First Trip with Grey Wolf 17BH Not Good

[Flybob]

Not sure how you measured the 10 gals of water you added to the FW tank (assume you meant FW tank and not grey tank), but what you saw is what I would expect. WH holds approx 6gals and water lines another 1.5-2 gallons. Then there is some quantity of water that you can never get out of the FW tank because of the level of the pickup. As for the towing, it appears that you are exceeding the capacities of the TV. In addition of the added weight on the back of the TT is causing some of the issues you are seeing. I would never add that kind of weight on the back of a Grey Wolf 17. I know that this may not be what you want to hear. When dealing with tow capacity and TV you can not defeat the laws of physics. I would look at a larger TV and carrying the bike in the TV vs the back rack.

[SeaDog]

Did you ever consider he (the husband) may just not know his system, which is not uncommon in the RV community. No one has said that a check valve failure wouldn't fill the FW tank what is being said is you are assuming the tank was filling when that was never stated.

[carbuthn]

JohnD10, That was why I stated "As others have also mentioned" the check in the pump should prevent filling the fresh water tank. I agree.

My Toy Hauler (2008 Cyclone 3750) was plumbed so that the winterizing system would use a hose attached to the city water connection through a 3 way valve (normal position went to the faucets and water heater, the other to the pump suction) and a second valve that isolate the pump suction from the fresh water tank.

You could then connect a short hose from the city water connection into a bucket or jug of RV anti freeze and use the pump to fill the hoses and water heater with anti freeze.

[JohnD10]

Originally Posted by carbuthn

JohnD10, That was why I stated "As others have also mentioned" the check in the pump should prevent filling the fresh water tank. I agree.

My Toy Hauler (2008 Cyclone 3750) was plumbed so that the winterizing system would use a hose attached to the city water connection through a 3 way valve (normal position went to the faucets and water heater, the other to the pump suction) and a second valve that isolate the pump suction from the fresh water tank.

You could then connect a short hose from the city water connection into a bucket or jug of RV anti freeze and use the pump to fill the hoses and water heater with anti freeze.

Yes...the Anderson Valve.

Which will also fill up the fresh water tank when the Anderson Valve goes bad.

Same thing, but different name...

[RCSP]

Thanks for all the help! I did mean that I added 10gal to the fresh water tank not the grey tank. I started weighing things just for fun, the rear rack which is huge weighs 72lb. It is removable with 4 pins. If I put my Harbor Freight carrier back there



https://www.harborfreight.com/400-lb...ier-62837.html


it weighs 39lb and I'd need to weld a 2" receiver to the rear frame of the TT. So about a 30lb reduction. The 2nd propane tank is 39lb. I could even remove the stabilizer jacks (electric) if I have to. I should empty the grey tank and fill up with water once I am near my destination. Would it be a good idea to move the propane tank into the TT above the axles (39lb)?

[carbuthn]

Unless you travel by yourself I don't recommend removing the stabilizer jacks. Most end up wanting to add additional / better stabilizers. Anyone moving in the trailer or a pet will feel like an earthquake. Unless you are a real heavy sleeper it will wake you up at night. Or worse yet wake a significant other.

[Bedlinedf250]

I wouldn't be to worried about what your doing to the camper more of what's going on with the tow vehicle. Look at the weight rating of the vehicle on the door sticker. Also check the tires meaning the load rating. A million people think just cause it says it can tow 5000lbs means you could get right there far from the fact. You have to take into consideration everything in the vehicle, people, coolers, pets supplies everything.
I have a 2017 f250 with the diesel engine and heavy duty springs front and back book says I could pull 15,000 maybe a lil more I personally won't go above 11-12 just for safety reasons. Besides I have a family of 5 so there's a lot of weight on the truck with people I coolers and everything else. Yes a f150 could have pulled my camper but probably not with all the stuff I take along with us. The tow capacity isn't the factor the payload is.
Also if you just got the Highlander don't kill it right away. I imagine your paying for it for a couple years try and get it to last that long. Maybe invest in an older 1/2 ton that is cheap and will get the job done besides you'll only use it for camping so if it gets a lil dirty who cares it's not the new car.

[Bedlinedf250]

Oh and it's not always about getting the camper to move but also slowing it down. I've seen a pit bull pull a car, I bet a $1,000,000 he can't stop it from rolling. Just be careful out there.

