First night. What a disappointment!!!!

[Arefbee]

Originally Posted by Ebirep

2015 FR3 30DS

My family was so excited with our move from a toy hauler to a class A. Figured we should take it out for a night before loading it up just in case. What a disappointing first outing. Apparently my dealers idea of a pre delivery inspection is aiming a garden hose at the thing to knock off the dirt! We're not new to the RV world and realize how these things are built but this lack of inspection is over the top. My excitement in my choice of builder has faded rather quickly.

-Front door binding causing undo force to open and close
-kitchen sink leaking into cabinet
-Bathroom sink plumbing leaking so bad it quickly runs out on to floor. Tried tightening and didn't do a thing.
-only one family member was able to shower because it leaked so bad out the bottom of the shower track and beneath the shower unit where is meets the floor that water ran all the way to the back wall of the bedroom.
- heater worked well but when it reached temperature the fan would not shut off. Just ran constantly.
-freezer door outside panel dislodges every time you close it.
-A couple of the window coverings are too short to cover the window opening.
-large chip in the dinette top that we didn't notice when we picked it up.
-Outdoor TVs connection to the antenna is no good.
-horrible rattle under RV while driving. Sounds like the stairs but they are rock solid when you grab them.

And other minor issues. On the bright side it is a really comfortable inside and roomy for a 30 foot model. I hope my dealer doesn't make me wait forever to resolve these issues. Forest River get a clue. You obviously have people slapping these together with zero pride in workmanship!

Thank You to the Forum. It was a great source for research before I made my purchase. Sounds like the majority has had better luck then I.


Adam

Basically it does appear the dealer did half job on the PDI, leaving you to do a post deal inspection. Sorry you got burned, but at least you learned early what kind of operation they run.
There are a few videos out there showing the process of building an RV. It is a daunting task; a lot needs to be done and they are not like cars where every one is the same.
It would be nice if they could have one guy do one job so there was assurance that was all he had to focus on but until they start to build in Mexico or further south, they will have one guy do twenty jobs as fast as possible.
Frankly, if it wasn't for the issues that you can expect with such a complex unit, this forum would consist of two guys with a checker board on a barrel in a campground store some where. The issues and challenges of RVing are built in and include these issues. It does sound like your unit had an apprentice plumber on his first day being trained by and apprentice plumber on his second day. Afraid that is why there is a PDI process instead of turnkey delivery.
Try to stay positive, work with the dealer (but keep an eye on them) and focus on the family fun you got the rig for.

Just curious. Did you buy your previous rig new or used?

[mikkeeh]

Quality control does not exist. There is no reason for it. Products without quality control....built by people without any pride in their product, are cheaper to build....leaves more room for the big companies to profit...and THATS the bottom line.
The manufacturers have NO reason to change and improve quality and craftsmanship. People buy them anyway. No one is ever accountable. The manufacturer says "see your dealer for problem resolution." The dealer says "I cant get help from the manufacturer." or just jerks the customer around. At some point, you either fix it yourself.......live with it.....or resell it.
Now.....There a few few good dealers out there......but they're few and far between.
The American people have agreed to accept sub-standard...in RV's, in autos, in most everything. We just accept the fact the "things aren't built like they used to be."
Unfortunately, I don"t see that changing in the future.

[auntieshoes]

Originally Posted by mikkeeh

Quality control does not exist. There is no reason for it. Products without quality control....built by people without any pride in their product, are cheaper to build....leaves more room for the big companies to profit...and THATS the bottom line.
The manufacturers have NO reason to change and improve quality and craftsmanship. People buy them anyway. No one is ever accountable. The manufacturer says "see your dealer for problem resolution." The dealer says "I cant get help from the manufacturer." or just jerks the customer around. At some point, you either fix it yourself.......live with it.....or resell it.
Now.....There a few few good dealers out there......but they're few and far between.
The American people have agreed to accept sub-standard...in RV's, in autos, in most everything. We just accept the fact the "things aren't built like they used to be."
Unfortunately, I don"t see that changing in the future.

Your point is proven by the people who post that they have read the posts on this forum and bought one anyway. If I had seen all of this before our impulse buy I would not have bought the FR3. That said, now that all of our known problems are fixed (or have been explained that "that's just the way these things are" referring to the chassis AC not being able to actually provide cool air) we love the RV.


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[z3406]

I am attaching a copy of the PDI checklist I used when I picked my unit up. If I was you I'ld make a copy of this and go over the unit with your dealer when you are there. You should have seen the look on my dealers face when I pulled my clipboard out with this on it and started going over the unit.

[camaraderie]

May I suggest adding a video camera or GoPro type recording during the PDI. That way one has documentation of how things are put together, things that were wrong, how things work and a visual record of any damage.
I've gone back to mine several times just for operating knowledge since purchase.

[drivmsafe]

PDI's are supposed to be done with you present. If not done with you, make them do it, again, with you there. Don't let the dealer BS you.


