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Old 02-08-2012, 11:13 AM   #21
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Hi guys I really feel this needed to be cleared up. ALL WILDCAT EXTRALITE trailers and fifth wheels ARE able to be towed by today's and the last 7 years of Ford, Chevy, Dodge and some older yet. Keep in mind Wildcat offers what is arguably the best cargo carrying capacity in the industry. That would mean you could actually load the weight of a Honda civic and the unit would not be over the GVWR. That being said no one does this in my 18 years in the industry I have not see that much gear. Yes I know I will hear otherwise on this but really who is really loading 2000#s or more in gear? Again we listen and watch closely to trends and I for one have not seen this. That being said ALL EXTRALITE Wildcats are towable by today's half ton trucks. Please if you have said otherwise take the time to correct this on the forums as you took the time to write the unintentional misinformation. This will only help un confuse possible customers and give a breath of relaxation to ones that were I'll informed. As always I am a Huge supporter of forums like this and yes at times some issues cannot be solved for many reasons. However I believe sharing information in a setting like this with the most correct information possible is a great idea especially one that is full of Wildcat enthusiasts. Cheers to all and safe travels!

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Old 02-08-2012, 01:17 PM   #22
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Tow ratings

Interesting discussions, but I would suggest looking at the tow ratings charts on the internet. This is one such link.
Truck and SUV Towing Capacity Chart

Yes there are some half ton trucks with 6 cylinder engines that have limited tow capability. I pulled a 7200 # weighed travel trailer with a half-ton truck rated at 9,000# in the Rocky Mountains with no problems. The truck does have to have the tow package which includes an extra transmission cooling package. If you have to climb a 8% hill that is 10 miles long, do watch your transmission temperature. Also Answer the question on where you want to travel.

Simply stated, look at the charts. If you have a limited truck, then you have limited choice of trailers. If you like a specific trailer, then make sure you get a truck that can pull it without difficulty. I would also suggest getting a trailer that is no more than 80% of the max towing rate of the truck, so you can add a reasonable amount of cargo.
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Old 02-08-2012, 02:13 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by TomCat View Post
Hi guys I really feel this needed to be cleared up. ALL WILDCAT EXTRALITE trailers and fifth wheels ARE able to be towed by today's and the last 7 years of Ford, Chevy, Dodge and some older yet. Keep in mind Wildcat offers what is arguably the best cargo carrying capacity in the industry. That would mean you could actually load the weight of a Honda civic and the unit would not be over the GVWR. That being said no one does this in my 18 years in the industry I have not see that much gear. Yes I know I will hear otherwise on this but really who is really loading 2000#s or more in gear? Again we listen and watch closely to trends and I for one have not seen this. That being said ALL EXTRALITE Wildcats are towable by today's half ton trucks. Please if you have said otherwise take the time to correct this on the forums as you took the time to write the unintentional misinformation. This will only help un confuse possible customers and give a breath of relaxation to ones that were I'll informed. As always I am a Huge supporter of forums like this and yes at times some issues cannot be solved for many reasons. However I believe sharing information in a setting like this with the most correct information possible is a great idea especially one that is full of Wildcat enthusiasts. Cheers to all and safe travels!

Tomcat

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It’s not clear to me who is providing the misinformation in terms of the capability of half ton trucks towing your EXTRAlite 5th wheel campers.

Again you prefer to focus on the maximum towing capacity specification of the tow vehicle and not the payload capacity. For any tow vehicle, whether it be half, three quarter or one ton, you’ll exceed the payload capacity (or GVWR) of the truck long before the maximum towing weight.

I’ve towed my Rockwood 8280WS with a Ram 1500 almost 2 years with many of towing miles and it handled the job quite satisfactorily, including trips to the mountains in West Virginia. In fact, I prefer it over my current TV in many ways.

I have scaled weights for my set-up with the Ram 1500/Rockwood 8280WS:

The camper, ready to camp has a pin weight of 1240 lbs, and total weight of 8300 lbs. With it hitched to the truck (with 430 lbs people/pets plus full fuel), I was 430 lbs over the truck’s GVWR, 20 lbs under the RAWR and 140 lbs over the GCWR.

