Tire sidewall safe temperature?

[Airdale]

Originally Posted by chriscowles

Can you elaborate on the comment about fore or aft? Does that mean I should measure the temp of the tread, rather than the sidewall? Or are you referring to measuring the wheel temp from behind the tire, rather than pointing the thermometer at the hub? I'm unclear as to what you're advising.



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If you suspect you have over heated your tires it's best to approach them from a fore or aft position. In all probability, the tire's sidewall will fail first so you don't want to be facing it in the event of a sudden failure.

Airdale

[Dgonzo]

I installed a TPMS on my Sanibel 3600 5th wheel. The RV came with those Goodyear Marathons. The TPMS did not alert me to any problems when my first tire failed (blowout). BUT it did for the next 3 tire failures and I was able to pull over. In each case per the tire service, the belts on the tires were separating. The TPMS reported leaks and in one case a rapid increase in pressure. He even tried to patch one but found the tire actually had 6 leaks!!! In each case i believe i was within minutes of a blowout and the resulting damage. The TPMS has paid for itself but after reading some of the replies on this subject I may just to go out and buy one of those IR guns. Replaced those tires Bridestone R250 LTs.

[Witch Doctor]

I learned something here as I always do, that is where to shoot my IR. I still think that the hub is the important reading. I have the 507 system also that will tell me the tire PSI and the Temp internal. It will also warn me if the PSI is losing pressure such as from a leak like a nail driving down the road that I picked up. Without that I wouldn't have the slightest idea. In conclusion I think that both a IR gun and a tpm system is best. If you have a blowout the tpm system will sound an alarm knowing you have a problem so you can pull off the road before you tear something up hopefully. But I still like to use the gun to see how hot the hubs are and tires. The tire is bolted to the hub, so it must transfer heat to the tire. I like the the system but also like to see real time temps when I stop at a rest stop or to fuel up. I think people put to much trust in the monitor system only, but to each there own....there is no wrong or right, just what makes you comfortable driving down the highway for you and yours safety and the rest of the world driving on the same by-way.....

[Tireman9]

Originally Posted by kerrlakelover

Seeing that my 3rd cousin is Forrest Gump, "I'm not a verah smort mayan." But, aren't we way over thinking this? I totally get all the technical conversation and agree that it would be best to pick up a TPM system. However, if you are using an IR gun, as I do, all I'm looking for is a tire, hub, or brake drum that has a temp that is out of line with the other 3 tires, hubs, or drums. And, I really don't care how hot they are if they are all close in temperature. It will be a very rare instance that all 4 tires, hubs, or drums will be running dangerously hot. (Example is when I had a sticking brake, that drum was way hotter than the other 3 drums.) So, bottom line, with my IR gun, I'm just looking for anything that is out of line with the others. Am I over simplifying this?

My point with the color pictures was to show that if you don't make an effort to take the tire temperature in the correct location you will get incorrect and misleading numbers.
If you said you were sick and someone decided to take your temperature with a thermometer stuck between your toes would you think that is good or proper Medical procedure?

I have no desire to overload anyone with too much technology. BUT it seems that for many simply owning an RV for a number of years and having used a few dozen tires seems to outweigh 40 years of being responsible for designing, testing and approving hundreds of tire designs and having done failed tire "autopsies" on about 20,000 tires so they simply choose to ignore the science and facts and choose to go with their gut feel. Then when they have a tire failure it seems like the reason for the failure was some sort of magic.
I offer the data in an effort to provide facts as some simply do not want to accept my "expert" opinion. NOTE To be an "Expert" you have to be judged so by legal authorities not your own opinion of yourself.

As I have said IR guns are fine for materials that conduct heat like metal hubs and wheels. Maybe if you think of it this way. Take a wood match and strike it. You can still hold one end even though the other is about 600°F so even though the distance is less than a couple of inches you will not feel the temperature of the burning wood. However take a piece of metal the same length as the match. heat one end to 600°F. Do you want to touch the other end?