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[bigben]

We purchased our Georgetown from a local dealer after we'd shopped it with other dealers in a 200 mile radius. I am amazed that you can with a bit of work enjoy a 30%-40% discount off the MSRP. Not sure where the bigger fiction lays - in the markup, dealer numbers, etc. Our dealer is turning and burning. The young man we worked with was pleasant, not well informed but very driven. Having been a couple of those things myself in the last 60+ years, I get it. So it will always be buyer well informed and beware. After looking across a lot of web sources to find the least amount of bias possible, we decided on the Georgetown based on our needs. This forum more than any others prepared me to take delivery. Cautions from many of the senior members really readied us to be our own best advocate.

Not saying that dealers are terrible, just for the most part their goals don't align with the buyers best interest.

So you MUST be your own best advocate and go into the delivery with eyes wide open. After you take delivery and stuff starts to loosen or rattle - once again come back to this forum and ask. Wonderful folks here that will help. Just remember there is no magic bullet for maintaining this house on wheels. Stuff happens at 65-70 mph. You may even elect to go back to traveling based on hotels. Not a problem. Most of the folks that enjoy the RV travel lifestyle (myself included) are your basic tinkers.

Still sorry to hear your horrid experiences

All the best.

[speedjester]

I really wasn't well versed on MH..Salesman assured me that they would check unit out for me before I took it.... I wanted someone that would look after my better interest So I hired a company to come out and look at the coach .. They spent a few hrs and went under and over everything on the coach.. As the walked around checking things the explained everything and how it worked to me...They then made a list of things that needed to be addressed.... I handed that list to salesman... He agreed to make said repairs.... He insisted that I would have to pay for coach first(I was paying cash) before any repairs were done.. .. I explained to him that wasn't happening.... 3 weeks later I went to pick up my coach( they had it all ready even registered).. Tech went over unit briefly.. I confirmed repairs and handed sales manager a cashier check.. So far knock on wood ..7k miles in the last 3 month and no major issues..


If its on the lot..Best thing to do is hire someone to check the unit out... These units are somewhat of sizable investment.... Im sure you wouldn't drop 100-150k on a house without hiring a home inspector first....

[bigben]

Amen

[drivmsafe]

Originally Posted by bigben

Amen

Having another set of eyes, other than the dealer, is a good idea weather buying a new rig or used.

Bigben....Thank you for your service!!

[F and E Damp]

It's not just a QC problem it's a design engineering issue also. I don't know for sure about recent graduates, but I got a lot of exposure during my early career to the concept of "design it so it can't be screwed up on the shop floor".

My experience with our '02 Georgetown suggests that a lot of the "design" is made up by the shop guys as they go along. One example - the overhead cabinets in the dinette slide out were attached by 3/4" wood-screws to the thin lauan plywood skin on the styrofoam ceiling insulation. Only ONE longer screw into any primary structure in 12' of cabinet!

A second one - the wiring for many items was not done to any color code. Some DC wiring had white wires for positive, some were green, some were black and a few were orange. Every time i had to work on a circuit, I had to use a meter to be sure which was which.

We bought it used, so I don't know what the original owners had to have done under warranty. We're retiring from the RV life and won't be buying another one, but if we change our minds it won't be another FR product.

[jamesroadking]

PDI's only catch the obvious / cosmetic issues. You don't find out that the slide out leak until you get into a major down pour etc. My main issue was that the air ride suspension was so rough riding on our class A motor coach that it would cause the windshield to pop out along the top edge of the glass, I'd have to stop and get a step ladder out and duct tape it to keep the windshield from falling completely out. Did this 5 times diving cross country, stopping at Monaco dealers, service centers, and even the factory could not keep it from happening. They'd 4 corner weighed the coach, adjust the air ride so many times, new gaskets around the wind shield, replaced the shocks, etc. I talked with the design engineer at the Monaco factory and, your not going to believe me but, he finally told me that it "was a known issue with that model" . I even tried talking with the Monaco corporate management about trading it in with cash for a more expensive model, the only way that they agree with that, is if I'd take the big hit on the trade in. Eventually I did a voluntary repossession.

[The_Rhino]

Our dealer let us look at look at new RVs that just arrived on their lot & I was surprised to find that one was leaking badly during a heavy rain, others had trim falling off, and most had saw dust all over the floor... Some of the worst were Keystone products... The FR products were the better of the two...

Therefore we bought a slightly used TT because I didn't want to waste our first summer camping having the dealer finish building our TT... Before buying, I spent 2 hours looking at in in a rain storm (no leaks!) and then had the dealer perform a thorough 2 hour PDI. Every major system was tested & I videotaped everything. The dealer even did a pressure test & caulked a few areas that showed air leaks-but no water leaks during the heavy rain...

IMO buying slightly used meant more time camping. I figured the previous owner spent their time having warranty work done... With the money saved buying used vs. new we can basically replace the A/C, fridge, etc. and still be money ahead...