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Old 12-23-2016, 08:36 PM   #1
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Why won't Forest River react to customer demand?

I see repeated threads about how we customers want a rear hitch.

Also a need for an electric heater that works below 40 degrees.

Do any A frames have these things? Why does F.R. not respond to our needs? I find it strange.
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Old 12-23-2016, 09:12 PM   #2
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In case you don't know, this Forum is NOT affiliated with Forest River Inc.

So there should be no expectation that anyone from FR, reads posts here.
There are a handful of FR employees who are members
But they do it by their own choice, usually because they care about customers of the FR brand they work for.
Which means only about 5 or 6 brands.

I can tell you that none of them are from the A-frame division.

Since A-frames have a similar chassis to popups, which also don't have rear hitches, it's probably because they aren't strong enough to carry things.
I've never seen any manufacturer's A-frames or popups with such a thing.
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Old 12-23-2016, 09:13 PM   #3
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Rear mount hitch may be a liability issue not to mention it would add expense to a unit that not everyone would be willing to pay for.

By electric heater do you mean heat pump? To the best of my knowledge no one makes an RV heat pump that works below 40°. Ceramic heaters work well, then there is always the LP furnaces.

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Old 12-23-2016, 09:18 PM   #4
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I mean an electric heater, NOT a heat pump. How many posts have we seen about "my heater didn't work when it got below 40 degrees."

We use a $15 electric heater as our solution. How hard would that be to put that ability into the air conditioner unit somehow?

I'm just asking my fellow members here if they think it as strange as I do.

And companies are always trying to get you to get upgrades. I would pay $300 more for a workable hitch that I could hang my bikes on. We've seen the after market solutions that people have done. So we know it's possible.
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Old 12-23-2016, 09:53 PM   #5
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After market yes. FR probably doesn't want to take on the liability.

They do make an A/C unit with an electric heat strip, but it is limited in the amount of heat it will produce. With electric heat you are limited by the total number of amps available. A small cube heater pulls 12 amps, to get enough heat from electric to keep something warm you would have to double or triple that and then you wouldn't have power for anything else, like the converter, fridge or plugs. Most small RV's only have a total capacity of 30 amps.

Unfortunately RV's are all a compromise, you have to decide what you want and buy accordingly.

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Old 12-23-2016, 10:31 PM   #6
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I'm not buying the Liability explanation. They sell tires that could blow up. They sell propane systems that could blow up. There is lots of liability exposure that they have to deal with. Just build a hitch that is tied in with the frame and can handle things. Dang it! lol
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Old 12-23-2016, 11:19 PM   #7
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You can buy an electric element to install in the plenum of your gas furnace, but it's fairly expensive, as I recall. Space heaters are much cheaper.

http://www.rvcomfortsystems.com/imag...fe_dec2013.pdf

This one is $600:

https://www.amazon.com/RV-Electric-H...Q88F2CPCXNEW4A
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Old 12-24-2016, 06:24 AM   #8
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As far as the hitch in the rear I am sure on the A Frames it could just be a strength issue.
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Old 12-24-2016, 06:53 AM   #9
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Since someone else mentioned the connection between A-frames and pop-ups, here's my experience with rear hitches and pop-ups. Our Starcraft (bought used) had a rear hitch (that looked like factory) so I said great, let's buy a bike rack and take the kid's bikes with us. We did it once. My trailer that would tow rock steady at 120 kmph suddenly became very "loose" at anything over 105 kmph. We only had two small bikes on it (i'm guessing less than 75 lbs) so you wouldn't think it would make any difference but boy was I wrong. So if the A-frame handles like a pop-up due to the similarities between the chassis types, I wouldn't try adding anything on a rear hitch.
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Old 12-24-2016, 10:22 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ontherock View Post
Since someone else mentioned the connection between A-frames and pop-ups, here's my experience with rear hitches and pop-ups. Our Starcraft (bought used) had a rear hitch (that looked like factory) so I said great, let's buy a bike rack and take the kid's bikes with us. We did it once. My trailer that would tow rock steady at 120 kmph suddenly became very "loose" at anything over 105 kmph. We only had two small bikes on it (i'm guessing less than 75 lbs) so you wouldn't think it would make any difference but boy was I wrong. So if the A-frame handles like a pop-up due to the similarities between the chassis types, I wouldn't try adding anything on a rear hitch.
Your problem was that you put a lot of weight on the back, unloading the tongue, and didn't compensate by moving other weight forward. Even 75-100 lbs on the back of a PUP makes a big difference. Not so much on a larger trailer.

