Report your tire blowouts?

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by gskill

It is my experience with RVs that the rating on the tires as well as the GVWR of the RV are borderline. If the RV is loaded beyond the rating of the tires, they can overheat causing failure. If traveling at higher than normal speeds, the tire can overheat. If low tire pressure is present the tire can overheat. if the tire picks up a nail or object it can deflate with out the driver knowing and shred the tire. All four of these conditions can cause failure and I have experienced most of these. Last year I purchased a tire monitoring system which constantly monitors pressure and temperature. On our trip this year I had one puncture which the system caught before it totally deflated and ruined the tire and two tires that developed low pressure. Without the system, all three of the tires would have eventually failed and been destroyed and possibly damaged the RV. While the tire manufacturer may be somewhat at fault and the RV factory could have installed better rated tires. Ultimately the owner should understand the limits that these tires will stand and either upgrade their tires or stay within the limits and monitor the tires. I highly recommend a monitoring system.

Originally Posted by Tireguy397

I spent many years working for a major tire company and I have seen my share of failures. There are many inferior tire manufactures mostly from the Middle East and Asia. However trailer owners are still sometimes their own worst enemy when it comes to tires. This past weekend I was parked next to a humongous 5th wheeler with 3 axles. I watched him as he packed up and noticed one of his tires looked very low in air. I told him about it and with a bit of attitude he told me he had checked them before leaving home a few days before. I asked if we could check them and he agreed. I broke out my trusty tire gauge. The first thing I did was gave the valve stem a field test. That involves spitting on your finger and wiping it on the end. His mouth dropped as he watched the bubbles come out. Tire had less than 10 lbs of pressure. The core had stuck open a little when he checked the pressure. I always keep some spare valve cores and a tool for such occasions and a portable compressor. I made a new best friend after that. Moral is don't take things for granted when it comes to your tires.

I totally agree that there is some ownership responsibility here, but there are millions of people driving around with low/underinflated/bald/etc. . . passenger car tires too. You just don't have as many issues with those tires blowing out because they are higher quality and more closely watched. I have been on truck threads for years. The only tire blowouts I see posted on a regular basis are trailer tires. Yes, those tires may be less monitored by the owners but that doesn't mean we shouldn't report the problems in hopes of making a better tire in the future.

[seigell]

I find it somewhat "funny" (both in "HaHa" and "Satirical" and "Sad" connotations) that the RV Community would be so interested in Government or Industry Regulation - even over something as Fundamental as Tire Performance.
The RV Community has a general reputation of being one of the groups whose Politics lean toward "Less" not "More" Government Regulation in their Lives - to the point of seeing Camping or Boondocking as ways to gain at least Temporary Respite from the Work-a-Day World and City-Life.

There is some amount of Government Regulation that plays directly upon RV Manufacture and RV Safety. Departments such as the NHTSA have responsibility for the Safety of Vehicles traveling the Roads of the USA, and the Dept of Commerce and the Treasury Dept have some oversight of the Corporations which build our RVs. But the latter are generally limited to "standard" Corporate Business Activities, and the former is most concerned about the Vehicles which carry Passengers and the conditions and situations which could most affect their Safety.
Motorhomes get a great deal of Scrutiny during Manufacture because these are Fulltime Passenger-carrying Vehicles. Travel Trailers see significantly less Scrutiny simply because they generally Do Not / Cannot carry Passengers whilst travelling the Roadway. As well, while Trailers can cause Significant Issues for the Towing Vehicle when the Trailer has an Issue, when those Accidents lead to Passenger Injuries in the Towing Vehicle there are already copious Regulations that address the same Passenger Safety Issues in the case of Generic Accidents.
This may be a callous interpretation of the bulk of NHTSA Regulations, but...

