2012 Salem Electrical Woes

[MarkW.]

For some reason, ALL of my NON-GFI outlets won't work. My breaker panel does not specify which breaker is for these outlets, but I am getting 120v across all of the breakers in there. All the wires then disappear into the wall behind and in between the fridge and oven. There MUST be a splice in there somewhere. I believe one side is OPEN in the wall somewhere. It doesn't appear to be a short otherwise, I would think a breaker would trip. Can anyone tell me if there is a major splice somewhere and were it would be?

[SeaDog]

Welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. Are you saying that the GFI receptacles have power but the non GFI don't?

[5picker]

Are these non-GFCI outlets on their own breaker?

I ask because many outlets that don't have a GFCI reset are protected by an upstream GFCI outlet.

[MarkW.]

Originally Posted by SeaDog

Welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. Are you saying that the GFI receptacles have power but the non GFI don't?

Thank you sir. Yes. That is exactly what I am saying. There are no tripped breakers. I have gone through and rest them multiple times. The TV just quit, and I as I started investigating, ONLY the GFI plugs work. None of the NON-GFI have power.

[MarkW.]

Originally Posted by 5picker

Are these non-GFCI outlets on their own breaker?

I ask because many outlets that don't have a GFCI reset are protected by an upstream GFCI outlet.

All of the plugs that have a GFI label work. And the GFI reset is in the front bathroom and works when tested normally. It does have a labeled breaker in the box. Outlets with no label, no workie..

[CedarCreekWoody]

There is most likely not a major splice. Most likely the power flows from the first outlet, to the second, and so on. Pull out and check the outlets to find the break.

[MarkW.]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

There is most likely not a major splice. Most likely the power flows from the first outlet, to the second, and so on. Pull out and check the outlets to find the break.

I pulled 4 of them so far with no luck. 3 by the TV and one in the outside kitchen for that fridge. When it comes out of the breaker, it splits somewhere and some go to the front of the trailer to the TV plug and some go to the back to the outdoor kitchen fridge and none of them work. It just doesn't make sense. None of the breaker labels say breakers. It has like GFI, microwave, AC, etc..and I have reset them multiple times and am getting 120v to the distribution wire leaving the breaker and going into the wall. It has to be getting power from a mislabeled breaker.

[Jay2504]

From what you are saying, the tv quit. Did you test that outlet for power with something else like a light? If so and the outlet is dead, check everything else on the trailer to see what else might not work. ( Already you say that the GFI outlets are ok). This would include, microwave, fridge on electric, water heater on electric ( make sure it’s full of water first). AC, and anything else, including any outside outlet that you might have. Also check the converter. If this outlet is not on the GFI circuit, it most likely will be tied to something else. Jay

[spierce617]

I have to ask. Where are you plugged in and are you sure it is 110 power? Some people have a 30 amp service run in their house or garage to plug into. Sometimes the electrician wires it wrong and put 220 power in.

[MarkW.]

Originally Posted by spierce617

I have to ask. Where are you plugged in and are you sure it is 110 power? Some people have a 30 amp service run in their house or garage to plug into. Sometimes the electrician wires it wrong and put 220 power in.

I'm plugged into 50a service at my house. We lived in this camper in this same spot from April to August with no issues. My daughter moved in and the TV worked fine one day, then out the next.

Originally Posted by Jay2504

From what you are saying, the tv quit. Did you test that outlet for power with something else like a light? If so and the outlet is dead, check everything else on the trailer to see what else might not work. ( Already you say that the GFI outlets are ok). This would include, microwave, fridge on electric, water heater on electric ( make sure it’s full of water first). AC, and anything else, including any outside outlet that you might have. Also check the converter. If this outlet is not on the GFI circuit, it most likely will be tied to something else. Jay

Jay, that's when they all quit. I took the plug apart there, and on the next wall, and no power to any of them. Took a drop light, verified it worked, then went to every plug. If it had a GFI Protected label on it, it worked fine, if not, no power. Everything else in the camper works. Brand new converter and battery due to another issue, but TV worked on old battery and converter and went out before converter/battery change. That's what makes me think there is a splice somewhere in the walls or something. I'm tempted to pull the inside fridge, and see what I can see in there if anything.