Tow Vehicle 2005 Ram 1500 QC SB Hemi 2WD with 3.92 rear. The 2012 towing specs for a Ram 1500 are virtually identical to the 2005. The Fords and GMs have higher ratings but also weigh more and therefore have similar, or slightly higher payload capacity. An exception is the Ford with the max payload option (GVWR 8200 lb), but you need to opt for a regular cab with 8’ box to gain the extra payload capacity.

With a EXTRAlite unloaded pin weight of 1440 to 1560 lb (probably 1800lb when the camper is loaded) and loaded camper weight of about 9500 - 10000 lb., the RAWR, GVWR and GCWR limits of the half ton tow vehicle will be exceeded. How does this fit your definition of ‘half ton towable’.

Dave
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Old 02-08-2012, 05:34 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Dave_Monica View Post
It’s not clear to me who is providing the misinformation in terms of the capability of half ton trucks towing your EXTRAlite 5th wheel campers.

Again you prefer to focus on the maximum towing capacity specification of the tow vehicle and not the payload capacity. For any tow vehicle, whether it be half, three quarter or one ton, you’ll exceed the payload capacity (or GVWR) of the truck long before the maximum towing weight.

I’ve towed my Rockwood 8280WS with a Ram 1500 almost 2 years with many of towing miles and it handled the job quite satisfactorily, including trips to the mountains in West Virginia. In fact, I prefer it over my current TV in many ways.

I have scaled weights for my set-up with the Ram 1500/Rockwood 8280WS:

The camper, ready to camp has a pin weight of 1240 lbs, and total weight of 8300 lbs. With it hitched to the truck (with 430 lbs people/pets plus full fuel), I was 430 lbs over the truck’s GVWR, 20 lbs under the RAWR and 140 lbs over the GCWR.

Tow Vehicle 2005 Ram 1500 QC SB Hemi 2WD with 3.92 rear. The 2012 towing specs for a Ram 1500 are virtually identical to the 2005. The Fords and GMs have higher ratings but also weigh more and therefore have similar, or slightly higher payload capacity. An exception is the Ford with the max payload option (GVWR 8200 lb), but you need to opt for a regular cab with 8’ box to gain the extra payload capacity.

With a EXTRAlite unloaded pin weight of 1440 to 1560 lb (probably 1800lb when the camper is loaded) and loaded camper weight of about 9500 - 10000 lb., the RAWR, GVWR and GCWR limits of the half ton tow vehicle will be exceeded. How does this fit your definition of ‘half ton towable’.

Dave
Exactly Dave. Our last 5er was a Wildcat 28rkbs (2011) Scaled on the 2008 GMC 3/4 diesel we were over the GVWR of 9200lbs. Just slightly but all the same over. It seems that the weight of the truck is what everyone forgets about. Our new 3500 scales full of fuel and with myself and my wife at 8257lbs, that leaves 3243lbs to play with. Thats why I upgraded to a 1 ton, and of course momma wanted a bigger 5er. I have not scaled the new trailer yet but I will post when I do.
Oh, don't even ask, and if you do, ask my wife why we don't have the 2011 Wildcat anymore.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:37 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by TomCat View Post
Hi guys I really feel this needed to be cleared up. ALL WILDCAT EXTRALITE trailers and fifth wheels ARE able to be towed by today's and the last 7 years of Ford, Chevy, Dodge and some older yet. Keep in mind Wildcat offers what is arguably the best cargo carrying capacity in the industry. That would mean you could actually load the weight of a Honda civic and the unit would not be over the GVWR. That being said no one does this in my 18 years in the industry I have not see that much gear. Yes I know I will hear otherwise on this but really who is really loading 2000#s or more in gear? Again we listen and watch closely to trends and I for one have not seen this. That being said ALL EXTRALITE Wildcats are towable by today's half ton trucks.
Do the Wildcat Extralites fall within the tow ratings of many 1/2 ton trucks......yes. Would the pin weights overload many 1/2 ton trucks.....absolutely.

I will use my 2006 (within the stated last 7 years) F150 for an example. Mine has the higher 7200 lb. GVWR of that year, plus a 9300 lb. tow rating. By the tow rating, I can tow a 5th wheel. But even the lightest pin weight for the Extralites is listed at 1440 lbs. My truck empty (but with some personal gear, tonneau cover, and TracRac rails) with me in the seat weighs in around 5900. Even without loading up the missus and dog, I would be over the GVWR of my truck just by hooking up an "empty" Extralite.....heaven forbid if I add stuff to the camper. And what about the weight of the hitch ??