[D W]

Originally Posted by RCSP

Thanks for all the help! I did mean that I added 10gal to the fresh water tank not the grey tank. I started weighing things just for fun, the rear rack which is huge weighs 72lb. It is removable with 4 pins. If I put my Harbor Freight carrier back there



https://www.harborfreight.com/400-lb...ier-62837.html


it weighs 39lb and I'd need to weld a 2" receiver to the rear frame of the TT. So about a 30lb reduction. The 2nd propane tank is 39lb. I could even remove the stabilizer jacks (electric) if I have to. I should empty the grey tank and fill up with water once I am near my destination. Would it be a good idea to move the propane tank into the TT above the axles (39lb)?

Remove the stabilizer jacks?

[Tanderson18]

i agree with a couple of the post here, first your highlander is not enough truck to pull your trailer, you are 2500 lbs over your tow weight and thats not including your gear and water. you are lucky that your trailer was not dancing behind your suv. as far as the city water goes its just the the other person said if you hook up city water and it fills your fresh water tank you have a bad valve. i see it said you just bought your highlander and i know you will loose money but trade it in for a truck. and i would say get something that is double the towing capacity of what your trailer is. because you have to add in all your gear, water, and so on. i aways say more is better then less. and in this case i am not saying this to scare you but you are risking your own life and those traveling down the road with you.

[Rpod4hel]

I agree with TerryLittle. I'm pulling a Rpod 179 I just got recently with a Kia Sorento V6 AWD rated at 5000 also. The 179 tops out at 3780 GVWR. I wanted a lot of margin because of the mountain camping I'll do.

[emoney]

Don’t forget to open just the hot water faucets to fill the water heater first btw. City water connections won’t fill the FW tank unless something is broken. I would definitely head to the scales because that unit has a GVWR of over 7k lbs. I’d guess with the motorcycle on the back and water you mayve gone over the 5k the Highlander is rated at. Definitely time for a new TV

[Boborc]

The grey wolf is 3700 and change on the brochure(stripped down model). Look inside a cabinet or on the screen door you should see a yellow sticker with the weight out of the factory. That is what is weighs with common accessories (microwave,tv,etc). Usually you can add 3 to 500 lbs for that. I have the same trailer it is 4155 out of factory(no propane or battery,etc). Now add 4 to 600 lbs of camping supplies plus people,food, and cycle. You are maxed out if not over. Has a general rule when shopping add 1k to the yellow sticker to get an idea of how much weight you will be pulling be without people. Then get to a scale and find out exactly what you have. You should be 10% under the max weight you are rated for as a buffer. I pull the trailer with a Mid sise pick up rated for 7k and have no trouble with a equalizer hitch. I run between 5200 to 5400 lb loaded to go. only 2 people

[Egalt]

Originally Posted by Boomerweps

That is the GTWR. Specs state 3888 pounds dry weight. So with minimal loading, he can stay with his TV specs. Yes, a higher capacity TV would be MUCH better.

OP, your hot water heater is likely a 6 gallon unit, so there went that. Throw in the piping and 10 gallons doesn't go far. I find it best, unless dry camping, to travel with no water in the tanks. I think you meant fresh vice grey water tank. Grey water tank is the sink and shower drains. Plus, pay attention to where your tanks are for weight distribution, especially affecting tongue weight. Water is about 7# a gallon.

Technically - water is 8.34 lbs per gallon

[mrfikser]

Originally Posted by Egalt

Technically - water is 8.34 lbs per gallon

Wellll, not necessarily... if the water is from the faucet and contains a lot
of air, or if it is frozen that number gets a little flexible...just being a
dic*k here for the fun of it....

[mrfikser]

Originally Posted by RCSP

Thanks for the help! I'll take pictures when I am hooked up to the TT, hopefully later today. This is close to the hitch I have



https://www.curtmfg.com/part/17300



Mine is older and slightly different (the 2 large bolt holes are higher).

are you sure you have it (the to bar) set up correctly....to set it up, measure on level ground the height to the top of the inside of the ball hitch to the ground, now set the ball top height to that same setting while installed on the truck (trailer not on the ball)…. next raise the trailer hitch enough to back the truck/ball under the hitch and lower the hitch onto the ball so that all the weight from the hitch is on the ball nd latch the hitch(the rear of the TV should go down a few inches) .. now install the tow bars to their corresponding holders and chains (it may be easier if you use the front trailer hitch leveler to raise up the rear of the TV) , install the chains on the antisway part of the hitch and tighten them to about 3-4 links from the top (and raise the front hitch jack if you lowered it)...next measure the top of each wheel well to the ground for all 4 wheels on the TV, they should all be the same measurement (or within about 1/2 inch) if they are not the same (front and rear) either tighten or loosen the chains one link on each side...if you can't get the front and back perfect,it is better for the back to be a bit lower than the front...just making sure this adjustment might help your swaying a lot, even though you are still over loaded (which should be addressed)…. also tire pressures on the TV should be set to close to the maximum allowed on the rear of the truck (as stated on the tire, not the door of the truck) with the front being 5-10psi lower than the rear TV tires....next the trailer tires should be set at a MINIMUM to the maximum rating printed on the tire (depending on tire around 50psi for a 'c' rated tire) with it being acceptable (and even recommended if you are traveling in excess of 66mph (I think that is right) up to 10psi over the maximum psi rating on the tire ( I recommend the higher rating to improve handing/ gas mileage, keeping the tires running cooler, and wear of the tires)...these numbers are not made up by me, but by the tire manufacturers … if all this on your vehicle is correct you may find that all you fish tailing goes away...

