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Old 09-12-2019, 07:57 PM   #1
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M2 overview video on You Tube

https://youtu.be/enT9DqyJpeM

Brian, did you ever do the walkthrough as mentioned in the video above? Couldn't find it on YT
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:34 AM   #2
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Brian or members. Is the M2 chassis like for instance a flatbed tow truck in respects to the whole truck is one big air compressor? Is there a way to add a fitting for an air chuck to inflate tires or run air tools if needed?
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:43 AM   #3
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A walk through of what? the 34KD? I forgot that I had done one during the fall show. Not a "live through", but close enough.

First half of this video.

https://www.facebook.com/DynamaxMoto...5189233091792/
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:52 AM   #4
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A walk through of what? the 34KD? I forgot that I had done one during the fall show. Not a "live through", but close enough.

First half of this video.

https://www.facebook.com/DynamaxMoto...5189233091792/
Yea in the YT video you mentioned a walkthrough. Thank You.
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:58 PM   #5
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Brian or members. Is the M2 chassis like for instance a flatbed tow truck in respects to the whole truck is one big air compressor? Is there a way to add a fitting for an air chuck to inflate tires or run air tools if needed?
In the Dynamax M2 they come with air brakes and an air fitting you can plug a air hose into. Also has an air horn.
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Old 09-13-2019, 03:01 PM   #6
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In the Dynamax M2 they come with air brakes and an air fitting you can plug a air hose into. Also has an air horn.
Thatís what I wanted to know. Thank you. It would be nice to have that option for airing up tires or using air tools
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Old 09-14-2019, 07:58 PM   #7
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What we need now, as options direct from Dynamax on a short M2, are the following:

Fully enclosed, insulated & heated tank compartments.

Air lumbar, air side bolsters in the seat and seat back, heat, cool, swivel, back cycler, and TWO arm rests similar to what Shultz01 installed. National Seating Admiral CT’s or Bostrom.

Articulating dining tables utilizing the driver/passenger chairs & easily movable to sofabed area. Easily stowable in place.

Sofabed needs to be easy and quick setup. No removal or stowing of cushions. Opens to a full length 75-80" adult bed. High density foam, no air inflating mattress. Preferably with center fold down armrest and footrests.

External roof-mounted GPS antenna.

Extra roof insulation for ducted air conditioning.

Thermal pane windows.

Diesel Aquahot or ITR hydronics for hot water & heat. Plumbed to utilized engine coolant while driving to all heat exchangers including on-the-road hot water.

Good ole trouble-free smooth operating hydraulic slides in lieu of sychronizing electric motors, tracks & stops.

Options for 1,2 or 3 slides

High roof w/ integrated roof-mounted electric awning similar to DX3 without bunkover.

Elongated bowl toilet.

Shower stall w/ integrated seat & soap dish.

Three burner stovetop with vent fan above exhausting to outside. Similar to Renegade.

Overhead microwave/convection oven.

Main TV location should allow for directly facing sofabed. No neck turning. Similar to Renegade.

Airbag leveling system as opposed to jacks.

Pass thru storage bays.

Decent sized window in galley.

Retractable insulated shade above shower to block out heat & cold from skylight.

A quick and easy privacy shade system for windshield & door windows.

Pocket doors to enclose bathroom area including pocket door to the throne area. No hinged space consuming internal doors.

Name brand TVs like LG, Samsung, instead of K-mart specials.
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Old 09-16-2019, 08:11 AM   #8
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What we need now, as options direct from Dynamax on a short M2, are the following:

Fully enclosed, insulated & heated tank compartments.

Air lumbar, air side bolsters in the seat and seat back, heat, cool, swivel, back cycler, and TWO arm rests similar to what Shultz01 installed. National Seating Admiral CTís or Bostrom.

Articulating dining tables utilizing the driver/passenger chairs & easily movable to sofabed area. Easily stowable in place.

Sofabed needs to be easy and quick setup. No removal or stowing of cushions. Opens to a full length 75-80" adult bed. High density foam, no air inflating mattress. Preferably with center fold down armrest and footrests.

External roof-mounted GPS antenna.

Extra roof insulation for ducted air conditioning.

Thermal pane windows.

Diesel Aquahot or ITR hydronics for hot water & heat. Plumbed to utilized engine coolant while driving to all heat exchangers including on-the-road hot water.

Good ole trouble-free smooth operating hydraulic slides in lieu of sychronizing electric motors, tracks & stops.

Options for 1,2 or 3 slides

High roof w/ integrated roof-mounted electric awning similar to DX3 without bunkover.