[Jay2504]

On my unit, a 2504s, all the outlets are on a GFI as far as I have checked. Also on my unit, the breaker for the outlets is also used for the 120volt side of the fridge. I have a pretty standard gas/electric fridge. On my unit if you take off the outside vent for the fridge (the bottom one if you have 2) the 120 volt outlet is pretty easy to see/test. Might be worth a try as the door light is 12volts for the fridge. How many outlets do you have that are not working? Is it possible that you have 2 GFIs one for each “string”of outlets? Jay

[CedarCreekWoody]

You are going to have to explore. Use a multimeter or no-contact voltage detector to test the wires, NOT the outlet. Most likely if you can find the first outlet from the converter you will find power coming in, but not going out. The outlets used in a trailer are not as dependable as those used at home.
I just yesterday spent some time trying to identify and label my breakers. The factory hand labeled them with strange and eligible abbreviations. I have one labeled GFCI, same as you. However I have another labeled "Fridge" that also powers the oulets beside the bed and the wall mounted tv. Most likely yours are similar and your dead outlets are not on tne GFCI breaker.

[5picker]

Originally Posted by MarkW.

I'm plugged into 50a service at my house. We lived in this camper in this same spot from April to August with no issues. My daughter moved in and the TV worked fine one day, then out the next.


Jay, that's when they all quit. I took the plug apart there, and on the next wall, and no power to any of them. Took a drop light, verified it worked, then went to every plug. If it had a GFI Protected label on it, it worked fine, if not, no power. Everything else in the camper works. Brand new converter and battery due to another issue, but TV worked on old battery and converter and went out before converter/battery change. That's what makes me think there is a splice somewhere in the walls or something. I'm tempted to pull the inside fridge, and see what I can see in there if anything.

I realize you said you checked power coming out the breaker you 'thought' might feed the outlets but by chance did you test for voltage at any of the other breakers.

You mentioned (see red highlight) that you are on a 50a service.
It is possible you lost one of the 120v legs that power your 50a service.

A 50a amp service has two hot 120v legs that feed your power distribution box. If one of the legs go out, you will still have current to about 1/2 of the things in your camper.

Can you do some testing with a multimeter and report back?

[MarkW.]

Jay,
The lights on the front panel of the fridge came on and the inside light worked. I turned the fridge off for now, but did not wait to see if it cools. Will check that today. As I can tell, there are at least 6 or 7 plugs that don't work. None of them have the GFCI label and I have never found a second GFCI reset plug, just the one in the main bathroom.

Woody,
I was taking the incoming wire completely off the plug and checked the wire itself on at least 4 of the 6 or 7 that are out with absolutely no voltage coming in, and they are the ones closest to the breaker box. The factory also hand labeled my breaker box, and I too have one labeled GFCI and Fridge, as well as Microwave, AC, etc..but none labeled as simply Plugs or something that would make me think outlets. The microwave still works and I'm checking to make sure the fridge cools and works.

5picker,
I tested every breaker in the box and got the same 120v readings on the black wire (output) of every breaker. I also reset every breaker to ensure none were tripped. I don't think I've lost one side, but it is a simple check as the main breakers are beside the RV plug. I'll look and be back on here in a bit..

I really appreciate everyone taking time out to help me diagnose my issues. I know everybody has things to do and I am humbled how you are trying to help a total stranger. May God Bless all of you and keep you and your families safe..

[tomkatb]

Be patient.

I work on my English car all the time. fortunately for us there is a color coded wire system and full wiring diagrams. Easy to fix. all connections are on the diagram.

Relax a bit. Remove every access panel. Get a good light and familiarize yourself with as much as possible. You start finding the circuit and working back to the panel. You will get it. Outlets are daisy chained just like the old Christmas tree lights.

I have a USB camera that cost $10 that might help. About 1/4" in diameter.

[Bama Rambler]

If you have a good friend that's an electrician and has access to a 'fox and hound' locator, you could see if they could use it to trace the wiring in the walls to where it's broken.

If I were close enough, I'd be more than happy to use mine to help you.

[MarkW.]

Originally Posted by Bama Rambler

If you have a good friend that's an electrician and has access to a 'fox and hound' locator, you could see if they could use it to trace the wiring in the walls to where it's broken.

If I were close enough, I'd be more than happy to use mine to help you.

Is that like the old Cable Hound used to locate underground cable? I use to work at the telephone company and we used them there. They were awesome. I might actually be able to find one of those, but the underground cable had to be grounded on one side for the Hound to work.

Both AC's are running, fridge appears to be cooling, no breakers tripped for the 50A RV plug...plugs still dead...UGH!!

[Bama Rambler]

They're kinda like that. Hopefully the ground is still continuous so it should work.

[JPSPete20]

I suggest a quick test. Drop down to 110 V 15 Amp and try things. You will need to put one, or two drop down plug converts on the trailer input. There is no chance of a wiring problem with the simple 110. Don't try the AC, but all of the plugs should function normally. If the work, one side of the 30/50 you are trying to feed in is dead.

[EDABEUT]

You said the only GFCI resettable plug you can find was in the bathroom but you also said you have a outdoor kitchen. There should be another one outside in that area that probably runs the plugs not working.