The Depth and Scope of these Regulations are set forth by Federal Law as crafted in a few specific Legislative Committees - meaning your Reps and Senators (or usually those from States with Large RV Manufacturers). Then the actual Regulations are written as part of the function of the Executive Branch (the Bureaucratic part that is rather unaffected by who sits in the Oval Office), but again under the Scrutiny of the Legislative Branch Committees (influenced by same Lobbyists as above). Beyond Lobbyist Influences, most Federal-level Elected Officials think of "Lear Jet" when one mentions "RV" and wouldn't be Caught Dead in a CampingWorld / WalMart / KOA, unless it was Primary Season and Indiana was next-up to the Polls.

Looking at the dearth of Regulations another way: There are slightly more than 250M Cars (and Light Trucks/SUV/CUV/Motorcycles) Registered in the USA. There are 15M Commercial Trucks, of which 3M are Long-Haul Semis. Against this, there are a total of 8.5M RV Owners. Those numbers would readily show why so many Regulations, so much Scrutiny, and so many Recalls are posted for the Passenger Vehicle Industry. It would seem that RVs might expect the level of Scrutiny of Commercial Trucks, but remember that most Commercial Trucks are on the Road 10-14hrs-a-Day as they don't make Money when Standing Still - while most of us RV Owners didn't buy our rigs (big or small) in order to have them Logging Miles every Day. As well, Trucks are more heavily Regulated because they are Commercial Vehicles, not Private Property.

So, RVs simply Don't Get (probably Shouldn't Get - definitely Not Desired by some) the same level of Regulatory Scrutiny. And it would be questionable whether NHTSA oversight would cover much more than Axles / Tires / Hitch, yet outside the Tire Threads most Serious Manufacturer-related Concerns are for Structural and Design Elements unrelated to Driving / Towing and therefore would fall under some other Regulatory Agency (probably one with even less insight into our Usage and Desires).

So,what do Level of Regulation we Really Want??

[Airdale]

I maintain a RV trailer tire blog under another user name. The following post was written in 2011. I've not changed a word.

RV Trailer Tire Failures

There is no clear answer, only speculation. Anecdotal information drives speculations into name calling and negative design confidence.

As everyday tire users we are spoiled. We don't suffer tire failures with our everyday vehicles. When we do they can almost always be accounted for. Most of us will go for many years without a single tire failure. Then we get an RV trailer and POP goes the tires.

The tires on our everyday vehicles are - in most cases - specifically designed for the vehicle they are on. They are quality graded for all sorts of conditions with tread designs to match the grading. Their load capacity has been derived from the maximum loaded vehicle with a 6% reserve left over which will seldom, if ever, be used. They are constantly in use so the built-in chemical compounds stay in action and degrading is held at the bare minimum. Most of them will wear out long before they will ever get old enough to be effected by degradation or age or both.

On the other hand the RV trailer also has tires specifically designed for their position. And that's where almost all of the similarity ends. Seldom has a tire design been scrutinized as often and with such detail as the ST tire. Almost all of the American manufacturers have given up on the trailer tire or have sent it to their off shore plants in faraway places like China, Vietnam, Korea, Taiwan or Thailand etc.

Most users that have had a ST tire failure or numerous ones are not going to like or agree with many of my analogies on this subject. The overwhelming evidence will support my stance but there are no official statistical findings to support what I say. But, logic always has a strong influence on many outcomes in the absence of other evidence.

In the absence of numerous recalls for the ST tire one must assume the design is sound and cannot, by itself, have caused the many failures reported against it.

Once the design is ruled out of the failure scenario the cause must lie elsewhere. So, is there a single cause or a combination of causes? I like multiple causes over the single one. Of course any highly abused single cause can also be the culprit.

Here are my accusations. We overload our trailers. We speed with our trailers. We take a somewhat lackadaisical attitude about our trailer's tire pressures. We store our trailers for long periods of time - six months or more - with no regard for the tire's condition or pressures. The trailer may not even be level which causes tires on the low side to become overloaded for their entire time in storage. We don't balance or rotate the trailer tires. Sometimes the spare is exposed to the elements for so long it explodes.


Here is a link where you can look at reports on your particular tire brand.

