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Old 07-11-2015, 11:06 PM   #1
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Considering a 23IKS - Got Questions

First, I want to say how awesome this forum is. Especially anything written by RooVader! It is forums like this that have helped me to decide on other purchases - not the whiney forums, but the forums where real people share real experiences, great ideas and get help on real problems. Very cool.

Should we decide to purchase a hybrid (most likely a Roo) it would be our first trailer of any type since our Coleman pop-up of 25 years ago. Just my wife and I now though I expect if we get one there will be grandkids in it at some point. And friends and whomever.

We were considering maybe getting a trailer in the next year or so. Then it became a hybrid once we were convinced we wouldn't drown in it and if large furry things were rummaging around outside we could just fold everything up and sleep on the dinette.

Next step was to settle on a brand to focus on. After some online research and a visit to Nolan's RV near Denver today we are definitely leaning towards a Rockwood. It certainly seems like they do a lot of things well in their design and manufacturing (though I realize nothing is perfect). Do you all agree?

Next, I thought we would settle on a 21SS. (BTW, I will be pulling it with a Land Rover LR4 with a 7700lbs towing capacity.) But after we looked that over, just for grins, we checked out the 23IKS. Based on the 2D floor plan diagrams I thought I wouldn't be interested. But there is nothing like seeing the "space" in person. My wife immediately took to the IKS (and we're not even big cooking people). She liked that it had more storage space than the 21SS. And she actually liked the island in the middle.

OK. So that has led to a bunch of questions (and even considering pulling the trigger this year should we find what we like for what we want to pay with time enough to use it in September and even earlier.)

Here are the questions. Ready, fire, aim.
- Why is the 23IKS only about $1500-$1700 more expensive than the 21SS when it is 2' longer and has more storage and 2 slide outs and an island? Is the ISK less popular than the 21SS?
- The sales person said the 23SS is the least popular of the Roos. Really? Is this because they don't have any in stock? Or is it an older model?
- I noticed on the 23IKS that the kitchen slide out cuts into the useable "living" (recreating) space under the awning. Is that a nuisance for you IKS owners?
- Similarly, the outdoor grill support thing is shorter and is around on the side of the pitch slide out. Seems like that would be an inconvenience.
- The sales guy said that there will be a new batch of 2016s coming out in Aug/Sep that will no longer have the air mattress sofa as people have found it difficult to use and they are reverting to the jackknife style. Anyone hear anything on this? I kind of like the arms on the current air mattress option and to be honest we would very rarely use it as a bed.
- The sales guy claimed there is no "seasoning" required to avoid leakage.
- Any insight on what may be coming in the 2017 models? Any good reasons to wait? We would only get a couple of months use (2-3 trips in this year.)
- I saw a warped door on one of the wardrobes. The sales person said it was just needed adjustment but it certainly looked warped to me. It wouldn't latch at the bottom.
- How much more difficult is it so tow a trailer that is 2' longer? Also, the IKS is about 500lbs heavier than the 21SS though they have the same GVW which in both cases is about 6500. My towing max is 7700. OK? (I will be pulling it through the Colorado mountains but probably without or with very little water in it as we would fill up when we near our destination.)
- Any other considerations for the 23IKS? Any reasons that we should consider a different floorpan? A different maker?

Thanks in advance!
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Old 07-12-2015, 12:12 AM   #2
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The sales guy claimed there is no "seasoning" required to avoid leakage.
When is your salesman lying? When his lips are moving!!

Quote:
How much more difficult is it so tow a trailer that is 2' longer?
I went from a Roo 19 to a Mini Lite 2503S. I don't notice too much difference towing. Backing up is a bit harder, though.
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Old 07-12-2015, 12:17 AM   #3
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Considering a 23IKS - Got Questions

I can't speak specifically to the ikss because I don't own it but there are many times I wish I did. Then again I am a professional second guesser that likes to torture myself with what ifs.

I honestly thought the ikss was more like 3k more expensive but I confess I didn't look into it very closely. I was sort of on a mission to get the smallest camper I could reasonably live with. Looking back I am not even sure why. I think the 2-3 feet and 500 pounds is really more of a psychological barrier than any sort of practical disadvantage. I am sort of a living psychological barrier so it kept me from stepping up to the larger size but after using my 21dk a lot I have never seen a situation where the extra 2 feet would have been a problem. That extra space inside would be sweet as I clearly have a mission in life and that mission is only to camp when it is raining.