My RAWR is 3850 lbs. that is at 2600 lbs. with the truck empty. Since all of the pin weight is going to be put on the rear axle, I will be exceeding my RAWR by several hundred pounds with an empty trailer.

All of this, and I am still within my tow rating, and probably my GCWR. I am a firm believer that all weight ratings should be adhered to, not just the tow rating. People hook up a 5th wheel trailer to a 1/2 ton truck, and then start adding air bags or extra spring leafs. That does not increase the weight rating of the axle.....it just keeps the back of the truck from squatting as much. Those axles are still the semi-floating styles with all of the weight on the axles....not a good thing.

I will now step off of my soap box.
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Old 02-09-2012, 12:30 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by tedstr View Post
Interesting discussions, but I would suggest looking at the tow ratings charts on the internet. This is one such link.
Truck and SUV Towing Capacity Chart
The chart that you suggest I read lists only the maximum towing capacity that a tow vehicle is rated for. That's, in my mind, the least important specification as I could easily change that limit by increasing the rear axle ratio.

Rear axle weight ratings (RAWR) of the tow vehicle for 5th wheel towing is always the limiting factor for a half ton. Others will say the truck's gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), but that's another discussion. Most of today's half ton truck GVWR will be exceeded when loaded with the pin weight of a 5th wheel. Unlike max towing capacity, GVWR and RAWR cannot be changed...there inherent to the design.

The easiest way to determine the true payload capacity of your truck, is to weight it, loaded as it would be when camping including hitch and full fuel. The payload capacity will be the difference between the truck's GVWR and the actual weight of the truck. If you want to determine the payload capacity by using the RAWR, it would be the difference between the truck's RAWR and the rear axle weight of the truck loaded for camping. Payload capacity by using the RAWR is higher.

Dave
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:30 PM   #27
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Good point Dave. I agree that one should always look at all the weight numbers. On my GMC 2500HD with a 3.71 axle the tow limit is 9000# , but I purchased a 4.1 axle ratio so my tow rating increased to 12,000#. I still believe in the 80% of the max is a good rule of thumb. You are correct that there are two limits on towing, the power of the engine and the strength of the rear axle.
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Old 03-28-2012, 12:51 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by tedstr
Good point Dave. I agree that one should always look at all the weight numbers. On my GMC 2500HD with a 3.71 axle the tow limit is 9000# , but I purchased a 4.1 axle ratio so my tow rating increased to 12,000#. I still believe in the 80% of the max is a good rule of thumb. You are correct that there are two limits on towing, the power of the engine and the strength of the rear axle.
I'm confused. I don't get how changing an axle ratio changes anything?
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:23 PM   #29
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I'm confused. I don't get how changing an axle ratio changes anything?
A high ratio like 3.73:1 compared to a lower gear ratio such as 4.10:1 puts more of a strain on the drivetrain components making it harder to do work. So by going to a 4:10, it's easier to do the same work so in turn you can usually increase your tow capacity.
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Old 04-20-2012, 05:22 PM   #30
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I said I would post weights

Quote:
Originally Posted by hatstomper View Post
Exactly Dave. Our last 5er was a Wildcat 28rkbs (2011) Scaled on the 2008 GMC 3/4 diesel we were over the GVWR of 9200lbs. Just slightly but all the same over. It seems that the weight of the truck is what everyone forgets about. Our new 3500 scales full of fuel and with myself and my wife at 8257lbs, that leaves 3243lbs to play with. Thats why I upgraded to a 1 ton, and of course momma wanted a bigger 5er. I have not scaled the new trailer yet but I will post when I do.
Oh, don't even ask, and if you do, ask my wife why we don't have the 2011 Wildcat anymore.
Just truck, 2 people full of fuel.
Front Axle - 4806 lbs
Rear Axle - 3527 lbs
Total - 8333 lbs, must have put on some weight this winter


With trailer, full of water and camping stuff.
Front Axle - 4806lbs
Rear Axle - 5489lbs
Trailer Axle - 8796lbs
Makes the pin weight 1962lbs
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