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/owners/SearchSafetyIssues

A footnote: Because of the current tire fitment regulations for RV trailer axles many trailer manufacturers will use "bare minimum" load capacity tires. Most owners buying such trailers are unaware that the life expectancy of their original equipment tires is a year or less.

[CHD Dad]

We've owned four campers, PUP, two TT's and our new TH. PUP was fine with tires. First TT blew a tire but it was an axle issue, they were out of alignment and scrubbing the tires bad. Second TT I had two blowouts. First one was the factory tire with 1000 miles on it. Second was a Maxxis which is regarded as among the better ST tires. I think the problem is nailed on the head earlier in this thread. The tires were borderline in load rating. They were within the specs of the camper and tire but just barely. I had maybe 50-75# per tire in extra capacity if that much. I finally swapped them out to larger LT tires and never had a single issue over several thousand miles.

[CHD Dad]

Originally Posted by Airdale

A footnote: Because of the current tire fitment regulations for RV trailer axles many trailer manufacturers will use "bare minimum" load capacity tires. Most owners buying such trailers are unaware that the life expectancy of their original equipment tires is a year or less.

Where did you see this info and why would an OEM tire only be good for one year?

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by seigell

So,what do Level of Regulation we Really Want??

I agree with much of what you wrote except the first paragraph as I have seen a wide variety of RV owners over the years. I just wouldn't paint with that big of a paintbrush, and some of this really doesn't matter as there is an agency responsible for safety on the highways and they should be doing that. Whether they are doing a good job of it is certainly subject to debate, but there could be a thread on that subject separate from this discussion.

As to your question, the level of regulation is already in place. NHSTA does force recalls. My point is simply that they likely do not recall enough tires because we (the RV owners) never report blowouts, but we do complain about them on forums. . .

[Airdale]

Originally Posted by CHD Dad

Where did you see this info and why would an OEM tire only be good for one year?

The regulation for tires fitted to the trailer manufacturers GAWR does not have to provide any reserve - via inflation pressures - above the axle requirement.

It has been widely advertised that ST tires can degrade as much or even more than 10% per year. With minimum requirement tires installed on a trailer that is loaded heavy but not over GVWR a year is a guess. But I bet it's in the ballpark.

[seigell]

Originally Posted by Airdale

Seldom has a tire design been scrutinized as often and with such detail as the ST tire.

Regulatory Scrutiny? By the NHTSA or other? Or simply by Anecdotal Customer Complaints?

Even searches performed of the NHTSA database via the link in your Post couldn't back the "highly scrutinized" claim.

Originally Posted by Airdale

In the absence of numerous recalls for the ST tire one must assume the design is sound and cannot, by itself, have caused the many failures reported against it.

Again, is there any direct evidence that ST Tires (or any Non-Commercial Trailer Tire Use) falls under similar levels of Scrutiny as Passenger Tires??

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by seigell

Regulatory Scrutiny? By the NHTSA or other? Or simply by Anecdotal Customer Complaints?

Even searches performed of the NHTSA database via the link in your Post couldn't back the "highly scrutinized" claim.



Again, is there any direct evidence that ST Tires (or any Non-Commercial Trailer Tire Use) falls under similar levels of Scrutiny as Passenger Tires??

That the whole point. Report failures so there will be.

[seigell]

Originally Posted by madmaxmutt

That the whole point. Report failures so there will be.

The NHTSA Regulatory Power is circumscribed by it's Regulatory Mandate and by the Regulations that are on the books. It's not driven by Anecdotal Reporting of Mishaps.

I searched the Online NHTSA Database, both for Reports of Failures (a goodly number of those are returned) and Regulatory Findings / Recalls (few Recalls related to ST Tires but numerous Petitions for "Findings of Inconsequential Noncompliance").

[mud yapster]

So back to the OP's question instead of your debate.
Who has had a tire failure?

