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Old 09-10-2016, 09:20 AM   #1
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Forest River no more

This is the body of an email I had to send to Forest River:
FR, Flagstaff Micro-Lite 25DKS


Our third FR RV and our most disappointing experience yet. It makes me wonder what Warren Buffet taught y'all about cutting corners for profits. We have been in it on our maiden voyage for two weeks: poorly sealed or not sealed at all interstices between the bathtub/shower and the wall; blackwater tank leak; greywater tank drainage; bathroom sink drainage. This is not only totally unacceptable, it reeks of lack of attention to detail and makes me question the overall quality of this RV. I am very close to trading it in at a loss to cut my losses and I shouldn't have to do that with a brand new RV. Also, you may want to pull Country Creek's (Mississippi) sales ability. They provided virtually no dealer prep, were not honest about a number of things including the extended warranty contract they sold me. IMHO if you want to maintain a reputation for the quality we experienced with our prior 2 RV's you need to pay attention to detail. Bob Byrne knows me and I'm sure he would not be happy with my experience. Could you handle a swap plus cash for a better RV in Indiana? I shouldn't have to lose money if I do that for another FR RV. I am disappointed and very concerned.

Since the FR response did not provide for a full credit and swap I discovered the Grand Design line. I took a $4K beating on the trade but I believe obtained a much better constructed RV.

Having said that I would caution Forum readers about buying from Country Creek in Hattiesburg MS. IMHO if they had provided thorough dealer prep most if not all of these problems would have been discovered.

The next caution is if anyone tries to sell you an "extended warranty" from "XtraRide". The promised roadside assistance is a joke. You can cancel as I am doing but it must run through the selling dealer and will take 4-6 weeks to process a check. I find this totally unacceptable. Country Creek expected me to drive from Mobile AL to Hattiesburg to sign a form and getting them to send me one was like pulling teeth. Three days later no form. I complained to the owner and demanded he FedEx one to me and the piker refused to spend $15 to do it. Then he said 4-6 weeks because he has to wait for XtraRide to send him payment. He's too cheap to front the money - only $1800. Some businessman! Oh, BTW, the XtraRide "protection" is underwritten by Protective Life....not a great company IMHO.

I am now beginning to believe the lack of attention to detail by FR. I will never buy one again. And, IMHO avoid Country Creek.

Henry Schwarzberg JD
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Old 09-10-2016, 09:27 AM   #2
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I read this several times. I'm not trying to be a butt, but do I understand that you bought a low end FR trailer and are complaining to this degree because the shower is not caulked against the wall, and one tank is 'leaking'?

If you want to hammer dealers, do that. Over half aren't worth a bucket of spit.

But some of us, me included, are ecstatically happy with our FR products. It's obvious they have some lemons. But it may just be me, but I'm having trouble understanding the reasoning behind your situation.

Edit: I just read it again. So you bought a $15K camper and hate it, and only lost $4K on a trade for a $30K camper, and you haven't used it yet but are convinced it's way better.......... is that correct?
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Old 09-10-2016, 09:40 AM   #3
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Reading your bio I would have thought you would have checked everything carefully. As mentioned if its a low end camper then you get what ya pay for. Later RJD
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Old 09-10-2016, 09:44 AM   #4
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After having an R-POD with great dealer prep by Couch RV and no problems, and then a 21FBRS from Berryland with a few issues done in a day, yes, I have a problem with the shape in which the 25DKS was delivered. FR is approving all the items for a fix but I don't perceive the 25DKS to be such a "low end" unit. What I am really heated about is Country Creek, their lack of attention to detail, and their response about taking their sweet time to refund me $$ for a "policy" they misreprented.
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Old 09-10-2016, 09:46 AM   #5
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I can find the 25DKS for $15K. That's as low end as a camper gets, short of a tiny, tiny one. The Grand Design is a high end........it's great......no doubt! Impressive. But it's double the price. You can't compare a Chevy Cruze with a Lexus.

And your email/letter is not to a dealer. It's to Forest River. Did you give Forest River a chance to rectify things?

And are the sum of your issues truly shower caulking and one leak? Or am I missing something? I may be, just asking.

Wait......my reading comprehension is terrible I guess. You just said FR is fixing all the items, right?

