Comparing a Seneca vs Dynamax Force

[steverkemp]

I am upgrading from my 16 Forrester and looking at an M2 chassis Super C with an over cab bunk. My Forrester dealer carries Senecas and I test drove the 37TS today. My wife fell in love with it and the floor plan but I'm not sold yet. There is just a higher level level of fit and finish on my Forrester 3171DS.

So, here I am in Dynamax central asking for perspectives of Dynamax owners who evaluated both units.

Mr Clemens, also feel free to sell me on the advantages of your product.

[Philos3]

I have looked at the Seneca, but I would probably buy the DX3 if I was to go that route to a super C. To me, its more an issue of what would be more suitable for extended travel...things that are not obvious/surface/appearances, like insulation, dual-pane windows, payload capacity, how they build the frame, etc.

[steverkemp]

Thanks for the reply. The over cab bunk is a must because of my 4 rowdy boys. We'll put no more than 5-7k in miles per year.

[FOURWHL]

If you're looking to tow be very aware of the chassis.

Force and Seneca both have a 33k combined rating and iirc weigh in mid to high 20's which means you're balancing towing with cargo to achieve that 10k rating and still stay under 33.

The Force HD and DX3 have a 54k combined weight rating which amounts to carry as much as you please and will still tow more than you can throw at it.

Just another consideration.

[letsgorving]

Agree. We looked at Force, Seneca, DX3, Verona. I really liked Seneca floor plan, but husband wouldn't consider it due to engine (read fourwhl comments above) Regular force same engine. Liked DX3 interior better than Verona, interior quality better than Force HD. Whatever you choose,go for bigger engine.

[murraym]

I test drove the Seneca and studied and crawled all over them at the dealership and I am happy that I chose the DX3 for not only the fuel capacity as well as the distance that it allows me to travel, but more importantly the 100 gallon water tank as well as the 50/50 gallon waste water tanks as apposed to the 75 35/35 water tanks on the Seneca. With four boys you are going to burn through that water. Also, if you live off of the generator during a trip like we do, the 100 gallon fuel tank will last a long while running 24/7 to power everything. I would advise you to get what you want and spend the money now instead of trying to sell the Seneca a year later after not being happy with it or losing money on trading it in.
I believe the Dynamax Force HD will give you the same look as the Seneca but with the heavier DX3 chassis but with the cabover that you require. I have a DX3 37BHHD. The cabover would have been nice, but we make due. We use ours for trade shows with up to 4 adults sleeping in it comfortably. Ive learned over the years of buying motorcycles that you are always going to want to trade up, so get what you want the first time and save the money and time. The fit and finish with the DX3 in my opinion is better than the fit and finish with the Seneca because of the heavier rating of the DX3. Jayco has to use lighter weight materials for the Seneca due to the lighter rating. I had a Jayco Octane toy hauler that I sold to get the Super C and the materials were very similar to the Seneca. More faux looking than the real deal that the DX3 is able to install as a result of 54k as FOURWHL mentioned. That as well as the ABS air brakes, 8K Onan Generator, water and fuel capacities, and more bang for your buck. To me it was as if the Seneca was more of an entry level Super C Light so that you could say that you have a Super C, but you don't really get the true benefits of a true Super C. Its definitely worth it.

[Jetjockey6]

I compared the two when I bought my 2015 Force 37BH. No comparison in the build quality. The Force roof is far better built than the Seneca; air gauges in the Force for both air systems, none on the Seneca. The Seneca is built to the lowest Super C
price point...Force is not. I have had some serious factory-related issues with my Force but Dynamax fixed everything. The fuel capacity of the Force (80 gallons) is a weak point but other than that the RV is fine. I have 23,000 miles on it in
21 months. Full-timing for the next few months. I tow a 2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland at about 4300 lbs and still get 9.2 (at 65mph) mpg not using the cruise.
For some reason the cruise costs me 1mpg. Not towing the Jeep gives me a full 2mpg more.
The DX series is several levels above the Force in build quality.

[volzalum]

If you order what you want, you can also get the cab over bunk installed on a DX3 ...

[steverkemp]

Awesome feedback everyone! Thank you very much!!!

[carlb]

So I was just at the Tampa RV show, and I looked at the Seneca and the force HD bunkhouse models. As a current Jayco Greyhawk owner, I noticed the same level of poor carpentry used in the Seneca at a price point nearly $100k more than what I bought the GreyHawk for. A telling example of the poor carpentry was a closet door that "fell off" during the show. Sure shows are rough, but it is a great concentrated stress test.... Also when I went back outside the unit, I saw some of the seal from the slide just laying over as if it was coming unglued or had ripped.

Meanwhile the things that made me sit up straight in my chair for the force hd, it was already set up with AGM house batteries, a charge controller, and two solar panels. Additionally the windows are dual pane, meaning that the Windows will no longer be a source of thermal loss/gain like what I have now. Only detractor for the force hd was that all of the lower door hardware was already corroding. Doug Schroeder was the Forest River rep in the unit and the show price was awesome.