[Rvlovers]

It seems like quite a few Goodyear marathons about 1-2 years old are blowing. We blew two on the way to Elkhart. Stopped after 2 and bought new set of carlisles. All discount tire had in stock We were correctly inflated and not overloaded

[schrederman]

Like some others have posted here, I've never had a blow-out. However, I've been lucky... or maybe just vigilant. I did my usual pre-trip inspection and found one of my OEM tires with tread separation at about 8K miles, and replaced it with a Maxxis. I went to Phoenix and back (2K miles) and inspected the OEMs during and after the trip. I decided to replace the other 3 OEMs before going out again. The tire dealer showed me that 2 more of the OEMs were having tread separation problems. We're going to have to face the fact that there are a lot of junk ST tires coming into this country, and the RV builders are getting them dirt cheap. They are in business to make money, as any good business should be. But until some hot-shot reporter starts digging like happened in the Ford/Firestone thing, we're going to have to either cross our fingers, or pay the extra bucks to change new tires... and even then... cross our fingers...

[seigell]

Originally Posted by mud yapster

Who has had a tire failure?

I have... Multiple...

I've forgotten the name of the OEMs that FR put under my HW276, but the Driver-side showed "terminal" sidewall damage "Rock Bruising" before 1000 mi. (Caught it just before a probable Blowout.)
The replacement Carlisle on the same side developed similar issue within 500-1000mi (again caught just before a probable Blowout - suspect a Gravel section of an AZ State Highway).
This Spring I had an actual Blowout, Curb-side tire this time, running a Carlisle that had been purchased the previous Fall through Big-O. The Blowout took out some of the Wheelwell and a Propane Line and Wiring. I limped in on a Spare (still the OEM brand but now sporting a serious Sidewall Separation) to a Big-O (wouldn't you know just 1 exit of the I-10 past my Blowout), where they replaced that bulged Spare with another Carlisle based on the Road Hazard Warranty.

I've found that I have Very Few Choices in Tires. RF designed the HW276 to within a few Lbs of the Dexter Torsion Axle Rating and chose to design the Wheelwells very tight in order to save on Ride Height and Interior Space. And they placed much more of the Weight over the Driver-side Tire (Slide + John + deepest portion of the Fresh Water Tank). I already have the highest rated 14in STs, and no one makes higher load-rated LTs in 14, and even with a 2in Dexter Lift would probably have Rubbing at the back of the Wheelwell if I tried to move up to 15s.

[magpi26]

Airdale, I agree with part of your comments, but I am convinced that there is a serious problem with the design and quality of RV products as compared with previous years. I am a compulsive maintenance freak especially when it comes to my TT tires. I have owned four different units over the years and did not have any problems until the last two TTs which cover the past 7 years or so. Brand new TTs that have undersized axles and tires are not uncommon and the tires themselves simply do not wear and hold up even with regular checks and maintenance. I simply do not understand why the manufacturers do not address these problems because they are real as validated by the many horror stories posted here and on other forums. When I talk to fellow campers these days it seems the conversation always gets around to problems we are having with quality control in manufacturing these RVs and war stories about tires blowing and tearing the sides out of the campers. Many of these folks are experienced, knowledgable and careful in taking care of their RVs. There is a serious problem in the industry, period.

[Airdale]

I’m trying to stay within the guide lines the OP has set in post #1.

The catastrophic failures we see with trailer tires are mostly tread separations in combination with a complete carcass failure. Damage to exterior materials in and around the RV trailer wheel wells are often extensive.

The following NHTSA quote is a little out of context but it adds to a trailer owners dilemma.

“The GVWR must not be exceeded by overloading the vehicle. There is little the government can do to assist a consumer who has purchased a vehicle that has insufficient cargo capacity for its intended use.”

It’s a “buyer beware” market and they often take full advantage of it.

