What type of qa/qc is there at the factory?

[Weezer]

Someone succinctly commented the other day that an RV in transit is equal to a S&B home experiencing a mini earthquake. Absolutely true!

And regarding rough roads, try navigating I-20 West through Bossier City approaching Shreveport. There should be a highway sign:

Install Mouth Guards Before Proceeding

Or you just might be searching for the nearest dentist.

And;

Stop At Next Rest Area Before Proceeding If You're Not Wearing Depends

Or you may need to pull over and change underwear.

It really IS that rough.

Unfortunately that stretch of highway must be navigated to get to our dealer just west of it.

[itat]

It doesn't have to be a foreign manufacturer to shake up the current state of QC/QA in the RV industry. Whoever it is though, if they ever arrive, they'll need at least 3 things:
- the right attitude towards quality from the ground up. It's a cultural attitude within the company from the shop floor to the president.
- the same commitment to quality from all their feeder companies who supply all their components and systems (or they'll have to make those components and systems in-house), and
- a competent, customer-focused dealer network

I think it's reasonably accurate to say that the RV industry today is about where the domestic auto industry used to be (although exactly when - 70s or 80s - is a point for debate), except that the RV dealer network model isn't the same. Today's RV manufacturers can produce a decent quality product but not consistently. Today, Ford, GM and Chrysler can produce a consistently good quality product because of a shift in their corporate culture to be more like the Japanese model. I'm still not convinced on their dealer network though.

Yes, an RV is like a house going down the road. Some roads are extremely unforgiving but that's not the norm. IMHO the reason we hear about the issue we do here on this forum on brand new units, is a lack of corporate, top to bottom, commitment to quality. Today's RVs and their systems should be designed to work as intended in the typical environment which they'll encounter when they leave the factory. No parts falling off, no hydraulics leaking, no roofs leaking and no delamination ever.

I guess the big question is, will all that better QC/QA and a consistently good quality product mean higher prices that we're prepared to pay?

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by itat

I guess the big question is, will all that better QC/QA and a consistently good quality product mean higher prices that we're prepared to pay?

Good question.

Paid $30,000 for my trailer.
I wouldn't have paid 40,000 for the same trailer having the same warranty.

[BamaBob]

#1 I still say it is all about your dealer. Our dealer, recognizing that there are often "issues" coming from the factory, has a full time staff of 3 PDI. They inspect the rigs before they are ever put on the lot for sale and when you purchase one, the PDI team takes you through *everything* - our PDI took almost 4 hours.

#2 if what you have is still shoddely repaired, consider taking a week off, come to the Goshen International FROG Rally in Aug and have FR fix your unit right for free.

#3 There is a FR Wildcat rep on the forums, I have sent him a PM to come check out this thread.

[Rugged Brown]

I walked through a new motorhome at a dealership, not so near to me and I noticed little blue dots stuck all over the place. I asked the salesmen what they were for. He said that the unit hadn't be PDI'd yet. These are indicators for things that must be fixed before it is sold. This told me two things. 1) The dealership is very diligent in providing an excellent product and 2) the manufacturer, not so.

[B47]

Originally Posted by RSchleder

Reminds me of buying a new car in the 70's. QC was missing but finally the American car manufacturers got with the program and today, make EXCELLENT quality cars & trucks.
Trying to remember what the "driving force" was that woke up the US car companies. Oh yeah, now I remember----the Japanese began selling cars in the US!!!! Hummmmm, ya gotta wonder if------------?

Reminds me of a story or possibly rumor about an American built car in the 70's. The owner kept complaining of a rattle in one of the doors - after several attempts without any luck the dealer finally removed the doors interior lining.

They found a soda can inside one of the doors - it had a note wrapped around it asking "How long did it take you to find the rattle?"

[bobby75]

[QUOTE=f1100turbo;638025]Lol not arguing either.
Just pointing out how silly the comparisons are.

Maybe someday we'll see a China bomb on a China trailer in the us.

TURBS

I Think you apologists have missed the point all together The OP posed a question related To his original problem(s) This is a major problem and he has not "ran it up in down the highway yet" In the auto industries this is what is known as an initial defect. Not good. We have owned a Flagstaff 8528ikws for about 6 months and put over 10,000 miles on it with small defects which we hope to have set right in Goshen The one minor defect indicates the attitude about good QA rather than functionality - large paint missing on the steps - too large to miss on assembly. I wonder if turbs problems finally got taken care of by the factory rather than the dealer' maybe the factory-dealers relation is part of the problem.

[Iwannacamp]

I see a lot of posts about buying used...so the bugs are worked out...I did and a cleaner 2 YO trailer was not to be found(they were OCD). I still had a few problems. Last weeks was to replace charger/inverter. $250 and my labor...back in action. Last time it was heater failure...before that a/c blower problems. Don't give up..just do some praying.

[Wildcat Chris]

Originally Posted by HSVBamaBob

#3 There is a FR Wildcat rep on the forums, I have sent him a PM to come check out this thread.

I'm here! I write you this post from my office 20 steps from the production line. I ate lunch with my warranty and service rep (who also reads these forums) and discussed quality and service the entire time. I just finished a meeting with my plant manager regarding updates on several ongoing efforts to improve our quality and to continuously improve the product, the process, and even the people here.

