New Member and new Sandpiper owner

[jkohio]

Hi everyone. I am a brand new member of the forum and also a brand new fifth wheel owner . We have ordered but not yet received a 2013 Sandpiper 35ROK. We have never owned a fifth wheel before and the biggest thing I have ever pulled is a pop-up camper. Needless to say pulling a 42' fifth wheel has me a bit nervous. I look forward to tapping into the expertice of the members here as I know I will have a lot of questions. I also purchased a 2008 Ford F250 Superduty Diesel to pull this RV. Any suggestions are or helpful hints are welcome!

[Terier]

While you wait for feedback I wanted to welcome you to the forums! Lots of members have expressed being happy when they upgraded to a 5er. Congrats on your new RV!

[golfmedik]

Congrats on your purchase! Welcome to the world of 5th wheels! A 42 ft. 5th wheel is big(see sig) but not impossible to handle. The truck you have will need air bags or sure to help level out the ride once the rig is loaded. As far as the truck goes, follow the SEVERE MAINTENANCE schedule in your manual. Oil change every 5k and fuel filters every 10k and use ONLY Ford filters in the 6.4L engines. You can go over to this site 6.4L Power Stroke Diesel - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums to learn all you can about the 6.4L Fords. Stick around here to learn all about your 5th wheel too! Again, congrats and welcome to the club

[TURBS]

Welcome to to forum!
Congrats on the new 5er!
While your waiting on advice I have to ask what the weights are on this 5er?
Seems to me that this MAY be a dually towable camper not a srw.
Since u didn't say it has me wondering.

Turbs

[golfmedik]

It appears according to the FR website, the rig weighs 11,908 unloaded and has a tongue weight of 2,423.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by jkohio

We have never owned a fifth wheel before and the biggest thing I have ever pulled is a pop-up camper. Needless to say pulling a 42' fifth wheel has me a bit nervous

I made almost the exact same switch! I bought a pop-up after the end of 2010 camping season. We camped in it in 2011 a bunch and then stepped way up to our 42' Sabre!

The best thing that happened for me was that the dealership sent me on a test drive with one of their techs in the passenger seat. We drive for about 30-45 minutes around a variety of roads. Even missed a turn and had to figure it out from there.

Welcome!

[Wiscampsin]

Welcome to the forum and congrats on ordering your 2013 Sandpiper 35ROK.

[Wiscampsin]

Originally Posted by ependydad

The best thing that happened for me was that the dealership sent me on a test drive with one of their techs in the passenger seat. We drive for about 30-45 minutes around a variety of roads. Even missed a turn and had to figure it out from there.

Welcome!

IMHO that's a dealer who not only knows and understands customer service but knows about customer safety too!

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by golfmedik

It appears according to the FR website, the rig weighs 11,908 unloaded and has a tongue weight of 2,423.

That's a lot of hitch weight for a f250 srw!
Am I wrong?

[Oakman]

Welcome to the forum. That's a big heavy fifth wheel so you will need to install airbags on it to help with the pin weight.

When I moved up to a fifth wheel and a short one at that, I took it to the nearest state park on a weekday and practiced driving and parking it. You can also take it to an empty parking lot to practice. Take it slow and pay close attention to your mirrors when making turns and when backing.

[golfmedik]

Originally Posted by f1100turbo

That's a lot of hitch weight for a f250 srw!
Am I wrong?

In my opinion, no. That kind of weight needs a 350/3500 truck in my opinion, however it is done all that time. Doesn't make it right, but it happens. As far as pulling it, there will be no problem. Maybe not even stopping it. But the weight in the bed would be my concern with the RAWR. That is the reason I was saying that 'air bags to level it out'. Most know that airbags add control and up to 5k in carrying capacity, but most do not know it does nothing for the weight ratings of the truck. I truly am glad to see them with a new camper and I wish them the best. I personally wouldn't do it with a 250/2500, but that's just me. A buddy of mine pulls a Heartland 5er with his at 14k and it does fine. He just knows it is over the limit.
To the OP, I am not trying to bash, neither is Turbs, just trying to make you aware of something you may not be. We are only discussing and offering suggestions here. Please do not take offense to what is being said. We can all have an obedient discussion about this. Again, we are happy for you, just a little concerned.