In another regulation the trailer manufacturer MUST publish a pin/hitch weight. The trailer manufacturer is allowed to set the GAWR for each axle. A brochure may say your trailer has 5800# axles but in fact you will only be allowed to use 5080# of that amount if the trailer manufacturer has set them at 5080# and put that figure on the trailer’s certification label. Now the trailer manufacturer must use the published pin weight with the total GAWR so that they will equal or exceed the trailer’s GVWR. What is in between is cargo and it’s also on a mandated placard inside of the trailer. The trailer manufacturer must fit tires to each axle with a load capacity equal to or greater than the axle’s GAWR. One of the standard 15” trailer tires has a load capacity of 2540# at it’s maximum inflation pressure. According to all existing regulations those tires are a legal fit for the 5080# certified GAWRs above. There is zero load capacity reserves with a fully loaded axle. How long will they last? Will the owner figure out what has happened after they fail? What is the solution? It’s very doubtful that the trailer manufacturer will recommend anything other than what they put on there because according to the regulations their fitments were within the regulations and suitable.

[jackdn0610]

This past Saturday I was just starting a 3 month trip to the east coast. Had only gone 250 miles when one Goodyear Marathon ST235/80R16 blew, causing quite a bit of damage to the passenger side: end of trip. Turned around to come home and had gone 120 miles when the second tire on the passenger side blew. Had to wait in the heat of the Nevada desert for 4 1/2 hours for a service technician to show up and replace that tire (no second spare tire). Tires were properly inflated and was only going 60 MPH. Original tires on rig with less than 2500 miles on them. Just filed a complaint with safecar.gov website.

[Papa GLS]

Good info jackdn0610
At least now we have someone to file these reports with (safe car.gov). I personally did not know of this website, so now my question from a previous post has been answered, "what do we do?" But that still doesn't change the fact that every manufacturer is subject to having their product fail. I tend to agree with some of the other forum members who believe a lot of these issues are our own faults. Maybe we aren't doing quite as good a job of managing our tires as we think we are,ME included.

[Gyrogearloose]

I'm a little late to the party, but will add my experience to the list.
I've got a 2015 Rockwood 2604WS with less than 1000 miles on it.
Factory tires are Constancy LY188 205/75R14 LRC.
We had an unexplained tire failure somewhere between Gunnison, CO and Buena Vista, CO. Most likely this occurred on Monarch Pass.
Tire pressure was checked that morning, and tires visually inspected at a lunch stop before the failure.
Speeds were not excessive...you really can't speed on Monarch Pass.

Actions I took:
-filed complaint with NHTSA
-complained to Forest River
-bought a TPMS
-bought an infrared thermometer
-bought a set of Kumho 857 205/75R14 LRD tires

One thing I noticed is that the load rating of the factory tires has just barely the capacity to support my trailer when it's standing still. I revisited college Physics 101 and some civil engineering information on force vectors on curves. If my math is right, each time I take a curve at the posted advisory speed (yellow speed limit sign), I overstress my outside tires by about 350lbs each. The problem is that weight shifts to an outside wheel on curves. If tires are already marginal quality, and if they're loaded to the max by the manufacturer, this might explain some failures.

[Oaklevel]

Originally Posted by Gyrogearloose

I'm a little late to the party, but will add my experience to the list.
I've got a 2015 Rockwood 2604WS with less than 1000 miles on it.
Factory tires are Constancy LY188 205/75R14 LRC.
We had an unexplained tire failure somewhere between Gunnison, CO and Buena Vista, CO. Most likely this occurred on Monarch Pass.
Tire pressure was checked that morning, and tires visually inspected at a lunch stop before the failure.
Speeds were not excessive...you really can't speed on Monarch Pass.

Actions I took:
-filed complaint with NHTSA
-complained to Forest River
-bought a TPMS
-bought an infrared thermometer
-bought a set of Kumho 857 205/75R14 LRD tires

One thing I noticed is that the load rating of the factory tires has just barely the capacity to support my trailer when it's standing still. I revisited college Physics 101 and some civil engineering information on force vectors on curves. If my math is right, each time I take a curve at the posted advisory speed (yellow speed limit sign), I overstress my outside tires by about 350lbs each. The problem is that weight shifts to an outside wheel on curves. If tires are already marginal quality, and if they're loaded to the max by the manufacturer, this might explain some failures.

That's really interesting. Esp if you took into account tongue weight.