Speaking of rain...and your salesman...oye. Strong with the force, he is not. Season that thing with purpose.

If this forum is a representative slice of roo nation I would dare say the ikss people, or ickies as I call them, or would if I actually called them anything, are far and away the biggest and most popular group. The dk (which I have on good authority stands for dark knight) is a pretty strong presence but those wacky ickies are everywhere. No way is it unpopular. It is such a cool floor plan but I still can't figure out how they deal with that slide under the awning. I live under the awning like vampire hiding from the sun. I am sure the interior makes up for it but that would drive me batty. Hey...vampire to batty...see how I did that?

So yeah I should have gotten the ikss. Most days. Well, except when I am in the bathroom cuz I need room to move in there I tell ya. Actually now that I mention it, I spend almost as much time battling away in there as I do under the awning. Sigh...probably a good thing I ended up with my dark knight edition roo, if only for the loo.

2017 models are like a lifetime or so away...or next May, whichever comes first. Don't wait for potential changes. Waiting is hard and why would you want to do anything the hard way?

So in summary, thank you for reminding me why I like my little dk, but for everyone not named me I say totally go all in on icky. It is crazy popular for a reason. Remember to season.

If you like canvas, and let's be honest all the cool kids do, run out and buy that bad boy. Islands rock.
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Old 07-12-2015, 07:28 AM   #4
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We started out looking at buying the 21ss, lots of floor space. We ended up with the 23ss, much more counter space and a lot more storage. It was a done deal when I asked the dealer how much more and it was less than 300 bucks difference. It's just the two of us usually, so there's plenty of space even when raining.
The 23ss maybe less popular now that the ikss is out, but it's still a nice floorplan, just one that's been out awhile.
I don't think you can go wrong with any of them, if that's what you're looking for.
I also don't think there's a big difference in towing the additional weight and 2 feet. All 3 are big sails being towed behind your vehicle.
Good luck with your decision!
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Old 07-12-2015, 07:31 AM   #5
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Considering a 23IKS - Got Questions

We live our ikss and wouldn't change it. It is a little heavy though - by the time my wife packs it to the gills, my 6.2L half ton tows it with ease but does have to struggle just a bit when climbing hills (we live in mountains). Something to consider if TV is not a truck.

As for slide out under awning, it does take away a little but still plenty of room. Click image for larger version

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By the way - these pics are from camping right now. If there is anything else you'd like to see let me know.


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Old 07-12-2015, 08:07 AM   #6
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Sales people are so strange. I believe like most here they will tell you whatever they need to just to get whatever is on the lot off the lot. No need for seasoning? I'm thinking hes never owned one, Since the tag sewn on it tells you how to do it. The flip side to his "Story" about the 21 and 23SS models would be the fact that have been FR's bread and butter since about maybe '06 (Probably wrong on the date). They are the top selling units and have been for sometime. Not taking anything away from the IKSS, Its awesome and its for sure hot at the moment, Had we not got the deal we got on the 23 we would have owned one. Judging from how much trouble we had finding a 23SS that wasn't already spoken for, either they cut back production because they are not selling or someone wants to sell a ikss. One place had a 3 month waiting list on the 23ss. And one wouldn't commit to a date. I do know for sure out of the 6 or 7 dealers we visited, Everyone of them had a different story and different ideas on which one was better and why. They are all cool and they all have pro's and con's. Whatever floor plan works for you it will be awesome and you will enjoy every minute in it! And IMO, Why wait? If you have decided find your best deal and go start enjoying. Salesman..... UUGH!
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Old 07-12-2015, 08:55 AM   #7
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I have always wondered, can you guys still tilt the awning in the ikss? I feel like I am always in need of tilting mine lower and locking it for better shade.

It does look like decent coverage even with the slide.

You are right...I was browsing around out of curiosity and the ikss is only about 1500 more. Sheesh, seems like it should be more expensive given the extra slide.