I'm ABSOLUTELY committed to providing Wildcat customers the most value for their hard-earned money. This is NOT an easy task -- as many have noted, there's much that can go wrong. Quality failures can run the gamut from bad workmanship to faulty componentry to poor design to mental attitude of production, sales, and management -- but we're addressing these issues as quickly as possible and in the best way we know. I can assure you we're pushing weekly, daily, and hourly for improvement.

My team here is committed to building a better RV, not just "better than the competition" (which, it seems, is easier all the time). Sure, you can say it's lip service or marketing or "sales speak," but I invite you all to come visit the Wildcat plant and I'll show you how we're doing it differently than the rest of the industry...

[Wildcat Chris]

Originally Posted by toecutter73

On May 3, 2014 we picked up our brand new 2014 Wildcat 317rl from the dealership. We made it home and discovered hydraulic fluid leaking under one of the slides (we have 3). We contacted the dealership and drove it back in for repairs, they thought they have fixed the problem(took 3 weeks) so we brought it home to discover another hydraulic fluid leak. We drove it back again to the dealership who fixed it again, this time we waited for the repair to be done. Again got home with it and discovered the 3rd and final slide also had a leak this one was so severe it has fluid in the bedroom not only under the slide/bed but it has moved into the carpet under the bed. We have not even got to use our Wildcat. Unhappy RV'r.

This is quite atypical of the hydraulic systems on the 317RL, which we've been building for many years. Please send me a private message with your complete contact information, VIN#, and your Wildcat dealer. I'll forward this along to our service team for more help!

[TURBS]

[QUOTE=bobby75;638261]

Originally Posted by f1100turbo

Lol not arguing either.
Just pointing out how silly the comparisons are.

Maybe someday we'll see a China bomb on a China trailer in the us.

TURBS

I Think you apologists have missed the point all together The OP posed a question related To his original problem(s) This is a major problem and he has not "ran it up in down the highway yet" In the auto industries this is what is known as an initial defect. Not good. We have owned a Flagstaff 8528ikws for about 6 months and put over 10,000 miles on it with small defects which we hope to have set right in Goshen The one minor defect indicates the attitude about good QA rather than functionality - large paint missing on the steps - too large to miss on assembly. I wonder if turbs problems finally got taken care of by the factory rather than the dealer' maybe the factory-dealers relation is part of the problem.

How did it get from the factory to the dealer? Fly?
Mine traveled 500 miles to my dealer and went thru Illinois/ Chicago to get here.
That was kind of my point.
Some units travel thousands of miles before the end user gets it.
Do you think the delivery driver drives around potholes to miss it with the trailer? probably not.
Ever traveled thru northern Indiana and central Illinois?


Now besides that if it was leaking when the dealer got it then it should have shown up in a proper and extensive pdi upon arrival and before delivery.

[BamaBob]

Originally Posted by Wildcat Chris

This is quite atypical of the hydraulic systems on the 317RL, which we've been building for many years. Please send me a private message with your complete contact information, VIN#, and your Wildcat dealer. I'll forward this along to our service team for more help!

Chris, you rock...YA reason we are loyal FR owners,

Chris...something you COULD encourage back at the factory...is to make it Corporate Culture to have a Factory Rep for EVERY FR Product Line become a member of FRF and post in their respective Forum Areas.

Looking forweard to meeting you and the team at Goshen!

[BamaBob]

[QUOTE=f1100turbo;638319]

Originally Posted by bobby75

How did it get from the factory to the dealer? Fly?
Mine traveled 500 miles to my dealer and went thru Illinois/ Chicago to get here.
That was kind of my point.
Some units travel thousands of miles before the end user gets it.
Do you think the delivery driver drives around potholes to miss it with the trailer? probably not.
Ever traveled thru northern Indiana and central Illinois?


Now besides that if it was leaking when the dealer got it then it should have shown up in a proper and extensive pdi upon arrival and before delivery.

X2 TURBS - and having recently (like this weekend ) returned from a trip that went Up I65 from Huntsville to Ft Wayne and over to Eastpointe MI, returning I75/I65 to Huntsville I have 2 observations:

Bad News: ALL Interstates above KY Suck!

Good News: EVERY Interstate we drove on was getting repairs in the most egregious stretches of road.

Bad News: They were repairing the *&%!! things on our trip

X2 on the PDI as well!

And as for delivery well, X3! and who delivers the RVs? Folks like you and me
See for yourself:
https://www.google.com/searchq=rv+delivery+opportunities

[TURBS]

[QUOTE=HSVBamaBob;638332]

Originally Posted by f1100turbo

X2 TURBS - and having recently (like this weekend ) returned from a trip that went Up I65 from Huntsville to Ft Wayne and over to Eastpointe MI, returning I75/I65 to Huntsville I have 2 observations:

Bad News: ALL Interstates above KY Suck!

Good News: EVERY Interstate we drove on was getting repairs in the most egregious stretches of road.

Bad News: They were repairing the *&%!! things on our trip

X2 on the PDI as well!

