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Old 08-11-2014, 05:20 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by BigJohnD View Post
Lippert unfortunately is like many others. "That's the first we've heard of that problem". Never mind the forum, and the thousands of people we communicate with that own the products and have similar experiences. I've visited a huge amount of dealers across the US, and several manufacturers, and I always quiz them on issues like this. I've only got a few honest answers unfortunately. Just the dishonest world we live in.

With Lippert, if they put as much effort into getting it right as they do trying to get out of being responsible, then we might have something. I really admire those small handful of manufacturers that still fab their own frames.
Big John D , I disagree with your last paragraph, you are painting Lippert with a broad stroke. I just got back from the Rally. I was going to have them install a 4 point electric leveling system for $3200 00, When I got to the rally I went to their booth, talk with the head Creative Engineer. Started to talk to him. He said that I should go with the 6 pt. Level up instead. I said that I was afraid of my frame twisting. He said they would have to weld 2 beams across and add 36" long welded beam in the back of the read axle to hold the Hydraulic Ram. He said that it would be 10x's faster and stronger then the electric one. I said okay lets change the order being the show cost was 4200.00 installed. When I took the unit in they said being I'm 31' I only needed 4 pt. because the short distance would make the level up fight to get level. Said I had to be over 33' to get the 6 pt. to work right. They installed the 4 pt. and did all the welding required. When I went to pay my bill they added 400.00 for welding and charged me $4600.00. I went back to the head creative engineer and told him what happened. He called billing and had them refund me and my total bill was then $3400.00. He said a deal a deal and I should not have to to pay for 2 jacks I never got. Now I'm very pleased with the new system and probably have the strongest Rockwood Frame on the road. They kept there word and you have to talk to the right person. LCI takes up miles of buildings and employees more people then anyone in Elkhart County. My unit is now lighter GW then with the standard system that came with it. Each jack weights 12 lbs. but can pick up 7000 lbs.
The two front jacks on the old weighted over 40 lbs. each. I gave them to the OLD COOT. LCI may get a bad rap on this forum but they do keep there word and Know Their Stuff. I will post pictures of The system being I'm the first Rockwood to have it installed on. Also another tid bit of info for everyone, I learned they also have a plant in the Boston Mass area....
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Old 08-11-2014, 08:06 AM   #142
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Go back and look at my first post. Lippert wouldn't work with me because I had changed to a fifth airborne hitch. Claimed it was a modification.

Glad when people get work done by lippert and FR. They should. If they are so good. Why heavier metal and more welding?

I will not buy another lippert. Think I can build my own cheaper and better. When I do pin weight will not be my concern.


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Old 08-11-2014, 05:39 PM   #143
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Go back and look at my first post. Lippert wouldn't work with me because I had changed to a fifth airborne hitch. Claimed it was a modification.

Glad when people get work done by lippert and FR. They should. If they are so good. Why heavier metal and more welding?

I will not buy another lippert. Think I can build my own cheaper and better. When I do pin weight will not be my concern.


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Because the frames are lite weight. It's called a signature ulta lite. Yes the frames are lighter. It was good for me that they beefed up the frame so it wouldn't twist. That's why I took it to them not a dealer or CW. You pay for what you get both money wise and frame wise. There are only certain things that can be done without straightening the frame. Sorry about your problems, hope you get it resolved. When lippert puts it on they now own it. No arguments they did it not me or a dealer. They modified it not me. Glad you didn't get hurt or your family. Just letting you know what happened to me. I was also answering John saying Lippert did mine right. Also members who are putting electric systems in after market could have a problem let's hope they don't.
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Old 08-11-2014, 08:09 PM   #144
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Not denying they can be of help, IF you can get the right person on the right day. Like any company, they're are some good people, and some bad. The proof is in the posts industry wide about their frames, and the denial of fixing. Being somewhat like arpipeliner, I've seen better steel and welds in a high school ag shop. Do I think my camper is worth the $54k I paid for it, absolutely not. Set that 15.5k frame next to my 14k gooseneck frame. I-beam for I-beam, weld for weld, and tell me lippert makes a good frame. Your story might be quite different if your pin box frame cracked and just about came off the truck like some have. I'm glad yours is in good shape and they got you fixed up. If mine cracks, they won't touch it. I'll do my own fabrication.