Elongated bowl toilet.

Shower stall w/ integrated seat & soap dish.

Three burner stovetop with vent fan above exhausting to outside. Similar to Renegade.

Overhead microwave/convection oven.

Main TV location should allow for directly facing sofabed. No neck turning. Similar to Renegade.

Airbag leveling system as opposed to jacks.

Pass thru storage bays.

Decent sized window in galley.

Retractable insulated shade above shower to block out heat & cold from skylight.

A quick and easy privacy shade system for windshield & door windows.

Pocket doors to enclose bathroom area including pocket door to the throne area. No hinged space consuming internal doors.

Name brand TVs like LG, Samsung, instead of K-mart specials.
Ok, to see if this is worth pursuing. What do you think a fair price for this RV would be?
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Old 09-16-2019, 10:00 AM   #9
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Brian, I'll answer your question in this manner. Each line item will have a "S" for Standard or "O" for Optional next to it, reflecting my opinion on what I think should be in the next generation of a Dynamax M2 base offering. The base should prep all coaches for adding options, pre & post sale. The "Standard" base should also include any prewire/plumbing stubs, mounts, backing boards, etc... for adding options in the future. This would allow for the customer to add these options at a later date if so desired or at the time the order is placed with Dynamax.


S Fully enclosed, insulated & heated tank compartments.

O Air lumbar, air side bolsters in the seat and seat back, heat, cool, swivel, back cycler, and TWO arm rests similar to what Shultz01 installed. National Seating Admiral CT’s or Bostrom. Otherwise supply coach with throwaway stock Freightliner seats and let customer choose what they prefer without factory involvement.

O Articulating dining tables utilizing the driver/passenger chairs & easily movable to sofabed area. Easily stowable in place.

O Sofabed needs to be easy and quick setup. No removal or stowing of cushions. Opens to a full length 75-80" adult bed. High density foam, no air inflating mattress. Preferably with center fold down armrest and footrests. Similar to Renegade Slide-a-Bed

S External roof-mounted GPS antenna. Visibility to more sats in wooded and/or cloudy areas.

S Extra roof insulation for ducted air conditioning.

O Thermal pane windows. Or make this standard.

O Diesel Aquahot or ITR hydronics for hot water & heat. Plumbed to utilized engine coolant while driving to all heat exchangers including on-the-road hot water. In lieu of propane furnace & hot water heater.And insulated belly tanks.

S Good ole trouble-free smooth operating hydraulic slides in lieu of sychronizing electric motors, tracks & stops. As they were prior to Forest River takeover and on many high-end coaches.

O Options for 1,2 or 3 slide floor plans.

S High-roof w/ integrated roof-mounted electric awning similar to DX3 without bunkover. Bunkover could be optional.

S Elongated bowl toilet.

S Shower stall w/ integrated seat & soap dish.

S Three burner stovetop with vent fan above exhausting to outside. Similar to Renegade. Roof fan should not be used for exhausting greasy smoke. Cleaning a screen filter in a hooded exhaust fan is much more practical.

S Overhead microwave/convection oven.

S Main TV location should allow for directly facing sofabed. No neck turning. Similar to Renegade above the door or how they were in the early XL's & ST's but able to position on an articulating arm.

O Airbag leveling system as opposed to jacks. Airliner already standard. Front airbags, leveling valving, tanks, & tubing optional.

S Pass thru storage bays.

S Decent sized window in galley.

S Retractable insulated shade above shower to block out heat & cold from skylight.

S A quick and easy privacy shade system for windshield & door windows.

S Pocket doors to enclose bathroom area including pocket door to the throne area. No hinged space consuming internal doors.

S Name brand TVs like LG, Samsung, instead of K-mart specials.

I'll add a couple more if it is not already included in the M2's.

S A single remote control for all external door locks for cab doors, coach entry door & bay doors.

S Freightliner "winterfront" cab interior, tinted glass, "premium insulation" w/ added floor heat & noise insulation.


I would venture to say that you will detect that any added cost of "S" stuff is minimal in the big picture. What is most valuable, for both routine manufacturing & ultimately end-user upgrades, is the standardization of the prep work for future optional add-ons.