[shultz01]

I'll attest to what others are saying...I own a 2014 Seneca and I'm undoubtedly going to sell our Seneca to purchase a 2018 Force HD. We have a bunkhouse model now (37FS) and will not only be switching manufacturers, but floor plans as well to the 37TS.

I'm going to order the Force from Dylan's RV in NJ which is the closest to us in Pennsylvania and hope to have our Seneca sold by the time it comes in for close to what we owe on it. As the other forum member said, I know I'm going to pay the price.

It looks like the Force HD comes or can be ordered with all the things I've added to our Seneca: Winegard Trav'ler system for HD DirecTV, Air fill accessory port, CB, Air horn, Blu-Ray player. And it has all the things I'd like to add but can't: Air seats, Air brakes, 54K GVWR, Tile floors, Larger water, black and gray storage...And most importantly--better fit, finish and workmanship.

There is an air accessory port on the 2018 Force HD 37TS, right?

Can you order it with the Norcold propane/electric frig?

I confirmed I can order it with the Winegard Trav'ler system. Other than that, I really don't think there's much else we need to order special. We like it with the two opposing couches...one being a hide-a-bed.

The hide-a-bed will be available in 2018 as well?

Thanks all!

[bclemens]

Originally Posted by steverkemp

I am upgrading from my 16 Forrester and looking at an M2 chassis Super C with an over cab bunk. My Forrester dealer carries Senecas and I test drove the 37TS today. My wife fell in love with it and the floor plan but I'm not sold yet. There is just a higher level level of fit and finish on my Forrester 3171DS.

So, here I am in Dynamax central asking for perspectives of Dynamax owners who evaluated both units.

Mr Clemens, also feel free to sell me on the advantages of your product.

Sorry for the delay...I must have missed this thread over the weekend.

I worked for the Forester division for about 11 years. Sales rep, product manager, national sales manager. So I was still probably there when your 16 was designed. The same design style is being used at Dynamax...keep things simple and clean so that the customer can fine tune to their taste (no matter what their taste). I just have a little more money to spend on the materials over here.

From a fit an finish perspective, no ones perfect, but I have walked a lot of product and I would put our Force up against anything out there. Also, at that price point...I'm not sure why people try to "de-content" the unit. To keep the price low, they will take out features that we had in a Forester for half or a third of the price.

Shultz01. Force HD has the air accessory port. You can order with the RV fridge, but it is the Dometic last time I checked. (I did not like the Norcold because the freezer was two separate, small compartments...although I think they have changed that). The hide-a-bed is still there for 2018 on the main sofa. It's a Tri-fold actually. The thin foam Hide-a-bed mattresses are not comfortable. The air mattresses always leak, so we went Tri-Fold. Which is there the base extends out, the back folds down and cushions fill in the gap...so you end up on an all foam mattress that is bigger than a jack-knife but no bar in your bag like a hide-a-bed.

[shultz01]

BClemens. Thanks for the info.
Couple more questions:
1) Can you tell me if the Force HD comes with an Electrical Mgmt System?
2) Will the 18's have the cup holders built into the arms of the couches like I see in some of the pictures? That's a plus for the DW. Or is that only when you order "theater" couches?
3) It looks like there are A/C vents in the cab over bunk area? That's a big plus over the Seneca.
4) We are also considering a used '16 and a left over '16. How hard would it be to add the pocket door between the living area and the bathroom door in the 37TS HD?
5) Are the air brakes disc or drum on the HD?
Thanks in advance! :-)

[bclemens]

1. Only the DX3 comes with electrical management.
2. Yes. We're running the same sofa on all our models.
3. Yes. We run the AC duct all the way to the bunk. For whatever reason the other guy stops their duct on all the class c's shirt of the bunk and gives you a netted curtain. Fine until you want to adjust the louvered outlet.
4. Very hard. There has to be a gap there and backer in the ceiling for track.
5. Air drum. I think I gave along winded explanation why air drum was more widely desired on big trucks somewhere on this forum.

Happy shopping.

[shultz01]

Thank you BClemens.

I guess that seals the deal on a 2018 order then.

I'll just pull the EMS from the Seneca and install it on the Force. I'll also be pulling my spare wheel & tire and hoist I installed and moving that over too. Other than that I'm good to go.

Ordering the RV frig vs. the residential doesn't cause me to lose the pocket door does it? Better to ask know than have the DW faint upon delivery! ;-)

[bclemens]

Pocket door is safe either way. Might lose the pantry...I'll have to look at one on the line.

[shultz01]

BClemens: Looks like its all a moot issue. Even if we ordered one today it wouldn't come in until July. The dealer thinks they could have ours sold within a couple weeks. But we can't go without until July. We have trips planned and paid for already for June, July and August. Bad news for us. Good news for you is you have a high demand product.

[bclemens]

Let me know what you're looking for and I'll see if I can match it up with a stock coming unit shipping close to you.

[shultz01]

Force 37TSHD
Desert Mirage/Pebble
Solar panels (1209-2)
Washer/Dryer (324)
Winegard Trav'ler (1802)

[bclemens]

Zip code?