Yet your email is vilifying them, no?
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Old 09-10-2016, 12:27 PM   #6
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Lol.. The lack of attention to detail is all on you! Always blaming someone else???
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Old 09-10-2016, 12:37 PM   #7
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IMHO, a "low-end" TTYL should be "low-end" because of lack of bells and whistles - not because of poor workmanship. I owned a Wildwood bunkhouse - it was simple but well-built. Now own a Rockwood - more bells and whistles, but a Frig that freezes our food, a slide out that squeals when deployed, and several workmanship issues that would have cost nothing for Forest River to have done right in the first place.

When I buy a $99 mattress, I don't expect it to feel like or last as long as a $500 mattress, but I do expect the covering to be sewn on and the springs to be inside.
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Old 09-10-2016, 12:38 PM   #8
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I meant Travel Trailer, not TTYL.
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Old 09-10-2016, 12:49 PM   #9
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Agreed (w rockfossil)
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Old 09-10-2016, 12:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockfossilman View Post
IMHO, a "low-end" TTYL should be "low-end" because of lack of bells and whistles - not because of poor workmanship. I owned a Wildwood bunkhouse - it was simple but well-built. Now own a Rockwood - more bells and whistles, but a Frig that freezes our food, a slide out that squeals when deployed, and several workmanship issues that would have cost nothing for Forest River to have done right in the first place.

When I buy a $99 mattress, I don't expect it to feel like or last as long as a $500 mattress, but I do expect the covering to be sewn on and the springs to be inside.
EXACTLY!
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Old 09-10-2016, 01:19 PM   #11
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We have had the XtraRide platinum coverage for 5 years. We have used it all over the country with no problems. Just got a hydraulic jack and all slide seals replaced by an independent and they covered all but the $50 deductible. We definitely got our $$$ worth and would highly recommend them. Don't know why the OP had problems.
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Old 09-10-2016, 01:19 PM   #12
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My only comment is on the dealer prep. Not sure if any dealer would have caught the tank failure unless a FW tank. I have read on forums some stating they would never pay for a PDI. I have paid on my last 4 campers all purchased from the same dealer. A tech goes through each one quickly prior to acceptance looking for major problems. They have refused to accept campers with major problems. After acceptance a tech goes over every unit looking for minor issues. At purchase the same tech spends as much time as the buyer wants/needs going over everything. The FW tank is filled and all systems functioning for the buyer to understand how they work. I don't care what charges are on the purchase order, all I care about is bottom line. IMO they do a great job. In 3 of those purchases 1 had a cabinet closure that needed replaced. Worth paying a little more to me!
Sadly every builder is shipping units that have problems thus the selling dealer becomes the last stage of the build process. Most do no better job than the factory.
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Old 09-10-2016, 01:19 PM   #13
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I agree with Uphill, fewer bells and whistles but not short on quality and workmanship. I would assume all FR products to be made with the same quality and attention to detail regardless of the price. Maybe the amount of insulation, number of cabinets, material of cabinets, chairs, tables different, but it should all be put together the same way and not have gaps. It is NOT a second, it is a first run, just a less expensive unit.

On another note, I read a piece last week about RVing coming to an end in about 20 years due to FR and Thor owning the industry and all of us demanding more and more bells and whistles but not wanting to pay for it. I think it was posted on this forum and was a good read.
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Old 09-10-2016, 01:45 PM   #14
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Just for the record. We purchased our first RV 2 years ago. It is a Forest River Cedar Creek. We have had some issues (who hasn't?). We have always had courteous and reasonable assistance, whenever we requested it, from our dealer (Couch's RV Nation), Customer Service and Warranty at Cedar Creek and a Forest River dealer near Galax, Virginia (Johnson Family RV) who gladly helped us and kept us on the road. We are and we remain very happy in our decision to buy a Forest River RV.
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Old 09-10-2016, 01:49 PM   #15
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Grand design is not high end lol.
My boss paid less then 10k less then what I paid for my Columbus and his has had a multitude of issues.
Cheap components and very plain.
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Old 09-10-2016, 02:10 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by thandel View Post
Just for the record. We purchased our first RV 2 years ago. It is a Forest River Cedar Creek. We have had some issues (who hasn't?). We have always had courteous and reasonable assistance, whenever we requested it, from our dealer (Couch's RV Nation), Customer Service and Warranty at Cedar Creek and a Forest River dealer near Galax, Virginia (Johnson Family RV) who gladly helped us and kept us on the road. We are and we remain very happy in our decision to buy a Forest River RV.
The dealer makes a big difference. We bought our Wildwood 261BHXL from a dealer who gave us a 15-minute walk-through and had difficulty answering any questions we had in the two years we owned it. We bought our Rockwood 2604ws from Campers Inn RV Pittsburgh and got a 1-hour walk-through and excellent warranty service on a stove-top and missing part issue. A couple issues came up that were easier to repair myself than bother the dealer. I've come to realize that being just a little bit handy is helpful when buying a trailer.
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Old 09-10-2016, 02:16 PM   #17
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Unhappy forest river