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by golfmedik

In my opinion, no. That kind of weight needs a 350/3500 truck in my opinion, however it is done all that time. Doesn't make it right, but it happens. As far as pulling it, there will be no problem. Maybe not even stopping it. But the weight in the bed would be my concern with the RAWR. That is the reason I was saying that 'air bags to level it out'. Most know that airbags add control and up to 5k in carrying capacity, but most do not know it does nothing for the weight ratings of the truck. I truly am glad to see them with a new camper and I wish them the best. I personally wouldn't do it with a 250/2500, but that's just me. A buddy of mine pulls a Heartland 5er with his at 14k and it does fine. He just knows it is over the limit.
To the OP, I am not trying to bash, neither is Turbs, just trying to make you aware of something you may not be. We are only discussing and offering suggestions here. Please do not take offense to what is being said. We can all have an obedient discussion about this. Again, we are happy for you, just a little concerned.

What he said!
Especially last 8 lines

Turbs

[Oakman]

I forgot to mention one more important thing. When towing your fifth wheel, ALWAYS use the tow/haul mode feature of your Ford truck...ALWAYS!!!

[jkohio]

Thank you all for the welcome and information. I am learning a lot from all the replays. I talked to Ford rep. today. They told me that tounge weight should be no more than 25 % of the trailor weight and all should be fine but now I am doubting that. I am going to check about the air bags as mentioned. I already have the truck and 5th wheel so I have to see what can be done or upgrade to a 350 if all else fails. Thank you again for the info and advice.

[supercab79]

First thing Welcome to the forum and welcome to the world of fifth wheels.

I see that you’re from Ohio which is a good thing since it's relatively flat out there and that’s great for getting acquainted with a larger unit. Maneuvering is a learning curve but so is mountainous terrain towing, I have found this aspect to be more aggravating than city driving. Because city driving is mostly low speed you can adjust to accommodate which ever scenario you’re in, however hilly or mountainous pulls tend to aggravate in a different way such as elevated trans and engine temps forced slower driving and nail biting hot brakes and downhill over speeds. I feel the stress is higher out in these conditions than any tight quarters maneuvering. Anyway after a few short runs I'm sure you'll be a fiver lover like the rest of us in no time. As far as your truck is concerned I have always looked at it from a slightly different perspective than a lot of others on these forums do, it seems to me that money must be no object to some. But let me say from the start I do not recommend running illegal or ridiculously over weight either, that’s just irresponsible. With towing, more tow vehicle is always better, but not always practical or totally necessary. I found through experience that running at max all the time just ADDS to everything (wear and tear, STRESS driver stress that is, added opportunity for accident or equipment failure, possible fines if stopped that "1" time your loaded with water) anyway you get the picture. But if you've just purchased a new rv and like yourself you have an F-250 which may be close on is rating ranges but still legal than yes go for it try it out, but keep in mind that a lot more rides on the operator than the truck in my opinion. Operating at the top of your trucks limits requires more driver attention, slower speeds, shorter trips, and lighter loading. All this can be acceptable if the owner is aware of his trucks limitations and compensates for safety around them. Now after someone decides that this is the lifestyle or unit for them than by all means when you upgrade your tow vehicle than yes the vehicle should be purchased around the weights that you will be exposing it to and obviously not the top end of the spectrum but the middle of the trucks rating limits would be ideal. The very fact that you are aware and receptive to your current situation regarding your weights and size make you the perfect example of someone who I was referring to. So as long as you are safe and respectful of your new load I’m sure you will be fine.

For us after the first year of finding out that we liked the RVing lifestyle and this was something we were going to continue to do I purchased a 3500 dually and never looked back, but if RVing would not have been for us I would have been selling an RV instead of purchasing a new truck. On a totally different note Golf Medic is not only a great source of info on here but a great guy. I meet him on this forum and he has been nothing but a gentleman and huge help while we were purchasing our first brand new RV. His opinion is top notch in my book, and yes the air bags will assist in making for a better towing experience but are by no means an answer for being too heavy on your limits.
Good luck and God bless in all your travels,
Marc

[jkohio]

Thanks again for all the info and welcome. I sure don't want to do anything unsafe or illegal. I am trying to understand all the information everyone has provided and to see where I am over my truck limits. Mt truck specs list GVWR of 9800lbs, front GAWR of 5200 lbs, rear GAWR of 6100 lbs. The ford dealer said the max t.pin weight is 25% of the trail or weight. Trailor weight is 11908 and hitch weight is 2423 lbs. Ford shows max 5th wheel tow weight of 15400. I know I have to be missing something but I thought I was in a safe range. I don!t want to be unsafe to any degree. Where am I going wrong? Thank you all so much!