There is one phrase i have never heard in the years I have been around this forum and that is "wow, I wish I had just a few less feet of room".
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Old 07-12-2015, 12:14 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhroo View Post
Here are the questions. Ready, fire, aim.
- Why is the 23IKS only about $1500-$1700 more expensive than the 21SS when it is 2' longer and has more storage and 2 slide outs and an island? Is the ISK less popular than the 21SS?
no, it's just that the 23IKSS is the new hot Roo/Shamrock hybrid.
- The sales person said the 23SS is the least popular of the Roos. Really? Is this because they don't have any in stock? Or is it an older model?
as was said, the 23SS and 21SS has been around since 2005/2006 and have been the most popular floorplans until the 233S came out and then the 23IKSS came out.
- I noticed on the 23IKS that the kitchen slide out cuts into the useable "living" (recreating) space under the awning. Is that a nuisance for you IKS owners?
- Similarly, the outdoor grill support thing is shorter and is around on the side of the pitch slide out. Seems like that would be an inconvenience.
- The sales guy said that there will be a new batch of 2016s coming out in Aug/Sep that will no longer have the air mattress sofa as people have found it difficult to use and they are reverting to the jackknife style. Anyone hear anything on this? I kind of like the arms on the current air mattress option and to be honest we would very rarely use it as a bed.
- The sales guy claimed there is no "seasoning" required to avoid leakage.
obviously, this guy knows nothing about hybrids OR popups, both needing seasoning for the canvas. find a different salesperson who actually knows something about the product. most RV salespeople know very little about RV's or actually own one.
- Any insight on what may be coming in the 2017 models? Any good reasons to wait? We would only get a couple of months use (2-3 trips in this year.)
RV manufacturers can make changes mid-model year so there's no telling what's coming in the new year until some of them start trickling in.
- I saw a warped door on one of the wardrobes. The sales person said it was just needed adjustment but it certainly looked warped to me. It wouldn't latch at the bottom.
one of our wardrobe door, latches in two places. when it only latches on one, it can look warped.
- How much more difficult is it so tow a trailer that is 2' longer? Also, the IKS is about 500lbs heavier than the 21SS though they have the same GVW which in both cases is about 6500. My towing max is 7700. OK? (I will be pulling it through the Colorado mountains but probably without or with very little water in it as we would fill up when we near our destination.)
your biggest issue will be your vehicle's payload capacity and its extremely short wheelbase. i also believe that they discourage using a WDH with your vehicle. you need to check the payload capacity on hte driver's door sticker and research using a WDH. i'd recommend a Hensley or ProPride WDH for that vehicle.
- Any other considerations for the 23IKS? Any reasons that we should consider a different floorpan? A different maker?

Thanks in advance!
personally, i wouldn't tow any HTT/TT with a vehicle that the manufacturer discourages using a WDH. Honda is the same way. that's why we scratched the Ridgeline off of our list.

if their vehicle can't handle the stresses due to a WDH(usually due to unibody construction), it's not a good choice for a tow vehicle.
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Old 07-12-2015, 02:06 PM   #9
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IKSS owner here. For us, it is the perfect floor plan. When we camp there are at least four of us plus the dog, but we've had as many as eight sleeping in it before and it worked out just fine. The amount of interior room is what sold us. Small package to tow, but when you get to camp and open the bunks and deploy the two slides it is huge. Yes, it does cut into the awning space slightly, but the interior room was our priority. There is still enough room under the awning for four chairs and the awning can be tilted side to side or lowered as needed.
The grill attaches to a swinging arm on the back bumper. Once connected it can swing under the back bunk to keep it out of the rain, or swing out when you are ready to cook. The bracket on the side of the camper can be used for the black shelf which is the perfect place to hold your food, cold beverage and BBQ tools. I like the setup.
We've used the air bed a lot and have had no trouble. It is quick to setup and inflate, is comfortable for sleeping, and holds the air well. I know some have had bad luck with it but ours has been great.
The best advice I can offer is to visit as many dealers and walk through as many floor plans as possible. Roos and Shamrocks are the same campers with different decals and interior colors, so see if there is a Shamrock dealer nearby. The more you are able to see, the easier your decision will be. You may also want to go to an RV show - great way to see a lot of models at once. The shows are usually in late winter. Good luck in your search.



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Old 07-12-2015, 04:03 PM   #10
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Considering a 23IKS - Got Questions

Awning has a decent tilt to it to start, but you are restricted. Mine right now is a tad low (resting on the slide out). I'll adjust in a bit - doesn't hurt it but I pull it up more if there is wind so it's not slapping against it. Grill is in this pic as well.Click image for larger version

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PS - be careful of the RV shows. I went "just to look" and I came home with this.


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