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Old 03-02-2016, 10:29 AM   #51
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Good for you ! Direct contact is the only way to get results !
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Old 03-02-2016, 10:55 AM   #52
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We thought about upgrading our 2004 CKTS several times. Until....we walked through the newer Forrest River 5th wheels. Junk. Takes less than 5 minutes to see through the fluff at the lack of any quality.
Last one we walked through...and I joke not...had brown silicone caulking ( or similar to silicone) smeared all over the carpet in two places. Not a little..I mean fairly large obvious smear. I looked at the salesmen and said...does the caulking on the carpet come free or is it an extra. He just said oh we would clean that up..it came like that from the factory.
Huh...say what...how could the morons miss this..it wa sthe first thing I saw when I walked in..like a big turd on the floor.
Now here is the issue. if you are too lazy..too careless...and just plain don't care enough to fix this before it left the facility then what the hell is going on in places I can't see.
No way..this is junk...they are pushing junk...pushing pure crap out the door. This was not just one unit...the rest in the line on the lot had other crappy quality. All you have to do is open drawers...doors..look at trim...simple stuff. Not talking about the quality of the components rather I am talking about the lousy installation. Sure they can't put high end wood or drawer slides..hinges whatever in a mid line unit but you can at least install it correctly.
This crap looks like it was manufactured in Tijuana.
Sorry..I'll stick to my 2004 until it HAS to be replaced. Then..who knows what.
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Old 03-02-2016, 10:56 AM   #53
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Good for you ! Direct contact is the only way to get results !
Does anyone really think that Forest River doesn't knows exactly each and every complaint from having heard it hundreds of times in the past? They know exactly what they are turning out, the failure rate, the callbacks, etc. The bean counters say this is an acceptable number and how it would cost soo much more to step up the quality. They know every bit of all of this. There is NO incentive to do better and there will never be. Pandora is out of the box so to speak.
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Old 03-02-2016, 11:04 AM   #54
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SO............after reading all this.........how about something constructive? As someone who is about to order one of these things, please pm me and tell me what is the best 40' fiver I can buy??

I'm serious. I'll give a dollar to ever serious reply.

This is my last one, and I want to buy the best that I can afford. I hear the "NO" votes, I'm just asking where you put your "YES" votes????
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Old 03-02-2016, 11:22 AM   #55
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SO............after reading all this.........how about something constructive? As someone who is about to order one of these things, please pm me and tell me what is the best 40' fiver I can buy??

I'm serious. I'll give a dollar to ever serious reply.

This is my last one, and I want to buy the best that I can afford. I hear the "NO" votes, I'm just asking where you put your "YES" votes????
I have a Palomino Sabre that's just over 40' and have had (knock on wood) almost zero problems with it. All the lights and switches work. No water leaks anywhere. No problems with the slides or the any of the appliances inside.

It's the first and only fiver we've ever owned and we've only had it a little over a year but it's been great for us.
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Old 03-02-2016, 11:54 AM   #56
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For us our ownership history is our proof that FR builds a better product!
owned FR TT: owned for 5 yrs.... in the shop once (due to Chinese tires)
owned FR Gas MH: owned for 3 yrs... in the shop once (leak at hydraulic line gasket)
owned SOB Diesel MH: owned for 18 months.... in the shop 7 times!!! (5 of those times for slide failure)
Now own FR Diesel MH: have owned it for 4 months.... 1 problem: fridge fan motor (Not FR fault) repairman came to house, changed part. Now fixed.
We are VERY happy to be back in a FR product!! Our MH is much better built that our previous coach! Sawdust behind cabinets? Minimal compared to the bucket full found in our previous coach!!
There is a reason they call is a SOB... because sobbing is what you do everytime you have to bring it to the shop for repairs!!!!
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Old 03-02-2016, 11:54 AM   #57
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I couldn't DISAGREE with the post originator more! Doing the job correctly the first time is definitely not more expensive than doing it several times to rework defective workmanship or pay for warranty repairs. Now, if you try to inspect quality into a product (which never works), you can spend a lot of money that increases product costs with little or no improved product quality.
Poorly trained workers, bad manufacturing processes, and defective designs, definitely costs money and alienates customers and affects a companies public reputation.
I make these comments after 35 years of manufacturing and quality management experience with a top 100 company. The old adage that quality costs money is only stated by the misinformed or those standing on the outside looking in!
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Old 03-02-2016, 12:52 PM   #58
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Cost of non-quality

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Originally Posted by RSchleder View Post
I couldn't DISAGREE with the post originator more! Doing the job correctly the first time is definitely not more expensive than doing it several times to rework defective workmanship or pay for warranty repairs. Now, if you try to inspect quality into a product (which never works), you can spend a lot of money that increases product costs with little or no improved product quality.
Poorly trained workers, bad manufacturing processes, and defective designs, definitely costs money and alienates customers and affects a companies public reputation.
I make these comments after 35 years of manufacturing and quality management experience with a top 100 company. The old adage that quality costs money is only stated by the misinformed or those standing on the outside looking in!
X2 from a former manufacturing manager and VP of quality in top Silicon Valley company. Cost of non-quality when properly accounted for way exceeds cost of "do it right the first time". Tools well established based on work in post-war Japan by Deming and Juran (US quality gurus).
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Old 03-02-2016, 02:00 PM   #59
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X2 from a former manufacturing manager and VP of quality in top Silicon Valley company. Cost of non-quality when properly accounted for way exceeds cost of "do it right the first time". Tools well established based on work in post-war Japan by Deming and Juran (US quality gurus).
So where is the disconnect? Is management at all of the RV companies that un-informed? I would personally like to take an upper staff management person at Forest River and show him the hundred of staples holding wood panels to aluminium framework that have worked loose. I'd like to ask who is the person who signed off on this ridiculous construction technique. They should be fired immediately and penalized by paying all of the repair bills for the hundreds of un-satisfied customers. I just spent 16 hours repairing the pulled loose staples on my Murphy bed and I am not done yet. Last season I spent a full weekend repairing my dinette for the same thing, pulled loose staples into aluminum. (Also broken aluminum welds) What crap!!!
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Old 03-02-2016, 02:24 PM   #60
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I would personally like to take an upper staff management person at Forest River and show him the hundred of staples holding wood panels to aluminium framework that have worked loose. I'd like to ask who is the person who signed off on this ridiculous construction technique.

That construction technique is used by every manufacturer that uses an aluminum substructure on dinette benches and such, not just Forest River. There are also trailers that have stamped steel trusses on the roof and the plywood is staple to those also. Its common RV construction. Why you would have that many pull out is beyond me. I have had 3 trailers with aluminum tube and the problem I had was panels pulling free from the staples. I had a hell of a time pulling the staple out of the aluminum.
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