[RCSP]

I think I understand all of this, I plan on using the camper this weekend, I'll be sure to follow your guideline to set the bars properly. Thank you for posting those instructions.


On a sad note, returning from my last trip I was following a car that was driving all over the road, crossing the center line, etc. I called the police and the driver was pulled over and was intoxicated.

[madatme]

Originally Posted by RCSP

I drove my Grey Wolf a few times locally at night to get used to it. Seemed fine. Top speed was 50mph.


I added 10gal of water to the gray tank which was empty. Figured that's all I need for an overnight trip. I think it all got pumped into the water heater because the faucets started working all the air out and then stopped pumping water totally. The tank level light (4 lights) was on light #2 initially. I checked again later after trying to get the air out of the system and just light #1 was lit. I had no water on my trip, that was OK I was at a friends cottage.



The big issue was the overall weight / tongue weight. I put my motorcycle on the rear fold down "Shelf" (Shero ST250 Trials bike). Cycle weighs about 160lbs. When I first left home I took some side roads instead of the freeway. Camper felt different than my test trips, less stable, bouncy. Only difference was the cycle, the 10 gallons of water, and the 25mph head wind. I figured I took too much weight off the tongue. I moved some items from the rear TT storage to the front TT storage area. The bounce pretty much went away. I drove about 130 miles at around 60mph in a 70mph speed limit into a head wind. My Highlander V6 struggled. Wasn't bad at 60 but I doubt it could do 70. Gas mileage went from normal 22.6 to 10.1.



I took the Highlander in to my Toyota dealer today and had the transmission firmware updated. Don't know if this will help with towing, but I could tell immediately it was much smoother, especially at low speeds it used to hesitate. They gave me a printout of the tire wear and said 3 of the 4 tires are a 6/10. I just had them checked a month ago and they were all 8 or 9. Could I have added that much wear in 2 days if the load was out of balance?



I am wondering if a tongue weight scale would help me. I have a new shiny WEN 3100W generator that needs to go with me in the future. I need to know where to put it. It will not fit in the storage areas (too tall).



I have a CAT scale location about 15 min away if I need to determine axle weights.


I sure hope the problem is that the Highlander just can't pull my Grey Wolf. I just bought the Highlander in April.


I want to take the TT to this same location this Friday but I am afraid to. Please help

first don't weld the bumper it's too thin, second I have a FR 18TO it weighs 3800lbs, my old TV was a Tacoma 4.0L v6, IT DID NOT HAVE ENOUGH POWER, it struggled severely, no power no brakes, wait till you get in the mountains, now I have a 1/2 ton, what a big difference, sorry to bust the bubble

[Teetime]

Originally Posted by Tanderson18

i agree with a couple of the post here, first your highlander is not enough truck to pull your trailer, you are 2500 lbs over your tow weight and thats not including your gear and water. you are lucky that your trailer was not dancing behind your suv. as far as the city water goes its just the the other person said if you hook up city water and it fills your fresh water tank you have a bad valve. i see it said you just bought your highlander and i know you will loose money but trade it in for a truck. and i would say get something that is double the towing capacity of what your trailer is. because you have to add in all your gear, water, and so on. i aways say more is better then less. and in this case i am not saying this to scare you but you are risking your own life and those traveling down the road with you.

I couldn't agree more. I had a 17BH, and towed with an F150, with an e2 WDH, which worked out well. But, I would not have less of a TV or more of a TT.

Also, if your check valve is leaking, just drain your fresh water tank before you tow.

Another thought, does your Highlander have a Brake Controller, and are you using the trailer brakes?

[JohnD10]

Originally Posted by Teetime

Also, if your check valve is leaking, just drain your fresh water tank before you tow.

Would like to know your thought pattern for this.

If the check valve is leaking and the fresh water tank is filling up through the city water connection and water pump, then NOT hooking up to city water and using the fresh water tank until a new check valve is installed would be the more prudent thing to do I would think.