[golfmedik]

I would start by weighing your truck with all of the supplies, people, animals, full tank of fuel, like it will be while pulling the trailer. It can be done at one of these locations CAT Scale..Put the front wheels on one plate of the platform and the rears on another. Pull up close to the speaker, you may even have to stand on running board, and press the button. Tell them it is a private weigh. They will tell you that they have it, and go inside and pay. Around $10. IF you have the camper accessible, you can then go back to the same weigh station within 24 hours, and weigh the truck and trailer(try to keep the load in the truck the same or calculate the difference) keeping the front wheels of the truck on one plate, rear on another and the trailer wheels on another. If within 24 hours it is under $2 for the new weigh. Once you have these weights, and by going by the door sticker on you r truck for the GVWR, FGAWR and RAWR, you can use either one of these to figure out your margin Fifth Wheel Weight Calculator or this one 5th Wheel/Gooseneck Worksheet Instructions for CAT Scale .
If you don't have the trailer, you can estimate by going by the dry shipping weight of the camper and by adding 1800 pounds to it. (1800 pounds are what the engineers say the 365SAQ are capable of carrying-also the average weight of cargo people put in a camper). It will only be a guess if you don't have the camper, but realize any options you put on it will add weight as well.
Then take up to 25% for the pin weight, a lot are around 20%. So if your camper weighs 15k, the pin weight will be at 3k, which might be over the limit of your F250. I say 'might' because I haven't looked that much at the F250s lately but you can do so here http://http://www.ford.com/assets/pd...TTgdeMay07.pdf You will have to scroll a little but the info is there. Let us know what you find. I am glad to see that you are interested in this. I think you may only be over the RAWR of the truck but under all others. I will have to look again when I have a minute, but take some time and read up and do some figuring. I never trust a salesman from trucks to campers because all they want to do is sell you something. Let us know what you find out. Sorry for the long post

[AquaMan]

While you mention weights of your trailer, the dry weight you mention, 11900, is the minimum your trailer will weigh. Most likely it's more. The max pin weight of your truck is 2423, if your camper is 13500 and you carry a 16% pin weight (15-25%) you have 2160lbs of pin weight. Well within your limit. The problem comes in, when you start figuring weight in truck and max payload of your truck. I've pulled with 350/3500 duallies of both Ford and Chevy. I currently pull a 14k 365saq with a 2500 and never felt safer behind the wheel. Of course my truck has the longest wheel base I can get, and the there is no denying the Chevy has the stiffest chasis built. Am I pushing the legal limits of my truck, probably, but I've put thousands of miles on it and it tows like a dream and stops on a dime. Never have I felt that the "tail is wagging the dog". Get some real life weights, not just stickers, and see where you fall.

[MrsRPM]

Welcome and congrats on your purchase! You are going to LOVE it! We have a 2013 35ROK, we ordered it at the Hershey Pa show. We got to camp in it one time before putting it in storage. We have an 2002 F350 V10 single rear wheel. We put Firestone air bags on the truck. My husband (who is a professional truck driver ) says air bags and good shocks are a must have. We towed it from Pa to Charlotte NC without a problem.

As far as towing, I think a 5th wheel, no matter the size, tows easier than anything else.

FYI - we did have some warranty issues though, shower door was caulked on the wrong side, so any water that got into the track ran out onto the floor. Cabinet doors needed adjusting, they came open during travel. Pantry fell apart while loading. Outside the gel coat had silicone smeared all over it. I'm not complaining, our dealer has already taken care of theses things. Just look at everything on your walk through.



That all being said, what a great floor plan this unit has! I know you will love it too. Tow safely!

[utsoccer]

We purchased the 2014 35 ROK. It is lengthy; however, it's easy to get use to. It pulls great. Only suggestion is to watch out for parks that have drainage ditches on both sides of the site. We dented our truck bed (shortly after getting the 5th wheel) when trying to back into a site. It had rained, so it was muddy. You love your new RV. If you travel often, you might consider investing in a generator and the washer/dryer combo. They've both been well worth the investment.

Question: Does anyone with this model have trouble with the outside air entering through the fireplace? The fireplace backs up to the outdoor kitchen. We only noticed it this last trip. It was humid, and condensation built up on the fireplace glass. If so, any suggestions? Can insulation be added without interfering with the safety of using the fireplace (although it's not a 'real' fireplace, it puts out a great deal of heat when in use)?