It would seem that you are in a better position to provide estimated MSRP for such a standard base and each optional line item. You tell us, what is the expected cost of a "short M2" standard "cookie cutter" base and an estimate on the cost of each optional line item. I would also have to disagree with you on a previous comment you made regarding cost of a shorter M2. It should be considerably less than longer versions. You have less materials, less painting & staining, less fiberglass, less metal, less wood, less interior equipment, less plumbing & wire, and certainly less time to assemble. Labor & time is money. That alone could offset the cost of some of these options.
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Old 09-16-2019, 10:17 AM   #10
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It would seem that you are in a better position to provide estimated MSRP for such a standard base and each optional line item. You tell us, what is the expected cost of a "short M2" standard "cookie cutter" base and an estimate on the cost of each optional line item. I would also have to disagree with you on a previous comment you made regarding cost of a shorter M2. It should be considerably less than longer versions. You have less materials, less painting & staining, less fiberglass, less metal, less wood, less interior equipment, less plumbing & wire, and certainly less time to assemble. Labor & time is money. That alone could offset the cost of some of these options.
You can disagree all you want, but from experience in building these things...going from a 36' unit to a 32' or even a 30' unit is not that much in regards to savings.
1. I have about 4' less materials, so yes, we save some there. But all the major appliances and furniture is still there. A countertop that is 6', is NOT considerably less money than a countertop that is 4'. The labor is a good portion of the cost and it takes just about the same amount of time to cut and create as a 6'
2. Painting. It takes just about the same amount of time. So instead of 40 hours and 20 gallons paint, maybe it takes 37 hours and 18 gallons of paint. The prep and masking is the most time consuming of any paint job and that remains pretty much unchanged.


So, I ask again...if you were buying this coach, equipped as you would want it (I assume that all of the standards here and options here are what you would want???)
what would you be willing to pay for it?

MSRP of a 3400KD Dynaquest XL is $368,540
MSRP of a 34KD Force is $284,196

Do you think you would be less than a Force 34KD? As in...your assumption is that with the options that you want (which many are included on an XL), the cost of those would be offset by the shorter length? Do I gather that correctly.

So is it safe to say, you feel that the MSRP of a 30' M2 should be less than a 34KD Force?
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Old 09-16-2019, 11:52 AM   #11
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You can disagree all you want, but from experience in building these things...going from a 36' unit to a 32' or even a 30' unit is not that much in regards to savings.
1. I have about 4' less materials, so yes, we save some there. But all the major appliances and furniture is still there. A countertop that is 6', is NOT considerably less money than a countertop that is 4'. The labor is a good portion of the cost and it takes just about the same amount of time to cut and create as a 6'
2. Painting. It takes just about the same amount of time. So instead of 40 hours and 20 gallons paint, maybe it takes 37 hours and 18 gallons of paint. The prep and masking is the most time consuming of any paint job and that remains pretty much unchanged.


So, I ask again...if you were buying this coach, equipped as you would want it (I assume that all of the standards here and options here are what you would want???)
what would you be willing to pay for it?

MSRP of a 3400KD Dynaquest XL is $368,540
MSRP of a 34KD Force is $284,196

Do you think you would be less than a Force 34KD? As in...your assumption is that with the options that you want (which many are included on an XL), the cost of those would be offset by the shorter length? Do I gather that correctly.

So is it safe to say, you feel that the MSRP of a 30' M2 should be less than a 34KD Force?
The obvious answer, probably like anyone else that would be asked this question, is yes. To make it attractive, and to sell quantity, an MSRP less than $250K would seem reasonable. Initially, profit margins may need adjustment since there would be less sunk costs, and reviewed as sales data is accumulated. I think I would want to hit and capture the market share in a big way as fast as possible, and later consider price increases as appropriate once your presence in this space is established, well before Renegade, or others, have a chance to catch up.

The point I was trying to make was to improve the base product to allow for future upgrade, so that these upgrades can be done at your facility at time of build on a standardized base, or later by a dealer, or the customer. This standardizes assembly on your end, improves the flexibility of the next generation product, and most importantly it provides your customers more options at a lower entry price.

And yeah, I know, I went off topic again. A lot of this sort of discussion should be in another thread.
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Old 09-16-2019, 12:54 PM   #12
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The obvious answer, probably like anyone else that would be asked this question, is yes. To make it attractive, and to sell quantity, an MSRP less than $250K would seem reasonable. Initially, profit margins may need adjustment since there would be less sunk costs, and reviewed as sales data is accumulated. I think I would want to hit and capture the market share in a big way as fast as possible, and later consider price increases as appropriate once your presence in this space is established, well before Renegade, or others, have a chance to catch up.

The point I was trying to make was to improve the base product to allow for future upgrade, so that these upgrades can be done at your facility at time of build on a standardized base, or later by a dealer, or the customer. This standardizes assembly on your end, improves the flexibility of the next generation product, and most importantly it provides your customers more options at a lower entry price.