I didn't know any better at the time and did the same thing with my Coleman PUP back in the 90's. I put 4 bikes on the back, so probably at least 100 lbs and I got a lot of sway at anything over 60 mph. I ended up with a Reese version of one of these:



This video will show your problem quite vividly:

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Old 12-24-2016, 10:34 AM   #11
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Our first trailer was a little 16 foot ultralight. We put a bike rack on the back of it and our first trip out it waged its tail like a dog. We had to stop and take the bikes off the back and put them inside the trailer just to get home . Adding bike racks to the back end of a very light trailer is a bad idea .
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Old 12-24-2016, 10:42 AM   #12
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If you have ever driven behind a small to medium size trailer with a bike rack on the rear bumper, you would not want to put anything of value back there. That said, I think ( as others) that the real reason a rear hitch is not an option is liability. If there is a hitch on the bumper someone will overload it and cause an issue. Years ago Harley Davidson prohibited their dealers from selling motorcycles with a trailer hitch for liability reasons.
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Old 12-24-2016, 11:22 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockfordroo View Post
Your problem was that you put a lot of weight on the back, unloading the tongue, and didn't compensate by moving other weight forward. Even 75-100 lbs on the back of a PUP makes a big difference. Not so much on a larger trailer.

I didn't know any better at the time and did the same thing with my Coleman PUP back in the 90's. I put 4 bikes on the back, so probably at least 100 lbs and I got a lot of sway at anything over 60 mph. I ended up with a Reese version of one of these:



This video will show your problem quite vividly:

Great video!!!!
I did try to compensate for the extra rear weight by moving a storage container inside the pup to the very front of the trailer box but, to be honest, I really didn't do any calculations with regard to balancing the downward force on the tongue; it was more of an afterthought rather than a deliberate act. After seeing the video, it was easy to see what I did wrong. Maybe this video should be posted as a "sticky" on the pop-up site to warn / educate owners of this danger. Again, thanks!
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Old 12-24-2016, 11:29 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tipper View Post
I see repeated threads about how we customers want a rear hitch.

Also a need for an electric heater that works below 40 degrees.

Do any A frames have these things? Why does F.R. not respond to our needs? I find it strange.
Most of the ultra lite 5th wheel RV's don't come with a hitch on the back of the trailer. I would guess that the frame isn't strong enough and not wanting to unload the pin weight.
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Old 12-24-2016, 01:39 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoneDude 8289 View Post
Most of the ultra lite 5th wheel RV's don't come with a hitch on the back of the trailer. I would guess that the frame isn't strong enough and not wanting to unload the pin weight.
Even more so for the OP, since he has a small ultralight A-frame trailer.
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Old 12-24-2016, 02:12 PM   #16
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Also, in some states you are allowed to tow triples. My 2012 40ft 5th Sanibel came with a 2" hitch that looked plenty stable enough to me to tow an additional vehicle; i.e. my aluminum boat. After several inquires I was advised it was not intended or strong enough to do so, it was just intended as a Bike rack. After 2012 they discontinued the hitch on their 5th wheels. Disagree or not, it is clearly a liability issue on their part.
RE the water heater, I have used my electric water heater several times in below 40 degree weather and it worked just fine??
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Old 12-24-2016, 02:26 PM   #17
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Disagree or not, it is clearly a liability issue on their part.


RE the water heater, I have used my electric water heater several times in below 40 degree weather and it worked just fine??
I agree totally on the liability issue.

Uhhh, I don't think anyone has been talking about the water heater.
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Old 12-24-2016, 02:32 PM   #18
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Designers

Designers of rv's are not viable users so what looks good on paper to them does not in reality work......
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Old 12-24-2016, 03:36 PM   #19
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Most TT and 5er frames aren't strong enough to support and hitch plus whatever crappie the unknowing would try to hang on it or attach to it. Hugh liability for the manufacturer.
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Old 12-24-2016, 04:13 PM   #20
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I would think liability because if they put one on for say 50lbs and some labels to say so then people tend to put more than it was designed for as far as liability for water heaters and propane tanks etc. they are all designed to be safely used by the design. they cannot be used differently then designed unlike the hitch which can be. and I know most people never read those little labels on their hitches.
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