe. If he intended it to be a 50 amp circuit, he didn't have enough breaker. I wonder what size wire he ran. That's especially critical. Yup. You are in need of a competent electrician!

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by Joe_GA

Wow! I just read this entire thread in horror. Besides the fact that the electrician used the wrong receptical and probably wired it wrong, nobody seemed to find anything wrong with the fact that he used a 40 amp breaker. If he intended it to be a 30 amp hook up, that is unsafe. If he intended it to be a 50 amp circuit, he didn't have enough breaker. I wonder what size wire he ran. That's especially critical. Yup. You are in need of a competent electrician!

To be honest, I was not overly concerned about the breaker choice in the face of such ineptitude.

Had the 50 amp service been wired correctly with 3 wire w/ ground (either 8 or 6 gauge) and the correct 50 amp service RV socket installed; protecting it with a 40 amp breaker would not be a bid deal.

For one, the OP intended to dogbone it down to 30 amps so the 40 amp breakers would never overload unless he bought a different camper (the 30 amp camper main would pop long before his circuit overloaded.

Second, if he DID upgrade the camper to a 50 amp camper, the 40 amp breaker would keep the circuit safe from overloading. The danger of course is, if the breaker was routinely taken to its limit, the OP MIGHT be tempted to fix it by just replacing the breaker with a 50 amp one and not upgrade the wiring to handle the increased amps.

I just want to know what size wire he used in conjunction with that 40 amp circuit?
If he used 8 gauge 3 wire w/ground the 40 would be the maximum breaker for that wire.
To upgrade the circuit to 50 amps the entire run would have to be replaced with 6 gauge 3 wire with ground.

[RoadTrip]

Originally Posted by herk7769

To be honest, I was not overly concerned about the breaker choice in the face of such ineptitude.

Had the 50 amp service been wired correctly with 3 wire w/ ground (either 8 or 6 gauge) and the correct 50 amp service RV socket installed; protecting it with a 40 amp breaker would not be a bid deal.

For one, the OP intended to dogbone it down to 30 amps so the 40 amp breakers would never overload unless he bought a different camper (the 30 amp camper main would pop long before his circuit overloaded.

Second, if he DID upgrade the camper to a 50 amp camper, the 40 amp breaker would keep the circuit safe from overloading. The danger of course is, if the breaker was routinely taken to its limit, the OP MIGHT be tempted to fix it by just replacing the breaker with a 50 amp one and not upgrade the wiring to handle the increased amps.

I just want to know what size wire he used in conjunction with that 40 amp circuit?
If he used 8 gauge 3 wire w/ground the 40 would be the maximum breaker for that wire.
To upgrade the circuit to 50 amps the entire run would have to be replaced with 6 gauge 3 wire with ground.

Herk - I'll find out when we fix it. We're in no rush as I have a household 110 outlet that we plug into now. It will probably be a month (or a few).

Whoever fixes it will get handed all the diagrams and pics. And I will make sure to get a full report on the prior craftsmanship. (hopefully with pictures)

And just to finish the implied question - and now that I know about plugging in an RV - since I already have a two pole - I'll likely defer to the *new* electrician about a 50 or 30. I don't much care. But I care deeply that it's safe, so the wire gauge is something I'll be paying attention to. Buying an adapter - meh, no biggie.

But I don't think I'll be upgrading to a 50a MH. I'm limited to what fits in my garage and at 34' 11", that's gonna be a class C (class A won't fit for height anyway).

Hmmm...now I'm thinking of all the responses I'm going to get "get the 50, better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it".

Pfft, probably just have the 50 done correctly. Just in case.

[Joe_GA]

herk, at first I wasn't concerned with breaker size because it was a 50 amp circuit. As I read on, I was thinking this guy tried to install a 50 amp receptical and used a 40 amp breaker. Is that because he ran 8 or 10 guage wire? Anyway, it seemed to me to be a neon sign saying looky this ain't right! Since Roadtrip is storing his RV in a garage, he probably only needs enough power to charge batteries and keep the refer running. It's a shame the electrician wasn't competent.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by Joe_GA

herk, at first I wasn't concerned with breaker size because it was a 50 amp circuit. As I read on, I was thinking this guy tried to install a 50 amp receptical and used a 40 amp breaker. Is that because he ran 8 or 10 guage wire? Anyway, it seemed to me to be a neon sign saying looky this ain't right! Since Roadtrip is storing his RV in a garage, he probably only needs enough power to charge batteries and keep the refer running. It's a shame the electrician wasn't competent.

I totally agree. Since he is not looking for a motorhome or a fiver that needs 50 amps, I would just make sure it can handle a single 30 amp run and put in a solid 30 amp 110 Volt service. If the OP can find a competent electrician, he might even be able to use the existing wire run, if there is enough slack in the panel, to convert one of the 2 wires w/ground into a neutral. (Tag the neutral appropriately if it is not white.)

Then he will just need a 30 amp RV socket and a single 30 amp circuit breaker. (A NEMA TT-30 for the purists)

[fast murray]

Originally Posted by Joe_GA

Wow! I just read this entire thread in horror. Besides the fact that the electrician used the wrong receptical and probably wired it wrong, nobody seemed to find anything wrong with the fact that he used a 40 amp breaker. If he intended it to be a 30 amp hook up, that is unsafe. If he intended it to be a 50 amp circuit, he didn't have enough breaker. I wonder what size wire he ran. That's especially critical. Yup. You are in need of a competent electrician!

There's nothing wrong with fusing an 8 gauge wire at 40 amps. I'd bet there's an 8-2wg NM cable feeding that recep which could be fused at 40 or 50 amps. If that's the case he has a welder recep that meets the NEC.

[fast murray]

Originally Posted by herk7769

I totally agree. Since he is not looking for a motorhome or a fiver that needs 50 amps, I would just make sure it can handle a single 30 amp run and put in a solid 30 amp 110 Volt service. If the OP can find a competent electrician, he might even be able to use the existing wire run, if there is enough slack in the panel, to convert one of the 2 wires w/ground into a neutral. (Tag the neutral appropriately if it is not white.)

Then he will just need a 30 amp RV socket and a single 30 amp circuit breaker. (A NEMA TT-30 for the purists)

That is the best thing he can do with what he's got without refeeding the receptacle with a new cable.

[Joe_GA]

Originally Posted by fast murray

There's nothing wrong with fusing an 8 gauge wire at 40 amps. I'd bet there's an 8-2wg NM cable feeding that recep which could be fused at 40 or 50 amps. If that's the case he has a welder recep that meets the NEC.

I agree. There is nothing wrong with fusing 8 guage wire at 40 amps. Since the wire size is currently unknown, we don't know what the heck the electrician was thinking. Was he trying to build a 30 amp RV hookup or a 50 amp hookup?

[Joe_GA]

Originally Posted by herk7769

I totally agree. Since he is not looking for a motorhome or a fiver that needs 50 amps, I would just make sure it can handle a single 30 amp run and put in a solid 30 amp 110 Volt service. If the OP can find a competent electrician, he might even be able to use the existing wire run, if there is enough slack in the panel, to convert one of the 2 wires w/ground into a neutral. (Tag the neutral appropriately if it is not white.)

Then he will just need a 30 amp RV socket and a single 30 amp circuit breaker. (A NEMA TT-30 for the purists)

I agree. 30 amp is probably going to be the way to go. The OP probably won't be running the AC in there and surely not dual AC's.