[Tireman9]

Anyone that uses an IR gun, have one that tells you the temperature while running?
Since a tire can loose enough air in just a few minutes to result in a catastrophic Run Low Flex how will checking the tire with the IR gun once every couple of hours handle the other 110 minutes of driving?

[Tireman9]

Originally Posted by Jim34RL

I am old school and a retired engineer who has been pulling trails since the 70's when our first trailer was a COX popup.

We would not even be having this discussion if was not for the Ford/Firestone tire fiscal of the late 90's.
Agree. maybe if Ford has specked more that 26 psi when 30 was needed the vehicle might not have rolled over. Toyota trucks had identical tires but didn't roll over.

I know new things come along but how did we manage without them in the past? I for one do not use nor do I like TPMS it is an electronic device that can easy provide false positives and the end user becomes complacent do to this technology.
Technology didn't exist in 1995 for TPMS at consumer level. Like asking how did we manage before the Internet or computers. I for one like having real time gauge. Like having engine temp and oil pressure gauge. How did cars function before idiot lights?

I did have a tire failure when pulling a 5er once. We had just left the campground and the tires and lug nut torques where checked before we left. We had just entered the interstate and the tire exploded tire had less than 500 miles on it. TPMS would not have caught this tire failure it was sudden and total. Have to ask. What was the tire inflation 3 min before the tire failure? Since than in the last four years I have not had any issues at all with the trailer tires they were Michelins XPS Ribs LT tires on that trailer.

I also use an IR heat gun but I check abnormalities between tires and hubs and brakes. Looking for an out of normal range between them if one tire on the same side is between say 10 and 15 deg's warm than the other I have an issues within +/- 5 than I do not.

Wonder how hot the tire has to get before you consider it a potential problem or you are only concerned when there is a difference with one tire say at 115 and three at 105.

[f5moab]

Technology was there, but costs were high as is normal with any new technology. Europeans used them as early as 1986 on expensive cars, GM, I believe was the first to use the on a car; 1991 Vette.

And some used an averaging; indirect system that was primarily worthless. When the Feds passed the TREAD act (TREAD meaning Transportation Recall Enhancement Accountability and Documentaion) only direct reading sensors were approved.

It was not a requirement to tell the driver what tire was low. Just that A TIRE was low. My H3 was not corner specific, while my Vettes, Silverados were/are corner specific.

But keep the info on tires coming. I like to learn what is going on.

[Dgonzo]

Your pictures make a lot of sense. When my TPMS reported a leak I pulled over immediately. The tire was leaking right where the tread met the sidewall. After looking at your pictures I see that is one of the hottest spots on the tire. Thanks for the info....

[Jim34RL]

Originally Posted by Tireman9

Wonder how hot the tire has to get before you consider it a potential problem or you are only concerned when there is a difference with one tire say at 115 and three at 105.

No;I check between two tires on one side only if there is a difference of 10 deg's between them than I may have an issue. I have used statistical analysis from pulling trailers over many years to determine that spread. Not for every one.

To answer your other question the tire was aired to 80 psi max cold inflation pressure before leaving the camp ground. All tires were at 80 psi on the trailer and lug nut torqu was check to a static torque value not dynamic. The tire failed not more then 10 to 15mins after leaving the camp ground.

[siskom]

I have been towing things from cars to boats for many years and now drive a MH. Tires are not infallible you can always end up with a defected tire but rule of thumb every tripmake sure tire pressure is right, check what is recommended from trailer or motor home manufacturer and compare that to what is stamped on the side wall of the tire for pressure when cold. If you keep tires between those limits you will find when you stop on road to check they should be warm not hot to touch.

[Long Leaf Piners]

Since tire failure is always such a point of contention here (I too am looking to replace my factory tires and upgrade on our fifth), I thought this recent post from The Car Guys might be of some interest. (Old Coot, Turbes?)
"A Carlisle Tire pressurized to over 165psi. When you figure this tire has been out in the sun for more than 15 years, that is a damn fine showing. Failed at an old tire plug. (white is water vapor with light reflecting)." Poster's comments, not The Car Guys.

Watch A Tire Explode At 170 PSI In Slow Motion