And as for delivery well, X3! and who delivers the RVs? Folks like you and me
See for yourself:
https://www.google.com/searchq=rv+delivery+opportunities

You know what I travel a lot on I 80 I see delivery units all the time there are some really really nice delivery trucks pulling "our" campers however today I seen the biggest pos dodge hauling a Sabre most likely headed to walcott Iowa home of Cheyenne camper sales.
It was like a $2,500 crapper pulling a $40,000 unit.
I don't think there was a straight panel on that truck.
Oh bother.

[RSchleder]

[QUOTE=f1100turbo;638016]BigJohnD,
Why does everybody believe that a foreign made trailer would be better then the us?
Becuase there cars/vehicles are better?

Just because a foreign auto maker can build a car to last 300,000 + miles doesn't mean there house on wheels quality will be better . No?
��

TURBS


"Sabre owners united"[/QUOTE

The quality of an foreign made RV may not be any better than the ones manufactured by US companies. That's really not my point. My point is, the RV industry is about where the US auto industry was in the 70"s and THERE IS plenty of room for improvement in their product quality/reliability.
Be assured, after RV'ing since 1970 and owning a dozen RV's all the way from Jayco fold down to high end Allegro Bus 40' Diesel pusher, I understand the issues with making a home travel down our highways.
Also, after spending 38 years as a manufacturing/Quality Assurance manager in the electronics industry, I do understand the world of quality and what it takes to produce a cost competitive product.
My point is not directed toward the things in our RV's that fail due to usage and poor roads conditions. It is the poor/shoddy workmanship as well as inadequate design, that occurs prior to or during the manufacturing process. This forum, like all other RV forums, is filled with problems/issues caused by poor design/workmanship and it is those items that can, AND SHOULD, be addressed by US Rv companies. I will never be convinced, as some seen to believe, that's it's cheaper to simply fix defects during the warranty period than it is to do it right the first time. And yes, I've toured several RV manufacturing plants all the way from TT to high end motor coaches and have yet to see a comprehensive quality plan in place.

[Rugged Brown]

[QUOTE=f1100turbo;638319]

Originally Posted by bobby75

How did it get from the factory to the dealer? Fly?
Mine traveled 500 miles to my dealer and went thru Illinois/ Chicago to get here.
That was kind of my point.
Some units travel thousands of miles before the end user gets it.
Do you think the delivery driver drives around potholes to miss it with the trailer? probably not.
Ever traveled thru northern Indiana and central Illinois?


Now besides that if it was leaking when the dealer got it then it should have shown up in a proper and extensive pdi upon arrival and before delivery.

I remember a few years ago while driving the highways here in Canada, actually west of Montreal on the 401, and noticed a 5 ton flatbed with a 20' TT on the bed and another one in tow. I assumed it was the delivery guy. He had that 5 ton cranked, the TT on the bed was bouncing and testing the strength of the tie downs and I'm sure the TT in tow, I saw the 4 wheels leave the ground on one big dip in the road. those 2 campers took a beating and I would hate to see the condition when they arrived at their destination, if in fact they ever arrived. Another thought came to mind is I wonder if the drivers sleep in the campers and use the facilities.

[Oakman]

[QUOTE=Rugged Brown;638762]

Originally Posted by f1100turbo

I remember a few years ago while driving the highways here in Canada, actually west of Montreal on the 401, and noticed a 5 ton flatbed with a 20' TT on the bed and another one in tow. I assumed it was the delivery guy. He had that 5 ton cranked, the TT on the bed was bouncing and testing the strength of the tie downs and I'm sure the TT in tow, I saw the 4 wheels leave the ground on one big dip in the road. those 2 campers took a beating and I would hate to see the condition when they arrived at their destination, if in fact they ever arrived. Another thought came to mind is I wonder if the drivers sleep in the campers and use the facilities.

They're not supposed to use the camper but who knows? Another thing, time is money for the transport haulers so if you think they're driving with those trailer tires at 65 MPH or less think again.

[Platokidd]

China has broke into just about every market we have here in the U.S. do they have QC ?



Could this Chinese RV become an Amazing RV in the USA? | TFLTruck.com: Truck News, Views & Reviews | The Fast Lane TruckTFLTruck.com: Truck News, Views & Reviews | The Fast Lane Truck

Major Chinese RV manufacturers
Zhongtian High-tech Special Vehicle Co. Ltd.
Great Wall Automobile
NORINCO Motors
Qingdao Chuntian RV
Henan Frestec RV
Jiangsu ZhongOu RV
Shandong SYT RV
Kinglong Coach

[Taybrynn]

It saddens me every time I look at a part that says 'made in China' .... Since it used to be 'USA' and the quality was ten times better ... Sigh

[itat]

Delivery of their units is completely within the control of the manufacturer. They can hire any old yahoo or they can hire professional drivers. Again, all part of their commitment to supply a quality product to the consumer from design to manufacture to delivery to after-sales service.

I'd only consider a RV manufacturer from a country that has a mature, reputable manufacturing sector with a good distribution and dealer network in my area. Can they produce quality base materials, manufactured parts/systems and do they have skilled, motivated labor? China is not there yet.