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Old 08-12-2014, 03:22 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by BigJohnD View Post
Not denying they can be of help, IF you can get the right person on the right day. Like any company, they're are some good people, and some bad. The proof is in the posts industry wide about their frames, and the denial of fixing. Being somewhat like arpipeliner, I've seen better steel and welds in a high school ag shop. Do I think my camper is worth the $54k I paid for it, absolutely not. Set that 15.5k frame next to my 14k gooseneck frame. I-beam for I-beam, weld for weld, and tell me lippert makes a good frame. Your story might be quite different if your pin box frame cracked and just about came off the truck like some have. I'm glad yours is in good shape and they got you fixed up. If mine cracks, they won't touch it. I'll do my own fabrication.


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Very good point big John, but this is the third (3) 2007 with the same problem. Something happened that year. It's the only year that I have saw on this forum. My Rockwood has a stronger beam and pinbox area I have the the pictures of the frame that I took at the factory, Even through this can't help people who have a 2007 maybe it did help us all down the line with new frame development. But I still feel bad for the OP problems. I also have faith in Lippert and Forest River. When you lose hope you sell your unit and I would bet he wouldn't buy a FR product, even through they all have problems.
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Old 08-12-2014, 04:42 PM   #146
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WOW...I started reading this string and could not stop. I actually got goose bumps!
First, I am so sorry for you folks who have had this failure and glad no one has been hurt so far.
Second, I'm curious, legal actions have been mentioned a couple of times here, but has anyone actually discussed this with an attorney? Curious as to their take on all this. IMO, the folks who are having "official Lippert" conversations with you are constrained by what/how they can respond to you no doubt by their own legal department. We all know they are not dumb nor clueless. They are aware of this type of failure but legal would never let them admit to it unless the Lippert Corp put out a major recall. That's how the corporation I work for does it and most others too.
Third, as soon as I get up from my desk this afternoon, I'm taking my inspection camera out to our Sandpiper with a Lippert frame and see what I can see.
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Old 08-12-2014, 05:03 PM   #147
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Unless your frame is stamped ALL OVER "made in the "USA" I wouldn't tow a dung beatle behind it. Period.

A "fabricated" I beam used on "lite" and ultra lite trailers is basically sheet metal welded to form an I .


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Old 08-12-2014, 09:54 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by gljurczyk View Post
Very good point big John, but this is the third (3) 2007 with the same problem. Something happened that year. It's the only year that I have saw on this forum. My Rockwood has a stronger beam and pinbox area I have the the pictures of the frame that I took at the factory, Even through this can't help people who have a 2007 maybe it did help us all down the line with new frame development. But I still feel bad for the OP problems. I also have faith in Lippert and Forest River. When you lose hope you sell your unit and I would bet he wouldn't buy a FR product, even through they all have problems.
Like Kerrlakelover, I too, read this from the beginning. It wasn't until I saw this piece "....third (3) 2007 with the same problem..." that something FINALLY hit home. My wife's uncle, God rest his soul, had a 5th wheel - no, I don't know what make, but it had to be around a 2007 - and it completely buckled at the angle behind the pin. Not aware of the technical names of the different parts of a 5th wheel. This happened in his driveway as he was backing the trailer. Trailer dropped down on his TV and did some major damage on the back of the truck. Insurance Co ultimately totaled out the trailer and fixed the truck. Sure wish the wife's uncle was still around to get more info. But, reading all the posts here, it sure sounds like he had the same problem.
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Old 08-12-2014, 10:06 PM   #149
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If I didn't know anything about steel, welds and structure, I probably wouldn't get so aggravated looking at the frames. Turbs is spot on with the way a LOT are made. Not all, but a LOT. On a floating oil rig, every critical structural weld gets x-rayed or mag tested at various times. It is a grueling process. Everything added that will be load bearing is mag tested or x-rayed. Of course we're dealing with 20-30,000 tons of floating steel the size of a couple of football fields that gets beat to death and flexes a LOT. So, I do know you can have a pretty weld fail, and a crappy weld pass. But, when you can look at a frame weld and can tell it was a cold weld with minimal to no penetration into the steel, it's not a good sign. Just a matter of time before a failure.

I have a tad of faith in ours. It's been towed around 5000 miles on some pretty bad roads, and I haven't seen any signs of failure yet.
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:01 AM   #150
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BigJohnD- The point I tried to make was the fact that Lippert used the wrong material for the job. The 6x2 tubing used had a wall thickness almost half of the pinbox side plate mounts. The tubing itself sheered. Maybe 2007 was the only year they made this mistake, but they should own up to it and make it right instead of the jerking around and lying they did to me.
Also all, don't think for a second there are only a few of us this happened to. There are many this happened to in other Wildcat forums and the like. Early detection is tough. Even with a bore scope I couldn't tell the severity of it until I took the fascia down. An on sight repair for this could be $6000. Luckily I'm a fabricator/mechanic and repaired and replaced it myself.

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