I was told the forest river I bought was the "Cadillac" of rv's. it is upper end
but I have had many, many problems with it and still do. have had to have it in the shop about 3 weeks total. we are on an extended vacation cross coun try and it is costing us to motel it which adds up. anyway I agree with this gentleman. I considered trading it but I do not want to get whacked financially. some things I am trying to fix myself. and might I add the issues I have/had are major ones (besides water from my leaking shower too). Should I list it would take awhile. major components already replaced for failure. yes-where is the attention to detail? and, might I add, I am new to this forujm and have received some helpful info from some members, but where is the compassion for these folk? who cares what he spent for his rig-it should be perfect. remember my rig is my dream-his is his dream and so forth!!!! there is no excuse for lazy inferior craftsmanship(hate to use that term for fr garbage). I feel your frustration my fellow rv'er!!!! they r fast to take our moola!!! I have to say my toilet was rushed to me from dometic with no questions asked. my ac unit was replaced but took 7 business days to ship --and there is more --failed ignitor on my hot water heater, kaput converter, broken vent lid (leaking rain), heater not putting out warm air, the awning bangs during operation because the rails are not aligned correctly, etc etc. I mean come on. And top end mind you. I had better luck with my low end rig years ago and my other rig I traded. never again
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Old 09-10-2016, 02:20 PM   #18
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forest river

and I forgot the kitchen floor is buckled all over. I am sure there is more. Cadillac? more like a ghetto cruiser
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Old 09-10-2016, 02:38 PM   #19
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When I have a brand new RV and within the first 2 weeks of the first trip I experience: bathroom faucets ready to come off, blackwater tank leak, greywater drainage issues, bathroom sink with defective flapper valve, questionably operating thermostat, middle burner not responding to igniter, one outer door with some warping, both doors sticking, very low volume on outside speakers, gaps between shower walls and bathroom walls, and in the first 3 weeks of ownership without moving it a hole in the roof sealing that needed sealing, how am I not to conclude that this unit was not shoddily put together? And why don't I have a right to expect most of these defects to not exist with the represented quality dealer prep occured?
As for XtraRide, I was not told that I would have to pay for roadside service and then send the bills incurred to some god forsaken place in Missouri so that they might reimburse all or a part of the costs? Finally, when I demanded to cancel the contract I was informed I needed to sign a form and send it to the dealer who would be cutting the reimbursement check - in 4 to 6 weeks. For me this is amateur hour. If were a creditable dealer I would cut the check and I would await reimbursement from XtraRide. Country Creek's sales mgr. said he would mail me the form when I said there was no way I was driving from Mobile to Hattiesburg to sign a bloody form. I believe he lied because 4 days and no form. The owner is such a piker he refused to FedEx me the form because it would cost him $15. This is so bush league. When I canceled my Good Sam extended service contract I had a credit on my AMEX in days. I wouldn't deal with Country Creek if it were the last dealer in the South! THis is a great example of delay and capture the float. I will be surprised if I get the originally calculated $1800 refund. I expect them to re-date the date of my demand and send me less. I've already filed complaint with BBB MS and the Attorney General's office. Lawsuit to follow. More as the world turns. Thank all of you for your comments.
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Old 09-10-2016, 02:46 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockfossilman View Post
IMHO, a "low-end" TTYL should be "low-end" because of lack of bells and whistles - not because of poor workmanship. I owned a Wildwood bunkhouse - it was simple but well-built. Now own a Rockwood - more bells and whistles, but a Frig that freezes our food, a slide out that squeals when deployed, and several workmanship issues that would have cost nothing for Forest River to have done right in the first place.

When I buy a $99 mattress, I don't expect it to feel like or last as long as a $500 mattress, but I do expect the covering to be sewn on and the springs to be inside.
Well Said.......If I bought a Chevy Cruze I would want the doors to latch when I close them or the light switch to work when I need them ETC.......
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