And yeah, I know, I went off topic again. A lot of this sort of discussion should be in another thread.
Not really so much off topic as it does pertain to the M2 chassis. I find it very educational!
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Old 09-16-2019, 01:59 PM   #13
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So many things to unpack here. As I expected, many times the conversation of "shorter" really translates to "less expensive" (and shorter of course).

So what you are asking for is a product that is 6 feet shorter than what I build today in a Force 34KD, WITH options that come only on a Dynaquest XL, ALL for $30,000 less than a 34KD. Base MSRP from the 34KD to 37BH, which is about 3' shorter is about $1500. So if we double that, then you save about $3000...not $30,000. And you just added $11,000 in options.

You are right one one count though....If I sold it for $250k MSRP I WOULD kill it in the market, because I would lose money on each and every one. BUT, on the bright side, I would make it up with volume...
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Old 09-16-2019, 03:04 PM   #14
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If this forum has taught me one thing its that the market wants, no needs, an XL at the I5 price point.

Make it happen.

Seems simple enough to me.
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Old 09-16-2019, 03:12 PM   #15
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If this forum has taught me one thing its that the market wants, no needs, an XL at the I5 price point.

Make it happen.

Seems simple enough to me.
Well, when you put it that way!
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Old 09-16-2019, 07:39 PM   #16
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And then your hotshot buddy chimes in with a smarta$$ comment as usual. An I5 at $250K!

Progressive profit margins, product differentiation, target market, time to market, volume sales projections, when development costs are minimal, tooling is minimal, cost of sales is minimal,... Does it matter how many 30 footers you sell for more than a quarter million dollars MSRP? What was the MSRP of a Dynaquest 300XL before Forest River took over?

It's your business plan, Marketing strategy & forecast. Gotta keep Forest River happy!
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Old 09-16-2019, 08:19 PM   #17
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And then your hotshot buddy chimes in with a smarta$$ comment as usual. An I5 at $250K!

Progressive profit margins, product differentiation, target market, time to market, volume sales projections, when development costs are minimal, tooling is minimal, cost of sales is minimal,... Does it matter how many 30 footers you sell for more than a quarter million dollars MSRP? What was the MSRP of a Dynaquest 300XL before Forest River took over?

It's your business plan, Marketing strategy & forecast. Gotta keep Forest River happy!
An Isata 5, with the Xplorer package might be around $230 MSRP...4x4, fully loaded. So while he was using humor to relay that...I think what he was pointing out is that we are expecting an XL type vehicle, four season for an Isata 5 price....and on that he is pretty close.

As for MSRP...I think before Forest River took over the 300XL was up over $400k MSRP??? We've actually driven down the price through volume and better efficiencies.
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Old 09-16-2019, 08:43 PM   #18
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An Isata 5, with the Xplorer package might be around $230 MSRP...4x4, fully loaded. So while he was using humor to relay that...I think what he was pointing out is that we are expecting an XL type vehicle, four season for an Isata 5 price....and on that he is pretty close.

As for MSRP...I think before Forest River took over the 300XL was up over $400k MSRP??? We've actually driven down the price through volume and better efficiencies.
WOW! An I5 @ $230K! With what CCC? And he had insight into the cost of an "Xplorer package"?

Excuse me, not a 300XL but a 300ST on a 33,000lb chassis with an 8.3. And I'm old enough to know that it was not even close to $400K MSRP.

And yes, "driven down the price through volume and better efficiencies. The cost to manufacture the product, not the sales price.

C'mon man, let us both be more realistic.
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Old 09-16-2019, 08:53 PM   #19
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Fact: Dynamax as an independent company had higher margins than Forest River owned Dynamax. Due to scale, we don’t need the same margins to operate.
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Old 09-17-2019, 09:30 AM   #20
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Fact: Dynamax as an independent company had higher margins than Forest River owned Dynamax. Due to scale, we donít need the same margins to operate.
They may have had higher margins, but their pricing was about the same. And in the opinion of many owners on this forum, the builds were of a higher quality...radiused walls, hydraulic operated slides, true Corian, GE microwave, Samsung TVs, metal bays, name brand faucets, chrome bay handles,...

Again, in my opinion, if you are targeting volume sales to MB, RAM, & Ford upgrades & middle income baby boomer retirees, a lower entry level price will stimulate interest, especially if the base product is prepped (stubbed out) for options that can easily be added post sales. Keep in mind that you have Class A competition as well in this demographic segment.

Nuff said by me on this thread.
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